Wanted - Airhead Composting Head

[ssobol]

Do some more research on this old wive's tale. Urine is not sterile, not even close. Pouring it down the sink where you brush teeth, clean face, etc.?

Hey, if you want to wash where you pee (effectively) that's your business. I'd be more concerned what you're dumping overboard. Human urine contains all sorts of things that are not good for the environment. Even if the urine was sterile (which it is not), the amount of ammonia it can contains is bad for the wildlife in the water.

On of the contributing factors in reef decline is the urine from all the people who snorkel and dive on them.

 

[woodscrew]

ksanders Not challenging your right to post your opinion on things you prefer and know about. I have and like an Airhead composter .(Read the second post on this thread- been living aboard full time for 5 months.) Here's why- no hoses, holding tanks, seacocks,y-valves, macerators, pumps, odors or pump outs. Electric draw in milliamps. Six weeks or more between emptying. Pumping out my other seawater holding tank is much more smelly and "gross". I replaced every hose and the complete Raritan pump on that toilet and look forward to doing it all again at some point in the future. I can't imagine what could break or wear out on the Airhead.You may be right about de-valuing a boat but it can't be by much. I ripped out a poorly installed (and therefore) horribly stinky Vacuflush system system when I bought this boat in favor of the wonderfully simple Airhead. To each his own.

 

[ksanders]

ksanders Not challenging your right to post your opinion on things you prefer and know about. I have and like an Airhead composter .(Read the second post on this thread- been living aboard full time for 5 months.) Here's why- no hoses, holding tanks, seacocks,y-valves, macerators, pumps, odors or pump outs. Electric draw in milliamps. Six weeks or more between emptying. Pumping out my other seawater holding tank is much more smelly and "gross". I replaced every hose and the complete Raritan pump on that toilet and look forward to doing it all again at some point in the future. I can't imagine what could break or wear out on the Airhead.You may be right about de-valuing a boat but it can't be by much. I ripped out a poorly installed (and therefore) horribly stinky Vacuflush system system when I bought this boat in favor of the wonderfully simple Airhead. To each his own.

Hmmm...

I will have to admit to a strong preferance to systems onboard the boat that “feel” close to land based life, but learning is interesting.

So, does it smell?
When you open the lid, is there poop visible like in a outhouse?
What do you do with the waste when it needs to be emptied.

 

[FF]

One joy of a composting head is a local looey or hooligan navy onboard inspection takes under 30 seconds.

 

[woodscrew]

No smell at all, even (as the Airhead manual calls it) when making a deposit. There is a vent hose that exits the hull and has a small exhaust fan in it that runs 24/7 and draws air through a 2" screened intake hole in the toilet. When "making a deposit" you flip a small lever to open a 6" square trap door that allows the deposit to drop into the peat filled storage chamber. When done you close the trap door and give the agitator handle a few turns to bury the deposit. All the during that process the air is being drawn in through the trap door, so zero smell. Unless you look while the door is open no visible poop. After about six weeks, the top half of the head comes apart from the storage chamber. Empty the surprisingly non smelly contents into a contractors size trash bag and into the dumpster along side all the dog poop everybody else throws in there. Refill with the cocoa brick you have pre-soaked the night before and good to go for another six weeks or more.

 

[friz]

If anyone has an Airhead Composting Head in good condition that you are looking to get rid of please let me know. We want to replace our fully functioning Jabsco electric head with a composting head.

Thanks!!

So after 36 posts to your question have you been offered a used Airhead? Curious as to price. As a result of your question I have learned a bit more about composting/desiccating heads Thanks!

 

[firstbase]

Not sure which is worse (to me)...shipping and/or receiving a used toilet or pee in my bathroom sink....Elimination is just not a pretty game.

 

[Gmarr]

Not sure which is worse (to me)...shipping and/or receiving a used toilet or pee in my bathroom sink....Elimination is just not a pretty game.

Same reason why I won’t own a cat...

 

[FF]

"So after 36 posts to your question have you been offered a used Airhead? Curious as to price."

He was offered a used Natures Head ,,,,, Price 1/2 of new.plus shipping .

Most US folks wipe after defecating , a toilet , even a plastic one can be washed.

 

[ksanders]

No smell at all, even (as the Airhead manual calls it) when making a deposit. There is a vent hose that exits the hull and has a small exhaust fan in it that runs 24/7 and draws air through a 2" screened intake hole in the toilet. When "making a deposit" you flip a small lever to open a 6" square trap door that allows the deposit to drop into the peat filled storage chamber. When done you close the trap door and give the agitator handle a few turns to bury the deposit. All the during that process the air is being drawn in through the trap door, so zero smell. Unless you look while the door is open no visible poop. After about six weeks, the top half of the head comes apart from the storage chamber. Empty the surprisingly non smelly contents into a contractors size trash bag and into the dumpster along side all the dog poop everybody else throws in there. Refill with the cocoa brick you have pre-soaked the night before and good to go for another six weeks or more.

Thanks!

Question though...

Here it is illegal to throw human waste in a dumster. It is not allowed in our landfills as it is considered Hazmat. (Yes I understand the dog poop argument)

How do you Legaly get rid of the poop?

I can see how some would say “just throw it in the dumpster” but the same argument could be made to macerate your waste tank illegally.

 

[MurrayM]

In BC there are no marinas with pump out stations that I know of. Due to the nature of our waterways, we're allowed to flush directly or pump out holding tanks mid channel on outgoing tides. Dumping "offshore" in my context would mean a 140 mile round trip.

We seal the used stuff in containers and keep them in the lazarette, then when on our way somewhere we'll slow down to idle and toss it out mid channel. Makes much less of a dramatic effect on the waters surface (sinks pretty quick) than a Humpback whale pooping as it dives!

What are the rules for baby/adult diaper disposal in household garbage?

 

[MurrayM]

Quick Google search concerning baby diapers:

The EPA said, "Disposable diapers fall under the category of municipal solid waste, which means the material is safe to be disposed of in a U.S. municipal solid waste landfill." What’s more: "Modern landfills are well-engineered facilities that are located, designed, operated, and monitored to ensure compliance with federal regulations, which aim to protect the environment from contaminants, which may be present in the solid waste stream."

Alrighty then. But I live in California, which sometimes has more stringent standards than the rest of the country. For example, my town has excellent recycling. We even have compost pick-up! So, I called the California Department of Resources Recycling and Recovery to get a more local response.

Their spokesperson, Amy Norris, told me that, indeed, a landfill is a place for non-hazardous waste -- but "the contents of a diaper are considered solid waste, not hazardous or medical waste." Plus, since diaper bags are mixed in with a lot of other trash when it’s part of residential pickup, there’s "not a concentration of a huge amount of human waste at any time."

 

[dhays]

In BC there are no marinas with pump out stations that I know of. Due to the nature of our waterways, we're allowed to flush directly or pump out holding tanks mid channel on outgoing tides. Dumping "offshore" in my context would mean a 140 mile round trip.

We seal the used stuff in containers and keep them in the lazarette, then when on our way somewhere we'll slow down to idle and toss it out mid channel. Makes much less of a dramatic effect on the waters surface (sinks pretty quick) than a Humpback whale pooping as it dives!

Probably not many pump-outs up your way, but here is a list of pump-out facilities in BC. http://www.marinepumpouts.com/mpo_canada_ps.php?id=1 I used the one in Ganges a few weeks ago.

Once again this last summer, I tried to find the current Canadian regulations for marine sewage. I really had a hard time locating it. The best I could do was find an article by Canadian Yachting back about 6 years when the current rules were going into effect.

http://www.canadianyachting.ca/diy/maintenance/1388-guide-to-sewage-discharge-regs

A point made in the article pertinent to this discussion was this;

“Transport Canada has ruled that porta-potties and composting toilets can qualify as "temporary storage devices" as long as the vessel is less than 15 gross tons and carries fewer than 15 people. And they may not be emptied overboard.”

So if this article is accurate in its characterization of the regulations, it isn’t OK to dump the contents from a composting head overboard in Canadian waters.

 

[MurrayM]

Porta Poties are full of nasty chemicals, so very different.

Will research desiccating toilets later today.

 

[ksanders]

Hmmm

So what is the advantage then, other than more waste capacity?

You are throwing your waste overboard.

Others push a button and pump their waste overboard.

I do not see the difference.

On our boat All of the human waste is treated by a USCG approved marine treatment system that uses no chemicals and renders the effluent stream safe and invisible.

That is in my opinion an advantage.

 

[MurrayM]

Less through hulls, less complexity, less maintenance, no electricity, and no failures at inopportune times.

 

[ksanders]

Less through hulls, less complexity, less maintenance, no electricity, and no failures at inopportune times.

OK, I suppose that is viable.

I will admit that there is a learning curve to maintaining a regular “flush” marine sanitation system, even more so with installations that involve a treatment system.

Thanks!!!

 

[MurrayM]

OK, I suppose that is viable.

I will admit that there is a learning curve to maintaining a regular “flush” marine sanitation system, even more so with installations that involve a treatment system.

Thanks!!!

No worries. There are many paths to happy boating

 

[cardude01]

I’m always amazed at the strong opinions against these desiccating heads. I installed a Nature’s Head on my boat a few months ago and so far it has done what I wanted it to do. I wanted a simple system that didn’t smell, and that I didn’t have to work on, and that my wife would operate without fussing. She hated the old Jabsco manual pump toilet, and we both hated the smell of our traditional marine plumbing (old hoses, leaking valves, etc). I also hated the process of pumping out. So, instead of replacing the (to me) complicated expensive and gross traditional marine black water system of hoses, tanks, multiple valves, pumps, etc., I decided to tear out all the old and go this simpler route.

There is nothing more simple IMO than one of these heads, but it does take getting used to. If you are heavy beer drinkers the urine side fills up fast, so if you have a party type boat it’s probably not the best. For our boat, where it’s usually just me and my wife, it works out perfectly. And amazingly, when you open it up to dump after a month or so, it just doesn’t smell. I use coco coir.

The Gone With The Wynn’s website has a good review of the NH with videos. They had one on their RV and now on their Sailboat. One interesting thing they did was leave one standard marine head to handle urine if they had a big group on board or for just flushing urine overboard when offshore, so that’s an option for some here with dual heads. Just convert one to a desiccating head.

So anyway, FWIW from a user of one of these “composting” heads, if your expectations are aligned with how this head is designed to be used it seems to work pretty well! Conversely, if you are happy with a traditional marine system I see no reason to switch.

 

[foreverunderway]

Y'all may want to do some research before installing composting toilets these days. It seems the tide is changing on these things.
"Subject: Annapolis Harbor Disallows Composting Head Use for Long Term Stays
Posted by: Kathy Barth on 9/8/2018 at 10:30 AM
View/reply online Reply via email to: General@sscaforum.org Reply via email to: Kathy Barth (kathybarth@hotmail.com)
I spent an hour or so with Beth Bellas, Annapolis Harbormaster, Thursday. Lots of good information which I'll write up for a longer article, but here's the official statement.

Boats with composting heads are welcome in City Waters. They may transit through, stay at private or public docks for as long as they like People with composting heads may not stay in City waters ON ANCHOR OR ON A MOORING longer than one (1) week. Composting heads are not designed for uninterrupted use, and when users dispose of the solids in our public trash cans, this creates a public health concern. Users are also tempted to dump urine overboard, in violation of state and local laws and ordinances.

IMHO, as long as we have a specified policy, our Clean Wake obligation is to follow the local policy. I looked into the manufacturers specs a bit and I did see a reference that they were not recommended for uninterrupted use as there isn't sufficient time (typically) for solid waste to compost in that scenario. I have found none of them to be Coast Guard approved so far, so we will want to keep an eye on the use of these in other waters as time goes by.
It could be a costly mistake to convert, only to find a lot of municipalities disallow them.

 

[Andiamo2018]

Can water be added to an Airhead of Natures head? I ask because, um, I like to do a little rinse after. (If you had poop on your arm would you just rub it with a tissue and call it good?)

I like the MSD (electrosan type) after the holding tank option. Seems like the best of both worlds. We were ready to install a composting head but our marina doesn't allow them. Now that I have wonderful warm water on a hose just waiting there next to the head I don't think I'll go back.

Ksanders! I really like that you seem open to why folks want these air heads! For me it is hardest to listen when I feel strongly about something. A great example of respecting different opinions - thank you!

I just read that most of the cities and towns in the bay area have multiple 'spills' every year. By volume those spills are far greater than if every person on every boat poop over board at the same time. Somehow one tide cycle after a big spill the water is okay again. I suspect that spill oil and pollution runoff are a much bigger long term concern than some pee down the drain.

 

[dhays]

Can water be added to an Airhead of Natures head? I ask because, um, I like to do a little rinse after. (If you had poop on your arm would you just rub it with a tissue and call it good?)

I like the MSD (electrosan type) after the holding tank option. Seems like the best of both worlds. We were ready to install a composting head but our marina doesn't allow them. Now that I have wonderful warm water on a hose just waiting there next to the head I don't think I'll go back.

Ksanders! I really like that you seem open to why folks want these air heads! For me it is hardest to listen when I feel strongly about something. A great example of respecting different opinions - thank you!

I just read that most of the cities and towns in the bay area have multiple 'spills' every year. By volume those spills are far greater than if every person on every boat poop over board at the same time. Somehow one tide cycle after a big spill the water is okay again. I suspect that spill oil and pollution runoff are a much bigger long term concern than some pee down the drain.

I don’t think you would want to add liquid at all to a composting/desiccating head. I think a composting head could be a great idea for the right use in the right boat. BTW, WA Parks has installed a few solar powered composting toilets in remote locations in the parks.

I also like the idea of a treatment system and would have installed on my boat. Unfortunately, despite rational arguments to the contrary, the EPA declared all of Puget Sound a NDZ making those treatment systems illegal to use as intended. I wouldn’t have minded if very sensitive harbors were declared an NDZ, because a hold and treat system would still be useful and practical. So, I’ll be continuing to use a traditional holding tank.

Despite my natural penchant for obeying the law, I will continue to have no problem with my conscience by peeing over the side, with or without a cup. No, urine is NOT sterile. Yes, it does add to the nitrate load of a body of water. No, I don’t think it impacts Puget Sound water quality in any meaningful way, even if every man, woman, and child on the water did likewise.

Your observation about metropolitan sewage spills is not a new one. It is a constant problem here in the Puget Sound. Those spills dwarf the entire head output of all the recreational boats in the Salish Sea which is dutifully held and then pumped out into those municipal sewage systems.

Edit: I also was struck by Kevin’s willingness to be open to different ideas even though they are initially so unpleasant to his sensibilities.

 

[Carl Martin]

Personally we're fans of the C-Head and they actually do come with the fittings for a fan. The good news is that because they are more ventilated a fan is usually not needed. The C-head is also much easier to empty, sits lower & will fit spaces that others will not due not only to the different designs offered but the fact that you mix from the top instead of the side. Plus they're very well made & you can even get them in teak or mahogany finish. And to top it off they cost a lot less. Win win for us!

 

[Carl Martin]

Y'all may want to do some research before installing composting toilets these days. It seems the tide is changing on these things.
"Subject: Annapolis Harbor Disallows Composting Head Use for Long Term Stays
Posted by: Kathy Barth on 9/8/2018 at 10:30 AM
View/reply online Reply via email to: General@sscaforum.org Reply via email to: Kathy Barth (kathybarth@hotmail.com)
I spent an hour or so with Beth Bellas, Annapolis Harbormaster, Thursday. Lots of good information which I'll write up for a longer article, but here's the official statement.

Boats with composting heads are welcome in City Waters. They may transit through, stay at private or public docks for as long as they like People with composting heads may not stay in City waters ON ANCHOR OR ON A MOORING longer than one (1) week. Composting heads are not designed for uninterrupted use, and when users dispose of the solids in our public trash cans, this creates a public health concern. Users are also tempted to dump urine overboard, in violation of state and local laws and ordinances.

IMHO, as long as we have a specified policy, our Clean Wake obligation is to follow the local policy. I looked into the manufacturers specs a bit and I did see a reference that they were not recommended for uninterrupted use as there isn't sufficient time (typically) for solid waste to compost in that scenario. I have found none of them to be Coast Guard approved so far, so we will want to keep an eye on the use of these in other waters as time goes by.
It could be a costly mistake to convert, only to find a lot of municipalities disallow them.

The poop police are at it again. Absolutely ridiculous!

 

[foreverunderway]

I just read that most of the cities and towns in the bay area have multiple 'spills' every year. By volume those spills are far greater than if every person on every boat poop over board at the same time. Somehow one tide cycle after a big spill the water is okay again. I suspect that spill oil and pollution runoff are a much bigger long term concern than some pee down the drain.

Right around the time I bought my first big liveaboard boat (1969) in the Bay area, we on the yachts became the pollution be all and catch all of the waterways, even though factories and the farming industries upriver were polluting the rivers with some very serious toxins.
The CG and local LEO's came around hassling us as though our tiny contribution to the soiling of the Bay's waters was a truly serious thing. Without a political lobby, we were the scapegoats and it soon became a big thing to try and close down the houseboats in Sausalito.
Fast forward to the Las Olas Isles in Ft Lauderdale in the 90's and the city was sending cops to board and test boats for waste infractions even if the owners were not aboard! A hard line to the city sewers was the proposed solution by the administration while raw sewage was visibly pouring into the canals from the broken pipes under the Isles streets!
None of the regulations regarding vessel pollution have any basis in reality compared to the pollution amounts the waterside municipalities dump into the water. We are just the scapegoats so the municipal leaders can shout about how much they are doing to combat pollution, at no cost to the taxpayers!
You gotta love it!

 

[SeaBreeze]

So after 40 posts I have not been contacted by anyone who wants to sell their composting head. Guess that says a lot about them. Those who have them like them.

 

[foreverunderway]

So after 40 posts I have not been contacted by anyone who wants to sell their composting head. Guess that says a lot about them. Those who have them like them.

Rather shoddy science as I'm not sure that the majority of the posts are by owners of composting heads.
Also, I'm guessing timing is everything, in this case, like in most, as my wife has told me of three 'ladies who sail' cruisers who have thrown their composting heads in the trash over the last year. You just weren't in the right place at the right time, unfortunately. lol