Steel boat questions

[ClarkeGillespie]

We have owned a Kadey Krogen and that is the extent of my liveaboard experience. Now we are thinking about jumping in again and have found the Dutch brand Linssen. The big issue for me is that it is a steel boat and I know nothing about steel boats.
Does anyone have any general knowledge about steel boats or specifically about Linssen?
Any input would be appreciated. It might lead me to some answers.

Thanks

Clarke Gillespie

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Welcome aboard.

 

[Delfin]

We have owned a Kadey Krogen and that is the extent of my liveaboard experience. Now we are thinking about jumping in again and have found the Dutch brand Linssen. The big issue for me is that it is a steel boat and I know nothing about steel boats.
Does anyone have any general knowledge about steel boats or specifically about Linssen?
Any input would be appreciated. It might lead me to some answers.

Thanks

Clarke Gillespie

The Dutch fellars know how to build boats, poor quality goes nowhere in Holland, and Linssen has been around for a very long time, building a lot of boats. I looked at their brochure and they seem to take coatings appropriately seriously, which is critical. They don't say how they insulate the vessel after painting, but again, the Dutch boats I have seen insulate it well so you don't have condensation. So, my guess is that if you find one you like, it will be a great boat.

You will hear a lot about how difficult it is to maintain a steel boat from folks who don't own steel boats. While I have learned how to use an airbrush to repair small dings on mine, I have spent a lot less time maintaining Delfin than I have on much smaller fiberglass boats.

 

[BruceK]

markpierce has a steel boat and he loves it. If he doesn`t chime in, send him a PM.

 

[Delfin]

The other thing I noticed from their brochure was that they made a point of mentioning that they radius or fair welds. This is now the best standard for welding, and is really important for the coating to be effective. If the welds are sloppy or not ground smooth, the sandblasting may not prep crevices in the weld resulting in poor paint adhesion, or none at all. An experienced steel builder like Linssen should be able to be trusted to know this, and it seems like they do.

 

[gaston]

Steel for commercial fishing


Fiberglass for pleasure


Wood for a hobbyist



Aluminum if you have a good scene of humor

 

[Lepke]

Steel is the most durable in tough conditions, but does require more attention than FG.

Some years ago, a larger, steel commercial fishing vessel was leaving Newport, Oregon when it lost rudder control near the end of the jetties. The large swells picked up the boat and slammed it stern first against the jetty. The 6" propeller shaft was bent 90° and the rudder ripped away. The boat pounded against the jetty for about a half hour before the CG could get a line to it and tow them in. The only leak was at the shaft where the bend broke the seal. The bottom was dished in some places, but the hull was still straight. The average FG fishing boat would have sunk and a wood boat made into pieces. I got to see it in the yard doing the repair.

 

[North Baltic sea]

Hi,

Here in Europe, Linssen has manufactured steel boats for 70 years and has developed the quality and efficiency of production at its peak. The aftermarket keeps their price better than glass fiber, so I do not believe in problems with the steel structure because they are really covering everything in the construction phase.

Steel on a boat the replacement of Hull zinc at the right time is a critical, otherwise very carefree material. Steel for boats is enough for washing, no need to polisher or wax and re-painting every 10-15 years if you want it to be new, not of course necessary, only if you want ...

What age do you study the Linse boat?

NBs


Video Linssen history and to day...

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

Wow thanks for all the responses.
If I bought one of these boats I’d probably buy new. They are so inexpensive when I compare the price to the typical trawler sold in the US. That’s another of my concerns. Why are they so reasonably priced compared to a Kadey Krogen, American Tug, Nordic Tug?

Clarke Gillespie

 

[North Baltic sea]

Wow thanks for all the responses.
If I bought one of these boats I’d probably buy new. They are so inexpensive when I compare the price to the typical trawler sold in the US. That’s another of my concerns. Why are they so reasonably priced compared to a Kadey Krogen, American Tug, Nordic Tug?

Clarke Gillespie

Serial production, automation, smaller engine, tanks etc. I can assure you I have seen Linssen they are of high quality there is no question about it. On the other hand, I am wondering how NT, AT and Krogen can be so expensive, apparently they are manufactured using the methods of the past time, therefore they have not succeeded in the EU market, although they certainly are of high quality but too expensive vs the boat size.


Exaples 40/42 sedan (aftcabin versio +5000€/$) feet linssen price about 344000€/$ + freigth to US 25000€/$ + I do not know US customs and tax% ?


This series linssen is CE-B certificates off shore(no oceans), US says costal cruising...

Passagemakers articel
https://www.linssenyachts.com/image...nd Sturdy 40.0 Sedan Passagemaker-2018-01.pdf

Video AC version https://youtu.be/P5qyq0Z0W1c


And sedan https://youtu.be/h68moGRRlbg?list=PLagEi3S8zMacMDTM-OvpdAoLdqOhBO1hM

NBs

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. NB. Nice boat and apparently a great price BUT Volvo engine(s). Nope. Not for me, not even free.

 

[Zarih]

We have owned a Kadey Krogen and that is the extent of my liveaboard experience. Now we are thinking about jumping in again and have found the Dutch brand Linssen. The big issue for me is that it is a steel boat and I know nothing about steel boats.
Does anyone have any general knowledge about steel boats or specifically about Linssen?
Any input would be appreciated. It might lead me to some answers.

Thanks

Clarke Gillespie

Linssen is well known for their quality. The quality is best in the second hand market as they have fallen for the "modern" interior which is not as nice. Good, sturdy, seagoing vessels. I congratulate you to your choice. If I hade the Money, I would easily get one. I prefer the Vario top 500. Stunning! We have a steel boat, a Dutch build from 78. Easy to maintain. Steel is easy to work with.

Zarih

 

[North Baltic sea]

Greetings,
Mr. NB. Nice boat and apparently a great price BUT Volvo engine(s). Nope. Not for me, not even free.

The same I can say Cummins, Cat, here half the world VP is a favorite choice because the spare parts can be easily and services, as you will think your US popular engines, the world is a prisoner of patriotic thinking excluding Spaciously think individuals ... you do not have a paranoid to Volvo

NBs

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. NB. I agree,some patriotism probably involved but manufacturers tend to initially sell and service in their immediate markets and as a result, parts and service are readily available. It seems there have been SO many postings of difficulty and expense in obtaining Volvo parts, here, that this has most definitely influenced MY opinion.

That being said, I've also read that some Perkins parts are unobtainable and must be cu$tom made. So limited parts availability is NOT a Volvo monopoly. I expect, as you mentioned, Cummins and Cat parts will be hard to find in other parts of the world BUT I boat in NA.

 

[sunchaser]

Wow thanks for all the responses.
If I bought one of these boats I’d probably buy new. They are so inexpensive when I compare the price to the typical trawler sold in the US. That’s another of my concerns. Why are they so reasonably priced compared to a Kadey Krogen, American Tug, Nordic Tug?

Clarke Gillespie

Clarke
I'm not sure there is such a thing as a typical trawler sold in the US. Compare a Euro built Swift Trawler Beneteau to the Linssens, very different boats. The AT and NT have necessarily much bigger engines for planing speeds. Fuel in NA is about $ 1/3 of Europe. Even imported from the North Sea, go figure!

In looking on yachtworld the Linssens shown are not easily comparable to the vessels you mentioned. Nothing like say a KK 42. Nor are the used prices necessarily any different, possibly more with those little Volvo engines as well.

Have you been aboard a newer Helmsman or North Pacific? Ditto AT? Step aboard al of them built in similar years. Big differences.

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

The Swift trawlers are not really trawlers per se. they are more of a hybrid. I guess KK is the only true trawler. That said I’m just referring to a more displacement boat or a close to displacement with a big enough engine to push water and get a few more knots.
I’ve been aboard all of those. I just want something different. Our KK Whaleback is the largest volume boat you’ll find under 60 feet. It feels larger than the Great Harbors which are certainly not trawlers. We’ve had the enormous trawler. Now I’d just like a change.
The price difference between a new AT, NT, KK and a Linssen is vast. The Linssen is a full 1/3 less. I’m just trying to ascertain if steel is inherently short lived of truly maintenance intensive.
Keep the opinions coming.
Thanks again,
Clarke

 

[Zarih]

As far as I know, you can find Volvoparts all over the World. So I don't see the problem.

 

[Delfin]

The Swift trawlers are not really trawlers per se. they are more of a hybrid. I guess KK is the only true trawler. That said I’m just referring to a more displacement boat or a close to displacement with a big enough engine to push water and get a few more knots.
I’ve been aboard all of those. I just want something different. Our KK Whaleback is the largest volume boat you’ll find under 60 feet. It feels larger than the Great Harbors which are certainly not trawlers. We’ve had the enormous trawler. Now I’d just like a change.
The price difference between a new AT, NT, KK and a Linssen is vast. The Linssen is a full 1/3 less. I’m just trying to ascertain if steel is inherently short lived of truly maintenance intensive.
Keep the opinions coming.
Thanks again,
Clarke

Steel is inherently long lived and lower maintenance when done appropriately. Plus, in the rare instance where you got something really gnarly, it is generally a "darn" moment in a steel boat rather than a "holy sh*t were gonna sink" moment in a plastic boat.

https://mv-ghostrider.blogspot.com/2016/09/08-aug-ghost-rider-down.html?m=1

 

[sunchaser]

The price difference between a new AT, NT, KK and a Linssen is vast. The Linssen is a full 1/3 less. I’m just trying to ascertain if steel is inherently short lived of truly maintenance intensive.
Keep the opinions coming.
Thanks again,
Clarke

What Linssen model are comparing to what model of other boat?

 

[Boat]

This links to a post that addresses steel hull maintenance.

Trawler Forum - View Single Post - For Sale: Robt Beebe 49-10 Passagemaker in steel for sale


I would also be curious about insurance. See if your insurance company will recognize the boat for your intended purpose.

 

[DDW]

Hi,

Steel for boats is enough for washing, no need to polisher or wax and re-painting every 10-15 years if you want it to be new, not of course necessary, only if you want ...

????

Every steel boat I've seen was painted, paint eventually fails and must be redone. You can paint a fiberglass boat if you don't want to polish and wax it, but again it has a life and must be redone. If you ignore that life on a fiberglass boat, it will still be floating and ready for paint 30 years later. Not so a steel boat.

In a metal boat, titanium is the perfect material. Pricey to build though.

 

[Ventana]

Most of the advice you will get about shying away from steel boats is from people with no real experience. It is a fine material for boats, maybe a bit more maintenance than other materials but not much if it is kept up. Cheaper for major repairs than any of the other materials.
Check into financing and insurance before you get too serious, even in a new boat it is going to be more of a challenge in the US.
We lived aboard and cruised a steel boat for about 7 years, I'm more than happy to answer specific questions if you have any.

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

Im looking at the 40 and 45 AC and Sedan from Linssen. Both new and used.
I’m essentially open on comparisons to any “trawler” style boats. I’m looking at Full or semi displacement to keep it open. The big issue is there is nothing by Linssen available in the US in the 40-45 range. The Euro boats just can’t be converted to US electricity cheaply so that’s why I’m leaning towards new.

 

[gsholz]

There are simple ways to convert a Euro boat. I’d leave the 220/50 hz systems as is and just add US style shore power inlet with a good sized 120V battery charger. When you plug into US shorepower you now have a way to charge your batteries. The existing euro-style inverter will produce 220/50 for the onboard devices and the existing 220/50hz generator will continue to work.

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

The insurance company I have spoken with wouldn’t insure a euro spec boat. The conversion they wanted was crazy so I just abandoned that idea.

 

[North Baltic sea]

Im looking at the 40 and 45 AC and Sedan from Linssen. Both new and used.
I’m essentially open on comparisons to any “trawler” style boats. I’m looking at Full or semi displacement to keep it open. The big issue is there is nothing by Linssen available in the US in the 40-45 range. The Euro boats just can’t be converted to US electricity cheaply so that’s why I’m leaning towards new.

Hi

I am convinced if you order a new boat factory Linsen, they can build it for you US electricity and possibly for your engine brand.

My NT manufactured in the US and all electrical appliances + generator with EU systems + other changes made comply with EU requirements. this is not rocket science.

It is unbelievable to think stereotypically that if any steel built boat has a problem of rusting it would be all steel boats, it is evidence of the age of all types of steel ships in traffic up to more than 100 years old, i have not seen glass fiber this age and on the other hand glass fiber on the boat has bad moisture damage. ..

And the question is whether these problematic steel boats are built with the right quality of ship steel (Corten) and controlled manufacturing environment or just something out there?

One thing you should think of is possibly a boat again to the sale US markets, which can be difficult because people seems to be a big attitude problem to accept something that is not common, I have noticed it on my NT which is really rare here, it is a freak boats here


NBs

 

[markpierce]

Progressive wouldn't insure my newly-constructed steel boat. Believe it's because they had little/no experience with steel. Other companies would/did insure the boat.

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

Oh yeah. Linssen makes boat for the US market. I just meant it’s not feasible to convert a euro bot for the us. You can do it on the cheap but it won’t be insurable. I was surprised in the differences in euro and US spec boats. I thought it was plugs and appliances. It’s everything starting at the wiring sizes. I’m not opening that box.
The questions about steel boats in the US is why I’m here asking questions I suppose. Steel is the the bogey in the night. All you hear is vague warning but nothing real specific. Besides small pleasure boats almost everything is steel so how can it be that terrible? The more I think of it the more I lean to steel being a real viable option. Linssen has a very thorough paint repair kit so if I take care of things it should be a 30-40 year hull before anything major would pop up. It sure won’t have spongy decks or rotted core issues like every glass boat has if bedding isn’t perfect.
Now I just need money. Lots and lots of money.

Clarke

 

[sunchaser]

Have Linssen put together a bid and complete build spec sheet showing adherence to ABYC standards. Take this to a marine insurance group familiar with new yacht builds. You should have no problems getting insurance once details are available. Heck if Feadship can get US insurance Linssen can too!

Get the same from AT or Helmsman or whoever on a similar sized new build vessel. Peruse reality and not sales fluff, line by line to compare these vessels.

Or just get a used KK52, Selene 57 or N52 and be happy, foregoing the new boat depreciation.

 

[ClarkeGillespie]

I’ve had my KK Whaleback 48. I don’t want another monster boat. We lived aboard for 18 months before I developed some health problems. It was a great boat but way too big. We never filled it up and never wore half of what we had on the boat. I don’t want to do that again. It’s like a mansion for a couple. Pretty but silly.
I don’t have any doubts about getting insurance on a new build. I was saying to take a used euro boat and convert it to US spec isn’t feasible. It would be extremely expensive.
I have perused reality. Linssen is much less money. I have the bid. I’m just trying to get my head around steel hills and any long term issues. If my health stays good I’d like to be aboard for a decade so I want to understand the issues.
Thanks again.