Transit to Key West Advice

[DonW28]

There is a good chance we will finally be taking our 2006 34T Mainship from NC to Key West. Looking for route recommendations (East versus West) once we get to south Florida. Probably looking at June/July time frame for weather if that helps in the recommendation. We prefer to slow cruise (7Kts) but can run 12 if the sea condition and route dictate. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.


Don

 

[caltexflanc]

Don, search around the forum a little; we just had a thread on this very subject.

 

[DavidM]

I have done the east coast route several times as well as a few from SW Florida but never crossed the Okeechobee.

The easiest would be to follow the ICW down to Miami but go outside if you can whenever the weather is suitable and the in and out distance isn't too bad. Particularly go outside between W Palm and Miami to avoid the bridges.

Then you can either go inside the keys or outside in the Hawk Channel entering south of Key Biscayne. I have done the inside once, but prefer the outside as you don't have to follow markers rigorously. If you do the inside cross over to the outside at Marathon and go outside he rest of the way to KW.

For the western route go across the Okeechobee at Stuart then down to Marco Island which will be your jumping off spot. You can make it in one long day particularly in June if you leave at the crack of dawn and sail straight for the NW channel entrance at G1 into Key West.

Either way works and it really depends on what part of Florida you want to see on the way down.

David

 

[cardude01]

I have done the east coast route several times as well as a few from SW Florida but never crossed the Okeechobee.

The easiest would be to follow the ICW down to Miami but go outside if you can whenever the weather is suitable and the in and out distance isn't too bad. Particularly go outside between W Palm and Miami to avoid the bridges.

Then you can either go inside the keys or outside in the Hawk Channel entering south of Key Biscayne. I have done the inside once, but prefer the outside as you don't have to follow markers rigorously. If you do the inside cross over to the outside at Marathon and go outside he rest of the way to KW.

For the western route go across the Okeechobee at Stuart then down to Marco Island which will be your jumping off spot. You can make it in one long day particularly in June if you leave at the crack of dawn and sail straight for the NW channel entrance at G1 into Key West.

Either way works and it really depends on what part of Florida you want to see on the way down.

David

I did the west coast route and crossed over to KW from Shark River. I thought the anchorage at Shark River was pretty cool. Super buggy in the summer in the evening, but still interesting. We explored around on the dinghy when there and it was little spooky. We were the only boat there. This was a few years ago.

 

[Captmike55]

I usually go “inside” from Miami to Marathon. Beneteau Swift trawler 44 draft 4ft. Keep to the channel, I find it smoother and more picturesque

 

[motion30]

You can go from North Carolina all the way to Marathon key on the inside. Then there is a short day hop from Marathon offshore , Hawks channel to Key West

 

[DonW28]

I have been told the bridges are the real pain to the east coast route. Starting to sound like staying east might be more interesting other than the bridges. And we can always bypass them outside if it is calm. That is the way I handle Georgia. Don

 

[DavidM]

I have been told the bridges are the real pain to the east coast route. Starting to sound like staying east might be more interesting other than the bridges. And we can always bypass them outside if it is calm. That is the way I handle Georgia. Don

As I said above, the stretch from Lake Worth Inlet to Miami is the worst due to lots of bridges and restricted openings. I have always gone outside to avoid that mess.

Other outside stretches like Georgia are to save time.

David

 

[TBill36]

If you go OWW be aware that the bridge height indicators mark the height at the center of the arch of the bridge unlike on most the ICW where you have an additional 4 ft or so since they mark the lowest part of the bridge (at least where I live). Maybe everyone knows this, but I found out the hard way when my outriggers hit without any damage. The indicators are a different color so maybe that's why.

 

[psneeld]

Unless clearly posted I have found that you can't trust much of any info on the center clearance or navigable clearance. Leave enough fudge factor to clear. Unfortunately many bridge tenders will not give info.



The bridges south of Lake Worth are a pain...but depending on mast height eases it some and if you can make 7 knots, many are timed opening so maintaining speed or traveling with the pack wasn't as bad as I had heard.

 

[Woodland Hills]

It’s not the job of the bridge tender to tell a captain if he is safe to proceed.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. WH. Indeed it is NOT the job of the bridge tender to offer navigation advice BUT one might expect them to confirm the accuracy of the height boards. Yes/no?

 

[Cigatoo]

It’s not the job of the bridge tender to tell a captain if he is safe to proceed.

But they do.......After having several bridges opened for me on the west coast of Fl I had a bridge tender refuse to open for me. He stated over the radio that “those charters go through all of the time without needing an opening”. I took his word for it. I had splintered fiberglass all over the boat. Thankfully the radar mast didn’t hit. I just kept going and spent the next day in Venice replacing the VHF antenna. Still a great trip lol.

 

[slowgoesit]

But they do.......After having several bridges opened for me on the west coast of Fl I had a bridge tender refuse to open for me. He stated over the radio that “those charters go through all of the time without needing an opening”. I took his word for it. I had splintered fiberglass all over the boat. Thankfully the radar mast didn’t hit. I just kept going and spent the next day in Venice replacing the VHF antenna. Still a great trip lol.

Had a friend on a Hatteras have a similar situation. Requested that bridge open, bridge tender stated that he wouldn't open, as the boat would clear, but wouldn't give him the exact clearance. Mark stated (I am paraphrasing) on the VHF:
"So for the record, we are requesting that you open, you refuse and are stating for the record that you guarantee we will clear and agree to accept financial responsibility on your behalf, and on the behalf of your employers, for any damage that may occur, correct? Please advise, and be aware that this conversation is recorded."

Tender didn't respond, but bridge began to open shortly after that . . . And just for the record, Mark said that it didn't appear that he WOULD have cleared, given the state of the tide . . .

 

[psneeld]

I agree a bridge tender doesn't need to give a captain vessel safety info...as he/she doesn't have a job automation couldn't do and does most of it anyway.


But it's someones job to either keep a tide board on the bridge, keep it readable, post a center clearance height if a good idea to keep from unnecessary opening, or put a phone number up that gets you to someone with answers.


And if they don't and the passage is questionable....then they need not to argue with the captain when the actual clearance is in question.


I don't expect a safety brief as a captain...but someone or something should be able to tell me the exact clearance without threatening a $10,000 fine.

 

[Group9]

I did the Okeechobee one time. It's not bad, but I always found going around throughs the Keys to be a lot more fun and interesting. With less than 5' of draft, you can do the inside ICW down to Marathon and then you take Hawk Channel. There is a good stop at New Found Harbor where you can anchor if you don't want to make it in one day from Marathon to Key West.

 

[TBill36]

It’s not the job of the bridge tender to tell a captain if he is safe to proceed.

Unless clearly posted I have found that you can't trust much of any info on the center clearance or navigable clearance. Leave enough fudge factor to clear. Unfortunately many bridge tenders will not give info.

My intention was not to lay blame on any involve, but to point out that ICW bridge clearance placards reference minimum clearance and
OWW references maximum clearance. As mentioned they are different colors, so maybe that signifies one versus the other. Maybe inland is different and usually references max. Does anyone know.

 

[psneeld]

What I was saying is.... at least along the AICW.... there is sooo much bridge marking inconsistency and lack of proper boards and signage that you almost can't trust anything unless it is absolutely, clearly posted and backed up by a lot of posted info on the net and nautical pubs.

 

[motion30]

I have been told the bridges are the real pain to the east coast route. Starting to sound like staying east might be more interesting other than the bridges. And we can always bypass them outside if it is calm. That is the way I handle Georgia. Don

what is your address? There's a lot of bridges you will be able to pass through without opening

 

[DonW28]

I did the Okeechobee one time. It's not bad, but I always found going around throughs the Keys to be a lot more fun and interesting. With less than 5' of draft, you can do the inside ICW down to Marathon and then you take Hawk Channel. There is a good stop at New Found Harbor where you can anchor if you don't want to make it in one day from Marathon to Key West.

I think we are going east. It does sound more fun and interesting. And the draft isn't that high on a 34 Mainship so many of the bridges might not even matter. Plus-when you are retired and cruising what is the hurry.



Don

 

[Keysdisease]

If a bridge tender were to provide that data it may make him liable for any issues, even if the data he supplied was accurate. Its a litigious world

Greetings,
Mr. WH. Indeed it is NOT the job of the bridge tender to offer navigation advice BUT one might expect them to confirm the accuracy of the height boards. Yes/no?

 

[psneeld]

then why put tide boards on if not accurate (enough)?


if not, then why have a**hole tenders bitch and threaten when you are within feet of the published height and there is all this uncertainty?


most of the time, all I am asking is to confirm where the tide board is measuring, or
how high is the center compared to nav height. That is simple engineering data.


Actually, I blame the USCG for not holding everyone to a simple standard, including providing permanent, known data if sign info is missing or unreadable.

 

[Group9]

I have found that Active Captain is pretty accurate, like near 100 per cent, on bridge heights. People are quick to point out when posted data is wrong.

The only bridge I can remember where consensus on the height was hard to finally get, were the two bridges over Nassau Harbor, in the Bahamas. You can look at the AC postings for that and see a good example of the peer posting and review in progress.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
I have called and asked tenders how accurate the "boards" are when it may be close. Height to the top of my lightening "rod" is 30' +/- (Maybe 29'6" but I usually round it out to 30') IF the tender asks. He usually quotes "high steel" and as noted, usually at the center.



I also haven't transited the ICW for quite a while but I really don't recall any seriously nasty tenders. The vast majority are quite professional.

 

[psneeld]

I have found that Active Captain is pretty accurate, like near 100 per cent, on bridge heights. People are quick to point out when posted data is wrong.

The only bridge I can remember where consensus on the height was hard to finally get, were the two bridges over Nassau Harbor, in the Bahamas. You can look at the AC postings for that and see a good example of the peer posting and review in progress.

Up and down the AICW, it was more than a half dozen that had conflicting data ad at least a dozen with missing signs when I was going through them.


When Garmin bought Active Captain I stopped using it, but when I was...there were still some with conflicting info and like many boaters input, I would have only trusted a few and even then, without good "current tide" info... some were still too close to call.


Did I manage to not hit any? yes...


Did I have it out with a few tenders? yes...after getting threatened or spoke to poorly.


Did I have to resolve these kinds of issues while an active duty Coastie? yes...I get both sides so I know what can and should be done with markings, standardization and smacking down of impolite employees or supporting them when they are correct and only slightly impolite when the boater is out of control...

 

[friz]

...... Particularly go outside between W Palm and Miami to avoid the bridges..... David

Have never been south of Stuart on the AICW. For my own info, bridges are an issue? What kind of air clearance are we looking at on a trawler? 30' max? Thanks.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. f. It's not so much the clearances, it's the number of bridges. 19, If I remember correctly. That being said, it's worth doing at least once. Some interesting "stuff" along the way.

 

[Group9]

Up and down the AICW, it was more than a half dozen that had conflicting data ad at least a dozen with missing signs when I was going through them.


When Garmin bought Active Captain I stopped using it, but when I was...there were still some with conflicting info and like many boaters input, I would have only trusted a few and even then, without good "current tide" info... some were still too close to call.


Did I manage to not hit any? yes...


Did I have it out with a few tenders? yes...after getting threatened or spoke to poorly.


Did I have to resolve these kinds of issues while an active duty Coastie? yes...I get both sides so I know what can and should be done with markings, standardization and smacking down of impolite employees or supporting them when they are correct and only slightly impolite when the boater is out of control...

When several people say they have taken 64 foot masts under a bridge that has a stated height of 65 feet at low tide, I always felt pretty good about taking my 62 mast under one. But, for really close ones, I always crept up, with the tide working for me, to make sure.

Having met a few bridge tenders, I don't necessarily see them as the definitive source on anything.

And, my current view on Active Captain is about the same as yours under Garmin. Waterway guide is become my new go to.

 

[psneeld]

They SHOULD be able to tell me if there AT LEAST USED to be a sign that said center clearance....and how it related to the tide board....thats info that some town or county worker at one time passed along.


I still have to read the tide board and make my own clearance determination...so unless their engineer/surveyor was incompetent...the liability would still fall on me.


It's not like I am asking "can I make it".... I am only asking for info that should be available on signs or posted.


One small gripe is how some jurisdictions are smart enough to use LARGE numbers on tide boards and others use such small numbers.


With strong tides and a single engine, I am asking for an opening if I can't read the numbers even with binoculars....fines be damned. I think I can justify my case with my background.

 

[Group9]

They SHOULD be able to tell me if there AT LEAST USED to be a sign that said center clearance....and how it related to the tide board....thats info that some town or county worker at one time passed along.


I still have to read the tide board and make my own clearance determination...so unless their engineer/surveyor was incompetent...the liability would still fall on me.


It's not like I am asking "can I make it".... I am only asking for info that should be available on signs or posted.


One small gripe is how some jurisdictions are smart enough to use LARGE numbers on tide boards and others use such small numbers.


With strong tides and a single engine, I am asking for an opening if I can't read the numbers even with binoculars....fines be damned. I think I can justify my case with my background.

I just keep thinking about our local bridge tender where I lived in the eighties, who got drunk, raised the bridge, locked the doors and had to be forcibly removed by the police so that the bridge could be lowered.

And, they didn't fire him for that (although he did get fired a few years later). He was the high school friend of a friend of mine, and I met him a few times. He was different to say the least.

I pity the person that asked him about the height of the bridge and went under it based on that information.