Talk me out of a GB.

[Iknowimcrazy]

After making the decision 6 months ago to transition from a land lubber to a full time cruiser; my Pro/Con list, requirements and needs and wants point to a post '88 GB Europa 36'. There are many checks on my "Pro" list for this vessel. I need some more checks in the "Con" column.

 

[bayview]

Unless you plan to cross oceans there are no cons I canthink of. Individual boat condition can have many cons.

I personally don't like the limited salon space caused by the design but they sure are pretty.

 

[SCOTTEDAVIS]

Ok, I'll play along.

Get a RV instead, easier to dock and ya don't need to pick out the perfect anchor that will be approved by some and faulted by others. Where running aground means changing a tire.

 

[Boydster]

We love our old GB but there are a couple of features we're not crazy about. The seating in our boat is not the most comfortable, the upholstery is top quality but the cushion height and seatbake rake is not conducive to getting comfortable. Not in love with the bowling alley layout either and the feeling that you're always sitting in the "kitchen". If and when we buy another boat it'll either be a galley down model or possibly a pilothouse. The next boat will hopefully feature a bit less exterior wood as maintenance is a never-ending chore in the PNW. High on our list for the future are Tolly and OA. That being said, there is much to love about a Grand Banks, you won't be going too far wrong with your decision! - Boyd

 

[Iknowimcrazy]

Unless you plan to cross oceans there are no cons I canthink of. Individual boat condition can have many cons.

I personally don't like the limited salon space caused by the design but they sure are pretty.

No ocean crossings. I've done a few Trans-Atlantic's on cruise ships. I wouldn't want to experience it in anything less than 300' and a 24 hour buffet.

 

[Nomad Willy]

I think they are quite heavy so if you lean toward lightness and fuel efficiency that could be a "con".

I've heard they are a "wet boat" referring to water coming over the bow but this may be a feature of the earlier "classic" line of boats.

If I have it right the Europa boats have wide side decks that consume huge quantities of deck space and a very large/heavy cabin roof. Lots of people love this type but if it were me I'd be strongly inclined to the classic GB. And I think the classic boats look better too.

 

[Boydster]

"I've heard they are a "wet boat" referring to water coming over the bow but this may be a feature of the earlier "classic" line of boats."
Confirmed ;-)

 

[Iknowimcrazy]

We love our old GB but there are a couple of features we're not crazy about. The seating in our boat is not the most comfortable, the upholstery is top quality but the cushion height and seatbake rake is not conducive to getting comfortable. Not in love with the bowling alley layout either and the feeling that you're always sitting in the "kitchen". If and when we buy another boat it'll either be a galley down model or possibly a pilothouse. The next boat will hopefully feature a bit less exterior wood as maintenance is a never-ending chore in the PNW. High on our list for the future are Tolly and OA. That being said, there is much to love about a Grand Banks, you won't be going too far wrong with your decision! - Boyd

Thanks. The up galley, steps away from the lower helm appeals to me. I'll be alone and the idea of that easy access combined with an auto-pilot means I can make a sandwich and navigate at the same time.
I went to your website. There is a remarkably similar boat to that one on your homepage that is currently for sale. The beige canvas is rare.

 

[Boydster]

Thanks, the site is a couple of years out of date due to a hard drive meltdown, I'm currently rebuilding it and updating. Should have the new one up and running in a month or so. - Boyd

 

[hollywood8118]

After making the decision 6 months ago to transition from a land lubber to a full time cruiser; my Pro/Con list, requirements and needs and wants point to a post '88 GB Europa 36'. There are many checks on my "Pro" list for this vessel. I need some more checks in the "Con" column.

You have to either LOVE to do varnish.. or not be bothered to pay to have it done.. we loved the GB36 we had .. but she sure liked to have her teak rubbed on a regular basis.

GB's are great boats.. all boats are "wet" if you run them in rough enough conditions.

HOLLYWOOD

 

[Pau Hana]

I'll have to agree about the salon layout. We went onboard a friend's 49 GB yesterday- they are also full time liveaboards.

Pros:

• Excellent aft cabin space
• excellent forwad cabin spaces
• stand up engine room
• engine accessibility
• wide walkarounds

Cons:

• Built in furniture
• Up galley
• Settee and galley invade into entertainment space in salon
• wide walkaround eats into cabin space

The down galley makes the boat feel much more spacious.

Overall, every boat will have its idiosyncrasies- this is just my opinion.

 

[FlyWright]

If you like teak decks, it's not a negative. They're just not my cup of tea due to maintenance requirements and leak probability.

 

[hmason]

We are on our 2nd GB. First was a 36 classic, current is a 46 Europa. This gives us a total of 18 years of GB ownership.

Is it a wet boat? The 36 was wet, the 46 is dry. Difference to my mind is that the 46 has spray rails on the bow, the 36 did not. Spray rails are after market and make a great addition. Many 42's did come with spray rails.

Yes, GB's are narrower inside because of the walk around side decks. We do a lot of cruising and live aboard. We love the fact that the decks are safe to move around in a seaway. High bulwarks and sturdy handrails are a huge safety factor. This is something we would never give up.

A classic vs. a Europa is a matter of personal choice. The classic gives you a great aft cabin, and privacy from the guest cabin. The Europa has less separation between the master berth and the guest cabin. The master is forward on the Europa and captures a breeze when the hatch above the berth is opened.

The classic gives you no means of being outside and getting out of the sun unless you are indoors or under a bimini on the fly bridge. The classic had us entertaining on the fly bridge and involved much up and down to the galley. The Europa has great outdoor living space with shade from the sun on the aft deck. Entertaining on the Europa allows you to be outside, in the shade, with easy access to the galley.

Both are great boats, it's a matter of your lifestyle and personal choice. They both tend to hold their value pretty well. Maintaining the bright work is part of owning a GB, not my favorite part, but nothing is perfect.

Good luck, Howard

 

[alberto]

I agree with all comments,

Just to add the sensitivity to rolling, very in particular when mooring.
I have Magma stabilizers for that purpose, very efficient.

Also the deck under rain water does not rinse adequately. You need to ballast the transom if you want to correct.

Look to the aging of Fuel and water tanks. Ok with fuel ones after 30 years,
but I am in the process of removing water ones

 

[Iknowimcrazy]

We are on our 2nd GB. First was a 36 classic, current is a 46 Europa. This gives us a total of 18 years of GB ownership.

Is it a wet boat? The 36 was wet, the 46 is dry. Difference to my mind is that the 46 has spray rails on the bow, the 36 did not. Spray rails are after market and make a great addition. Many 42's did come with spray rails.

Yes, GB's are narrower inside because of the walk around side decks. We do a lot of cruising and live aboard. We love the fact that the decks are safe to move around in a seaway. High bulwarks and sturdy handrails are a huge safety factor. This is something we would never give up.

A classic vs. a Europa is a matter of personal choice. The classic gives you a great aft cabin, and privacy from the guest cabin. The Europa has less separation between the master berth and the guest cabin. The master is forward on the Europa and captures a breeze when the hatch above the berth is opened.

The classic gives you no means of being outside and getting out of the sun unless you are indoors or under a bimini on the fly bridge. The classic had us entertaining on the fly bridge and involved much up and down to the galley. The Europa has great outdoor living space with shade from the sun on the aft deck. Entertaining on the Europa allows you to be outside, in the shade, with easy access to the galley.

Both are great boats, it's a matter of your lifestyle and personal choice. They both tend to hold their value pretty well. Maintaining the bright work is part of owning a GB, not my favorite part, but nothing is perfect.

Good luck, Howard

Thanks. The wide walkways really appeal to me. I'll be alone most of the time, except for an old arthritic dog, and he can no longer throw a life ring.

 

[hmason]

Fyi, we have two dogs aboard and they chase each other around the decks like doing laps. Couldn't do that without full walk around decks.

 

[Jeffrey S]

I'm currently in Annapolis at the Great Banks rendezvous for the Chesapeake. There are about 25 boats here - all models. I think they are well-made, sturdy boats that keep their value. If you find a layout that works for your lifestyle, a GB would be a fine way to go.

 

[High Wire]

I like the Europa but the Admiral said no way because what we learned from the GB 32:
The ladder climb to the FB and,
The noise from waves keeps her awake with the master in the bow. Can't have a grumpy Admiral.

 

[markpierce]

No ocean crossings. I've done a few Trans-Atlantic's on cruise ships. I wouldn't want to experience it in anything less than 300' and a 24 hour buffet.

In the Tsar's dining room on the NCL Jewel's maiden voyage (transatlantic):

 

[Nomad Willy]

Alberto,
No problem w an aged engine?

mason,
Our Willard has no spray rails second chines or other devices to reduce spray but is a very dry boat. Suspect it has a lot to do w our 6.15 knot speed .. or what ever you call it.

 

[DavidM]

Well, I agree- you are crazy.

You like the layout, teak trim and decks is ok with you, you understand the issues with an older boat, you like the quality, you like the cache. There are no cons.

If anything the 36 may be too small for a full time live aboard. Depends on how long are your elbows. Consider the 42.

But buy a GB.

David

 

[Dawdler]

On the subject of "wet boats"--agree that the GB hull take a lot of spray. The other issue is rain. Our former GB's were classic style, and there are many advantages to that design. However, I found that if it's raining and blowing, water is coming into the salon every time you open the door. A really nice feature of a covered after deck EU is that one can enter the salon in wet weather without bringing the rain in too. Add that to your "pros" list....

 

[hmason]

It's interesting to note that we prefer the ladder to the FB. On the classic, if the boat rolls suddenly while you are on the way down, you could go overboard as you are facing the port rail and are well above it. With the ladder, the effect of a roll is lessened as you are at the stern section of the boat and if you do lose balance, odds are you will land in the cockpit not in the drink.

We have never been troubled by wave noise although you do here the chain at times.

 

[Marin]

We've owned our GB36 for over 16 years now. In our experience and observation GBs are very high maintenance boats. Not mechanically, but aesthetically. They have a rainforest of external teak trim to keep up unless you get a late 90s or later model that was ordered with mostly stainless rails, or find an older boat on which a previous owner has replaced the rails with stainless.

If you like working on wood, as I do, then it's fine.

The older the teak deck gets the more maintenance it will need because the seams will start needing replacing or repair. Not a hard job but a long one, and if you don't do it yourself, a very expensive one. And if you don't keep after the seams and plugs you'll start to get leaks though the main and flying bridge decks into the interior of the boat. Unless you get a very recent GB that was made after they started gluing the deck planks down instead of screwing them down.

On the plus side there is an excellent GB owners forum with a lot of very experienced GB owners, including ex-shipwrights and yard owners, to provide advice and guidance on virtually every aspect of these boats.

But if you aren't going to keep it in a boathouse, a GB, particularly an older one, is a never-ending maintenance job thanks to the weather, whether you do it yourself or hire the work out.

I rarely recommend a GB to people asking about what kind of boat to get, partly because of the upkeep issue and partly because of the wet-boat and rough-water ride issues. In any kind of a windy, choppy condition, about as much water comes onto the boat as goes under it.

Well, not really. But we have a five mile run every time we go out or come home across an often windy, choppy bay, and even on nice, sunny days we frequently have the wipers going all the way across and the decks are running with water the whole way.

Some people don't like the GB's ride in rough water. Like most semi-planing hulls, the GB's hull has a snap-back roll, as opposed to the gentler roll of a boat with a more rounded bottom. We don't mind it but some GB owners do.

The advice I always give people who are contemplating buying a GB is charter one before buying one. The boat has a deservedly good reputation, but it has enough drawbacks and quirks to make it worthwhile for a potential buyer to live with one for a week or two to see if the hype truly lives up to the reality in terms of what they want in a boat.

Some people find that it does, some people find that it doesn't. But better, I think, to find out before one plunks down a bunch of money for a boat they then discover is not really what they had in mind in terms of a cruising boat.

In my opinion a GB is too small on the inside for a liveaboard unless one gets a big one; 46, 48, 49, or 52 feet. Of course this is totally subjective; some people have no problem living on a 28 or 30 foot sailboat.

 

[kelbylinn]

We have owned our 1981 42 GB classic for 4+ years now. Love the wide walkways and don't mind the galley main salon layout. Bright work is ongoing but not difficult if maintained on a regular basis with exception of deck. We have never had a wet boat issue except for when we were caught out in bad weather. Boat did fine though. Unless we hit the lottery and can reach for a Nordhavn we wouldn't change a darn thing. I guess that's love. ?

 

[Daddyo]

GB's are great boats.. all boats are "wet" if you run them in rough enough conditions.

HOLLYWOOD

Not so. It's almost impossible to get spray on the forward windows on our DeFever.

 

[markpierce]

...

But if you aren't going to keep it in a boathouse, a GB, particularly an older one, is a never-ending maintenance job thanks to the weather, whether you do it yourself or hire the work out. ...

There is always something to be fixed on a boat.

 

[Peter B]

We looked and waited until we could get a sedan or Europa style, precisely because of the easy indoor/outdoor access, wide side decks and covered shady cockpit. Maybe it would be worth considering adding the style into the mix, and not just the brand name..?

If you are going to be on your own most of the time, then the aft cabin is largely superfluous, except you will end up dumping a whole lot of 'stuff' in whichever cabin you don't sleep in, and being solo, you would be wise to sleep up front, as you can detect changing conditions, anchor movements, etc much better.

The other downside, I would think, to the tri-cabin style for you is that there would be a tendency to be inside - or very definitely outside, and in the elements. The only shaded place to lounge outside would be up top in the flybridge, where the sun often slants in on you anyway, and again, downstairs is where everything is accessible, including food and drink, and you can keep an eye on everything, as there is no-one else to, which is important. So, predictably, you would spend most time inside. I can confirm on a nice day, the covered cockpit is the place to be at anchor, for sure.
PS. Pic taken after hull 2 pack repaint, and before names etc back on.

 

[drb1025]

For many years I thought the GB42 would be the ideal boat to move up to from a 34 convertible. Safe, economical, and great lines. My wife and I chartered a 42 Europa to find out how ideal it is. It was a great boat except for two things. First, it was very wet. Normal PNW chop resulted in spray over the bow and onto the windshield constantly. Very disappointing and a reason to look elsewhere. Second, every time I sat up in bed, I hit my head. I eventually stopped hitting my head, but it gave me another reason to look elsewhere. My DeFever 46 rarely has spray on the pilothouse windows, almost never. And there is plenty of headroom in the master stateroom. There is a lot to love about GBs, but you should charter one to make sure it is the right boat for you before you buy.

 

[alberto]

No problem at all