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Old 02-25-2018, 11:32 AM   #61
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Isn't the value assigned by surveyors for insurance purposes rather than sales pricing?
Depends on purpose of survey. If survey for purchase, then should be sales pricing. If for insurance, then insurance value. However, they should be the same so makes no difference. The problem is that surveyors may or may not be knowledgeable enough to give good pricing. They are surveyors, not appraisers. Surveyors don't give values on homes. Appraisers do.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:33 AM   #62
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Keep in mind the Ďfairí rating, survey value and defect list will become a topic with an insurer if your seeking agreed value hull insurance.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:37 AM   #63
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Something does not look right. The zinc in that photo has no way been in the water for a few months. Maybe a week. No growth, no wastage. If owner/broker stated that it has been in the water for a few months since last haul, something is BS. Unless a diver just replaced the zinc.

That corrosion pattern is something I have not seen before.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:43 AM   #64
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Isn't the value assigned by surveyors for insurance purposes rather than sales pricing?
Perhaps...but this survey valuation isnít the only data we have for a reference point. We have the survey we had done on the other boat. We also have a copy of the survey those owners had done when they bought the boat. THAT survey goes into great detail about how they arrived at the fair market value price including all the boat valuation guides, sold boat data, condition adjustments, etc. That is very useful information.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:47 AM   #65
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Something does not look right. The zinc in that photo has no way been in the water for a few months. Maybe a week. No growth, no wastage. If owner/broker stated that it has been in the water for a few months since last haul, something is BS. Unless a diver just replaced the zinc.

That corrosion pattern is something I have not seen before.
I think a diver did replace it recently.
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Old 02-25-2018, 11:47 AM   #66
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Something does not look right. The zinc in that photo has no way been in the water for a few months. Maybe a week. No growth, no wastage. If owner/broker stated that it has been in the water for a few months since last haul, something is BS. Unless a diver just replaced the zinc.

That corrosion pattern is something I have not seen before.
And the bronze prop nuts look like they have been subject to stray current corrosion.
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Old 02-25-2018, 12:06 PM   #67
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Old 02-25-2018, 12:29 PM   #68
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That is not electrolysis. It is stray current corrosion and can happen within days and sometimes even hours. You must find and correct the source of the stray current or it will occur again..

PS When they reinstall the props, tell them to put the jam nut in the correct position this time.
Aside from my speculation I suspect Boatpoker is dead on. Both the shaft and the prop affected? A marine electrician versed in electrolysis/corrosion issues should be brought in. Some checking should be able to be done while the boat is out of the water for the rest of the work.
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Old 02-25-2018, 01:19 PM   #69
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Aside from my speculation I suspect Boatpoker is dead on. Both the shaft and the prop affected? A marine electrician versed in electrolysis/corrosion issues should be brought in. Some checking should be able to be done while the boat is out of the water for the rest of the work.
Yes, finding the source is pretty imperative.
I hope everybody else agrees (the owner and the yard).
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Old 02-25-2018, 03:11 PM   #70
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Aside from my speculation I suspect Boatpoker is dead on. Both the shaft and the prop affected? A marine electrician versed in electrolysis/corrosion issues should be brought in. Some checking should be able to be done while the boat is out of the water for the rest of the work.

Agree! Heed Boatpokerís warning on this one. Heís a surveyor, BTW.
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Old 02-25-2018, 03:12 PM   #71
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After reading all posts in this thread, I decided that my knowledge of boat corrosion was insufficient. I spent a few hours reading many texts in the internet. My training in Chemical Engineering gave me a good basis to understand even the most technical of the papers, though the electric part of the processes are enormously confusing. I now understand much better why my latest boat would waste the pier side zinc anodes much faster than the opposite side. The boat was in front of my house, and I also noticed that the poor-quality Ss ribbons that tied the floating elements of my dock went kaput in no time.

Armed with what I digested today, I must say that the corrosion experienced in your boat is very likely caused by stray currents from shore, and/or eventually from other boats in the vicinity. If that could be demonstrated to be the case, always a question mark, then the simple act of taking the boat away from its current mooring will interrupt the process.

Some of the information on the net are pretty anecdotal, but there are quite a few that explain in layman's terms and seem to contain useful information. Here is one:

Corrosion in Marinas - Boats and Yachts Maintenance and Troubleshooting
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Old 02-25-2018, 03:48 PM   #72
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After reading all posts in this thread, I decided that my knowledge of boat corrosion was insufficient. I spent a few hours reading many texts in the internet. My training in Chemical Engineering gave me a good basis to understand even the most technical of the papers, though the electric part of the processes are enormously confusing. I now understand much better why my latest boat would waste the pier side zinc anodes much faster than the opposite side. The boat was in front of my house, and I also noticed that the poor-quality Ss ribbons that tied the floating elements of my dock went kaput in no time.

Armed with what I digested today, I must say that the corrosion experienced in your boat is very likely caused by stray currents from shore, and/or eventually from other boats in the vicinity. If that could be demonstrated to be the case, always a question mark, then the simple act of taking the boat away from its current mooring will interrupt the process.

Some of the information on the net are pretty anecdotal, but there are quite a few that explain in layman's terms and seem to contain useful information. Here is one:

Corrosion in Marinas - Boats and Yachts Maintenance and Troubleshooting
I think finding out from his surveyor whether this issue existed when he surveyed it or not would give us a good indicator of where to look for the source.
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Old 02-25-2018, 04:01 PM   #73
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We just went through a similar process. Survey came back with a fix list and a fair market value. We called the broker and re-offered the survey value....the sellers accepted. I the end we paid about 35% less than the listing and everyone was happy. We accept the needed repairs they sold their boat.

It's worth what it's worth in the end. If the sellers want more they need to remediate to improve the value or adjust their expectations of the market. Tough stuff for both sides.
Itís awesome for you that it worked out like that.


Hubby and I both agree that the valuation is low. The valuation is based on its current condition. If the corrosion issue were fixed and corroded parts replaced, it would increase the value some.

There are a few other things that were found that we didnít know about when we made the offer and some we are willing to simply accept, and some we feel are negotiable items that bring the value down a little from what we offered.

David will be talking to the seller sometime this afternoon and we will see what we can work out.
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Old 02-25-2018, 06:05 PM   #74
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Depends on purpose of survey. If survey for purchase, then should be sales pricing. If for insurance, then insurance value. However, they should be the same so makes no difference. The problem is that surveyors may or may not be knowledgeable enough to give good pricing. They are surveyors, not appraisers. Surveyors don't give values on homes. Appraisers do.


Iím afraid thatís just not true. Many marine surveyors are in fact certified appraisers for marine craft. The certification is given by the American Society of Appraisers (ASA) and requires lengthy training and examination. It is a pre-requisite of being allowed to testify in court to the valuation of a thing. It requires a specified procedure to be followed to reach a conclusion of valuation. It is not simply checking Sold Boat or looking it up on BUC guide.

ASA also has disciplines in Art, Jewelry, Real Estate, Rugs, Heavy Machinery etc. If it can be financed, it can be appraised.

I have found that most of the ASA Marine appraisers are members of NAMSGLOBAL although an increasing number of SAMS certified surveyors also have ASA certification. If you need to rely on an appraisal in the buying process, you should look for a surveyor that also is certified by ASA which should be stated on their credentials.
I presume everybody here checks the surveyors credentials, right?
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Old 02-25-2018, 07:06 PM   #75
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Good news!
We’ve come to an agreement with the seller.
Obviously it’s still contingent on a successful sea trial and completion of all the work agreed upon but given how the boat performed on the ride to the yard and the performance data the seller gave us, we don’t expect any issues there.
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Old 02-25-2018, 07:25 PM   #76
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Yikes? Maybe it was a hot harbor.
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Old 02-25-2018, 07:38 PM   #77
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Iím afraid thatís just not true. Many marine surveyors are in fact certified appraisers for marine craft. The certification is given by the American Society of Appraisers (ASA) and requires lengthy training and examination. It is a pre-requisite of being allowed to testify in court to the valuation of a thing. It requires a specified procedure to be followed to reach a conclusion of valuation. It is not simply checking Sold Boat or looking it up on BUC guide.

ASA also has disciplines in Art, Jewelry, Real Estate, Rugs, Heavy Machinery etc. If it can be financed, it can be appraised.

I have found that most of the ASA Marine appraisers are members of NAMSGLOBAL although an increasing number of SAMS certified surveyors also have ASA certification. If you need to rely on an appraisal in the buying process, you should look for a surveyor that also is certified by ASA which should be stated on their credentials.
I presume everybody here checks the surveyors credentials, right?
Those that are certified appraisers, appraise. This one was a surveyor, did not appraise, simply used a BUC value. I'm not saying the certified appraisers or even some who are not certified aren't capable of a valuation. I'm saying most surveyors are not and pulling a BUC value is definitely not an appraisal. It would only be one tool an appraiser would use.
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Old 02-25-2018, 07:40 PM   #78
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:08 PM   #79
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Good news!
Weíve come to an agreement with the seller.
Obviously itís still contingent on a successful sea trial and completion of all the work agreed upon but given how the boat performed on the ride to the yard and the performance data the seller gave us, we donít expect any issues there.


Great news!
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:10 PM   #80
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Good news!
Weíve come to an agreement with the seller.
Obviously itís still contingent on a successful sea trial and completion of all the work agreed upon but given how the boat performed on the ride to the yard and the performance data the seller gave us, we donít expect any issues there.
Good for you and congratulations! After you close don't hold your breath on learning the secret TF handshake or getting a decoder ring. It's been a year for me and I haven't gotten squat.
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