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Old 12-14-2018, 06:39 AM   #81
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"The first thing they should teach is that going $150K+ into debt to get a job that pays $20K a year is not smart math."


Could it be? New Math is back?
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Old 12-14-2018, 07:08 AM   #82
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You got any actual facts to back that up? My kids are millenials and neither they or anyone they know fall into that classification. Same with the kids of all our friends of our generation.
Same here. All four out of the house at 18 and fully self-supporting and successful.
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:19 AM   #83
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I have two millenials in my house: myself and my girlfriend. Our house is our boat - it's great. As for hard working, we've done at least twice as much work on our boat as anybody else in our marina.
I love these threads, they crack me up - so many generalizations!

The one thing everybody seems to agree on is that college is too expensive.
I actually disagree. Sure, you can pay $50k per year and go to Duke, or you can pay $10k and go to an in-state school for a similar product. $10k is an incredible deal. You receive an amazing service by a group of well-trained professionals for 8 months out of the year. Compare that to boat expenses... Besides, if you're hardworking, you can make well over $10k in a summer to cover tuition and living. Maybe you need to take out $10k or $20k before you graduate; for what you receive I don't think that's unreasonable.

The problem I see is that both parents and society in general overlook the true value received and say, 'sure, go to Duke - great school'. 1 year at Duke is the same as full degree at a state school. Is it 4X better? No. I know this because I did grad school there and undergrad at a state school. In-fact, I think you learn more at a state school because you're less pampered. As a high schooler, you have no concept for what $10k and $50k even means. I think this is what really needs to be fixed.
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:57 AM   #84
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Anyone that think Millennials aren't buying and using boats clearly need to get on YouTube. There are likely hundreds of YouTube channels of you boaters doing video blogs. All trying to become famous like The Wynns, La Vagabond, or SV Delos.
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Old 12-14-2018, 09:25 AM   #85
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If your comment includes the construction industry - nearly all of those skilled trades there have been taken by illegals---especially in housing. In NYC area even the unionized skilled construction workers are illegals. I read an article recently that the entire Reinforcing workers have been taken over by illegals from the Dominguan Republic and that the few American workers left have been advised by their bosses (who are illegals) that they must learn Spanish or they will not be sent to jobs.
We are in NY - we do not see this.
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Old 12-14-2018, 09:47 AM   #86
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Granted, there ARE a large number of skilled trades in the construction industry but there are a vastly greater number of laborers that need no skills other than the ability to put on a hard hat. I doubt too many illegals can be classed as skilled.


I am quite willing to be corrected if you could please link to the article you mentioned. I am also unaware of the trade you describe as "Reinforcing workers" I would also appreciate THAT job description. Thanks
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:16 AM   #87
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The first thing they should teach is that going $150K+ into debt to get a job that pays $20K a year is not smart math.
Wifey B: If college and majors was only about smart math, you'd never have any teachers. I got a bachelor's, master's and doctorate to start a career as a first year teacher. Lousy financial, but very worth it and rewarding.
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:26 AM   #88
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Only about a fifth of the people can afford a self-sufficient lifestyle and Millennials are a fraction of that.


Here's this post again:

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These are the numbers for tax year 2017 at the ssa.gov (Social Security Administration ) website:

https://www.ssa.gov/cgi-bin/netcomp.cgi?year=2017

It shows roughly half of the people have earnings. That chart is not real easy to find and I have never heard it mentioned in the propaganda services.


Here is a take on what it cost to live a self-sufficient lifestyle in 2017:


https://pj.news.chass.ncsu.edu/2017/07/31/how-much-is-enough-the-self-sufficiency-standard-calculates-the-true-cost-of-meeting-basic-needs/
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:29 AM   #89
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Some of the problem with college debt has to do with the majors selected by some students. Someone going to an Ivy League school for many years to get a Master's or Doctorate in Medieval English Literature may be following their bliss, but the return on that investment is going to be a long time coming. Students selecting areas of study really should do their due diligence before they start to make sure that the expected career earnings of their desired course of study is worth the cost of the education required to enter that career.

The first thing they should teach is that going $150K+ into debt to get a job that pays $20K a year is not smart math.
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:40 AM   #90
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Only about a fifth of the people can afford a self-sufficient lifestyle and Millennials are a fraction of that.


Here's this post again:
Take into account the number of wage earners in a household, education levels and other demographic factors.Here's a pretty good article on the subject.

Explaining US income inequality by household demographics, 2016 edition - AEI
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:50 AM   #91
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Granted, there ARE a large number of skilled trades in the construction industry but there are a vastly greater number of laborers that need no skills other than the ability to put on a hard hat. I doubt too many illegals can be classed as skilled.


I am quite willing to be corrected if you could please link to the article you mentioned. I am also unaware of the trade you describe as "Reinforcing workers" I would also appreciate THAT job description. Thanks
You'd be surprised how many are skilled in various trades, and how entrepreneurial they are in developing small businesses (and as a result, yes, paying various taxes!). My daughter, a millennial (who loves boating BTW), is an immigration attorney for a firm that primarily serves corporations, institutions and professionals. In other words, people who want to do things "right". People are waiting 20 years to get a green card processed for instance. There is so much bigoted and tinfoil hat disinformation about immigration it is mind boggling.
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Old 12-14-2018, 11:00 AM   #92
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Take into account the number of wage earners in a household, education levels and other demographic factors.Here's a pretty good article on the subject.

Explaining US income inequality by household demographics, 2016 edition - AEI
The single parent household income is telling.

Daniel Patrick Moynihan called it in 1967 in “The Negro Family: A Case For Action”. Destruction of the traditional family structure through well intenioned and sincere, but shortsided, welfare policies was mostly a black problem then, but it affects every race now. We should have listened.

It’s probably too late, now.
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Old 12-14-2018, 12:22 PM   #93
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Wifey B: If college and majors was only about smart math, you'd never have any teachers. I got a bachelor's, master's and doctorate to start a career as a first year teacher. Lousy financial, but very worth it and rewarding.
This statement is more of a reflection of the state of the education system in the US. In other countries educators are a much higher status class than in the US.
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Old 12-14-2018, 12:43 PM   #94
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Our southern California YC is experiencing a significant increase in younger members, including some actual boat-owning millennials.
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Old 12-14-2018, 02:52 PM   #95
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Our southern California YC is experiencing a significant increase in younger members, including some actual boat-owning millennials.
So has our Chattanooga sailing club—for two reasons. We built a new clubhouse that’s party- and family-friendly. We also have a very active sail camp that prepares kids for a lifetime sport. Pulling in the kids also attracts their parents. As a result, we have lots of very active members from Millenials to Generation Old F**t.
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Old 12-14-2018, 03:32 PM   #96
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Folks, please? We’re talking about why millennials are not buying boats. Posts may be deleted if they are off course. Thanks in advance.
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Old 12-14-2018, 03:40 PM   #97
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Greetings,
Mr. LM. I deleted my post. You are correct, of course. Sorry, I panicked...


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Old 12-14-2018, 06:12 PM   #98
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Coming back to the topic I think it's wrongheaded to blame customers (millennials) for preferring short term, sharing economy options. My parents bought Chevy's and Fords with V8’s in them. My friends and I bought 4 banger Honda's and Toyotas because they were cheaper to own, more reliable and burned less fuel. Was that Gen-X's fault? Nope, just the entrance of more and arguably better options in the automobile market in the 70’s and 80’s.

So why blame an entire generation for expecting easy, convenient and low cost services and products when they can summon a driver on their phone to take them across town for $14 avoiding the expense of actually owning, repairing and insuring (not to mention driving) a car or they can order a new iPhone battery booster based on scanning globally crowd-sourced product reviews for a price they like on Amazon and have it delivered for free later that same day or stream “Die Hard” (the best Christmas movie ever btw) on demand, on a tablet, from a beach?

These options exist and are successful because they disrupted market models that stopped innovating. So many industries have fast forwarded to these newer, Netflix, AirBnB or Uber, models. The ones that haven’t - have been left behind or are holding on through regulation, financial instruments or contracts (cable and cellular companies anyone?). Even Chevy and Ford are seeing themselves as personal transportation companies instead of car manufactures and they are using technology to differentiate themselves from one another.

Yet many industries, such as boating, remain stuck in the 70s, heck maybe the 60s. When we bought our boat I was stunned at how old-school and proprietary the entire discovery, conversion and purchase process was as a buyer. Starting with YW and some really terrible, YW powered, broker websites, to the process of setting an appointment to view a boat (catch them on the phone only because most brokers aren’t responding to email or YW forms or voicemail) to making an offer, lining up surveys, insurance and documentation every single step was multiple calls, repeating data, often with incomplete information or the need to follow up again and lot’s of paper or faxes. Seriously? Just trying to find a fax option in this day and age was super fun - hint get the phone app. In the end I felt like the only two parties actually invested in managing the process were me and the seller. I’m looking around thinking what do we need all of you clowns for and why am I filling out my address on a paper form for the umpteenth time?

Now I know there are good brokers. I know there are better experiences but putting that aside for a moment - the customer experience of purchasing a boat is just plain terrible; off-putting, slow and hard. That is not the customer’s (millennial’s) fault - it’s the industry’s fault.

Attract new customers by offering better purchasing options. Make the process easier. Remove the friction. Grow community through YCs and Mfg Clubs and onboard newer customers through low barrier educational programs. Design Mfg led charter options, bundle the purchasing processes and a million other things. In effect - do something to appeal to these new-fangled, early-stage buyers and then deliver lifelong value to move them up and keep them in boating for as long as possible.
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:24 PM   #99
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The reason why there’s such a pilot shortage
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Old 12-15-2018, 10:40 AM   #100
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And, the hell of it is, there have never been more good, used, and reasonably priced, powerboats and sailboats on the market, than right now.
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