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Old 08-15-2017, 09:33 AM   #21
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As you can see from the posts, there is no
Some suggested they would get too bored.
I'd get bored doing a crossing on a cruise ship, but never on a 40 foot boat when my life dependant on keeping things running sweet.
Think about what you are saying.

If you would NOT get bored, you and/or your boat are not ready to cross an ocean.

Because the first rule is having the boat ready and prepared.

Therefore my main preparation is to make sure i have enough books to read, games to play and videos to watch.

Stress will kill you faster than the ocean.
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:44 AM   #22
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I have seen a Selene 47 (est 2000 model) from Venezuela in Barcelona, presumably there on its own bottom. Selene 47 carries 900 gallons, range about 3,000nm.
I have also seen at least one krogen 42 (??) and a Nordhavn 46 docked in London, also presumably sailed there from USA and Canada.
And, of course there is always the example of Richard on Dauntless (Krogen 42) who has pretty much traversed the globe at this point!! We had the fun of watching him traverse the Panama Miraflores Lock earlier this year.
So, I think it is a practical proposition to cross oceans on 42-47ft single screw vessels (preferably with a secondary back-up wing engine) provided the owner preps the vessel properly, carries adequate spares (and knows the vessel well enough to use them), installs window covers (lexan), and plans weather windows and route carefully.
But it is a long way, at 7kt!! You need a large enough crew to manage the continuous 4-6hr watches 24x7 for 2-3 weeks, depending on route. In my mind, that equates to a minimum of 4 crew, who get on really well!!
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:53 AM   #23
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Probably not, because generally they do not have the range to make a ocean crossing.

If we look at specific models there are actually very few production boats with twin engines in the sub 50' size that have the endurance.

Hatteras 48 LRC comes to mind, but even there I'm iffy on that boats capability for a pacific crossing.
Exactly.
I didn't end up with a Kadey Krogen because I liked the marketing.

I knew nothing when i started my boat education.
Had the data led me to a twin engine, I'd have a twin engine.
As a matter of physics, it's impossible to have two engines that are as efficient as one, at any given horsepower.

In the early days I did look at the Hatteras LRC. But besides the engine issue, it was never clear to me how efficient their hull was. I pegged its range at 2500nm, which is not enough in my mind.

After the fact, arriving in Castletownbere, Ireland, i was struck by how many fishing boats there were that had the exact same lines as the KK42.
From the bow rise, the height of the pilot house roof to the slight stern rise.

In all my travels, travails and follies, I've never had green water come over any part of the cap rail.

The storm windows i installed, 1/2" Lexan, have never been tested. I only left therm in place because they provide great insulation in cold or hot weather.
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:04 AM   #24
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Exactly.
I didn't end up with a Kadey Krogen because I liked the marketing.

I knew nothing when i started my boat education.
Had the data led me to a twin engine, I'd have a twin engine.
As a matter of physics, it's impossible to have two engines that are as efficient as one, at any given horsepower.

In the early days I did look at the Hatteras LRC. But besides the engine issue, it was never clear to me how efficient their hull was. I pegged its range at 2500nm, which is not enough in my mind.

After the fact, arriving in Castletownbere, Ireland, i was struck by how many fishing boats there were that had the exact same lines as the KK42.
From the bow rise, the height of the pilot house roof to the slight stern rise.

In all my travels, travails and follies, I've never had green water come over any part of the cap rail.

The storm windows i installed, 1/2" Lexan, have never been tested. I only left therm in place because they provide great insulation in cold or hot weather.
Richard, as you have shown, the KK42 is a world capable boat, with the right captain.

Something you have also shown is that cruising the world in a power boat does not require a half million (or higher) entry fee to participate.

Just an ordinary guy, with a good boat, and the fortitude to actually do it.
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:06 AM   #25
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I go with the old preppers adage, if you have two you have one, if you have one you have none. Served me well over the years.
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Old 08-15-2017, 02:35 PM   #26
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With folding propellers I would think it would be easy to add an electric motor to drive your shaft via your genset as a get home option.
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Old 08-15-2017, 03:20 PM   #27
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Here's the link for a single engine 53' Selene that's started on the West Coast of the US, did the Eastern Caribbean, South Pacific and are now in SE Asia. They chartered a bunch but but we pretty much newbies when they bought Mystic Moon.

Mystic Moon Voyages - ...Life is Good!
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Old 08-15-2017, 04:00 PM   #28
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I believe the 2004 Atlantic Rally included a 40 foot Nordhavn.
Marty, I believe you are right on that. I just remember they were worry about the little guy having enough fuel for one part of the trip.

In any case. I was a cool video.

Cheers.

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Old 08-15-2017, 04:34 PM   #29
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Over the past 6 years,acquaintances Mark & Jennifer Ullman have put over 40,000 miles on their Nordhavn 46. Two transatlantics, recently 21+ days from Galapagos to Marquesas. Single engine...
Just curious, Do they have to change oil mid trip?
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Old 08-15-2017, 04:44 PM   #30
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I believe the 2004 Atlantic Rally included a 40 foot Nordhavn.
And it most definitely did not all go smoothly. Read the book, then evaluate. Now, they've solved the most frequent problem which was with their stabilizers. But there were many very experienced boaters plus an engineer available. Notice that they haven't repeated this.
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Old 08-15-2017, 05:50 PM   #31
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Our Cummins 6BTA (280HP) was spec'd for up to 250 hours between oil changes. That equates to 1,750nm at 7.5kt. On a continuous non-stop run there would be a need to add oil but not necessarily to change oil/filter. We did run non-stop for 7 days (168 hrs) without an oil change, though we usually changed at shorter intervals because we could and the engine was not running continuously
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Old 08-15-2017, 06:43 PM   #32
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Bigslick, I see that was your first post, Welcome Aboard.

I see Richard on Dauntless has chimed in. There is no one more qualified to comment on single engine ocean crossing than Richard.

He has crossed the Atlantic twice in a single engine 42 Kadey Krogan. He has also done some long passages single handed.

Richard drops breadcrumbs where ever he goes and you can see them here.
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Old 08-15-2017, 07:44 PM   #33
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And it most definitely did not all go smoothly. Read the book, then evaluate. Now, they've solved the most frequent problem which was with their stabilizers. But there were many very experienced boaters plus an engineer available. Notice that they haven't repeated this.
Actually they did just this past spring. The third time I believe - 2004, 2007 and 2017.

http://www.nordhavn.com/news/newslet...l_2017/nap.php
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Old 08-15-2017, 08:15 PM   #34
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And it most definitely did not all go smoothly. Read the book, then evaluate. Now, they've solved the most frequent problem which was with their stabilizers. But there were many very experienced boaters plus an engineer available. Notice that they haven't repeated this.
That book steered me away from Nordhvns.

And it made me very leery of hydraulic stabilizers in general.
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Old 08-15-2017, 08:18 PM   #35
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Was just looking online at some Selene trawlers in 40-50' range that have a 2500 mm range and are advertised as Transatlantic capable. But most of the ones I see are single screw.

There's no way in hell I'd go out into the middle of the ocean with a single engine! I'd be scared to even try with twin diesels.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on that. Would you have to be a master mechanic with every imaginable spare part to even consider that? Or do people do this all the time?
I would add this, Just because the boat is capable doesn't mean the Crew is. Our Selene is a very capable boat, but we have no desire to cross oceans on it. Twenty years in the Navy may have something to do with it, but day after day after day at 6-7 knots is boring no matter how you look at it.

Having cruised her now for over 2 years, put over 1000 hrs and 6000 miles, we like being able to plan our next stop within 12 hours. She is a very capable boat that is safe to operate in "Most conditions" provided the crew is capable.

Relying on others to fill crew slots doesn't work for us. Have met too many folks on Nordies, Selene's, KK and a few other "Ocean Trawlers" and very few actually cross oceans with them. But they almost all agree on feeling safer on these type of boats should the need arise.

My hat goes off to the handful of people who have crossed oceans in a power boat. The preparation needed to accomplish this daunting task doesn't happen overnight. Not only is the boat prepared as best as possible, but the crew is prepared maybe more so. A certain mindset is needed as well as a very good understanding of weather and what its effects can have on the ocean.

Now with regards to crossing an ocean with a boat that has twins, that requires a lot of fuel. Dont know of any manufactured boat with twins 50 ft or less, that is capable of crossing the Atlantic let alone the Pacific. Fuel needed for a long trip takes up a lot space, that's why the single mains are so popular. A small get home engine may give you a bit of confidence, but get in rough seas and try to maintain a course at 2-3 knots is another story.

Ok, Ill get off my soapbox.

Cheers, Crusty
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:03 PM   #36
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Our Cummins 6BTA (280HP) was spec'd for up to 250 hours between oil changes. That equates to 1,750nm at 7.5kt. On a continuous non-stop run there would be a need to add oil but not necessarily to change oil/filter. We did run non-stop for 7 days (168 hrs) without an oil change, though we usually changed at shorter intervals because we could and the engine was not running continuously
Exactly.

Manufacturers spec oil changes based on "normal" use. In 250 hours, that may mean a couple hours use each time. That equates to about 100 cold starts.

Cold starts are the key. That's when most engine wear happens, as well as oil contamination.

Back when dinosaurs roamed the planet, manufacturers used to not treat their customers like idiots. They would explain the range of use and have recommended frequencies based on that use.

BMW may still do that in their cars ghost tell you when it's time to change the oil.
At least in the 90's when they came out with that system, or was pretty much weighted to the amount of time the engine was running and still cold after start up.
If you did short city driving, 20 minutes at a time, you'd be changing the oil every few thousand miles. If you were commuting 200 miles a day, the change frequency was more like 10,000 miles.

Then just like that, the dinosaurs were extinct and were replaced by lawyers. I think it was around 1975.

For the last 20 years it's all lawyers and bean counters, sorry, accountants.

So in answer of the long forgotten question, I do believe I ran that little Ford Lehman 21 days straight this last time.

I did stop the engine the first time in the middle of the North Atlantic so we could go swimming in 14,000 foot deep water.
I'm not sure I'd do that again.

But I'm sure I'll never stop to change the damn oil. That's just cruising for a bruising.
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:05 PM   #37
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Beware, stupid question ahead:
Any example of somebody doing this single? Even if exceptional sailboat race single handed are not uncommon. Even if the speed is not the same, any example of someone that did this in a trawler???

L.
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:18 PM   #38
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Exactly.

Manufacturers spec oil changes based on "normal" use. In 250 hours, that may mean a couple hours use each time. That equates to about 100 cold starts.

Cold starts are the key. That's when most engine wear happens, as well as oil contamination.

Back when dinosaurs roamed the planet, manufacturers used to not treat their customers like idiots. They would explain the range of use and have recommended frequencies based on that use.

BMW may still do that in their cars ghost tell you when it's time to change the oil.
At least in the 90's when they came out with that system, or was pretty much weighted to the amount of time the engine was running and still cold after start up.
If you did short city driving, 20 minutes at a time, you'd be changing the oil every few thousand miles. If you were commuting 200 miles a day, the change frequency was more like 10,000 miles.

Then just like that, the dinosaurs were extinct and were replaced by lawyers. I think it was around 1975.

For the last 20 years it's all lawyers and bean counters, sorry, accountants.

So in answer of the long forgotten question, I do believe I ran that little Ford Lehman 21 days straight this last time.

I did stop the engine the first time in the middle of the North Atlantic so we could go swimming in 14,000 foot deep water.
I'm not sure I'd do that again.

But I'm sure I'll never stop to change the damn oil. That's just cruising for a bruising.
My car has a recommended oil change of 30000km or 2 years. 30000km would mean more 300h at the legal speed limit here or a bit less if you have an heavy foot and its normal cruise rpm is twice the one of my boat. Even if it is not comparable, and I have no experience in ocean crossing, one thing I am quite sure is that changing oil would not be my main concern while out of nowhere mid way. Never heard about major engine failure because oil was change at 150h instead of 100h, especially when the engine is constantly running at optimal temp and rpm.

L.
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:54 PM   #39
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Actually they did just this past spring. The third time I believe - 2004, 2007 and 2017.

NAP
Let me correct. Never another one of that magnitude nor boats as small as 40' to my knowledge. 5 boats this year.
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:55 PM   #40
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That book steered me away from Nordhvns.

And it made me very leery of hydraulic stabilizers in general.
Well, I think lessons were learned but it certainly would have scared me from trying to cross in an under 50' Nordhavn.

As to hydraulic stabilizers, Nordhavn just didn't yet have their act together.
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