Solar panel install

[Zoar]

i plan to install four 300 WATT panels above my mid deck. going to fabricate frame using 1 inch stainless steel msrine grade tubing and S/S elbows and clamps mounting to the exusting 1 inch S/S railing. I'll be sure to post pics and method once i get into it.

I did a food truck with eight 300 watt panels and did my off grid solar system at my home so I have some experience with mounting solar panels ... and solar chargers, inverters etc. I don't have nor do I want a GENERATOR on our trawler, however, i want abundant reliable power. 16 years living off grid eith solar as my only electric energy source makes me hsppy and gives me the confidence to do this on our trawler.

 

[kchace]

i plan to install four 300 WATT panels above my mid deck. going to fabricate frame using 1 inch stainless steel msrine grade tubing and S/S elbows and clamps mounting to the exusting 1 inch S/S railing. I'll be sure to post pics and method once i get into it.

I did a food truck with eight 300 watt panels and did my off grid solar system at my home so I have some experience with mounting solar panels ... and solar chargers, inverters etc. I don't have nor do I want a GENERATOR on our trawler, however, i want abundant reliable power. 16 years living off grid eith solar as my only electric energy source makes me hsppy and gives me the confidence to do this on our trawler.

It sounds like a good plan. 1200 watts should be really great. I can only dream of having that much power. If my new configuration of 320 watts mounted above my bimini proves to not be an issue with the mounting, I may expand it with another 320 on the aft section of the bimini.

Ken

 

[SteveK]

I have found that the largest single panel output is 415 watts, then 400, 300, 200, but mostly 100 watt panels are advertised for boat use. With space requirements one larger output is inviting.

I am guessing that the flexing of boat movement and windage could damage these panels therefore the 100w are less expensive to replace. Any comments on this?

 

[kchace]

I have found that the largest single panel output is 415 watts, then 400, 300, 200, but mostly 100 watt panels are advertised for boat use. With space requirements one larger output is inviting.

I am guessing that the flexing of boat movement and windage could damage these panels therefore the 100w are less expensive to replace. Any comments on this?

I assume you’re talking about rigid panels. I had 2 100w panels for 5 years in all weather. They’re really quite rigid and beefy. I don’t see an issue with boat movement or windage at all. I mean, they’re meant to be installed on a roof for 25 years.

Ken

 

[SteveK]

I assume you’re talking about rigid panels. I had 2 100w panels for 5 years in all weather. They’re really quite rigid and beefy. I don’t see an issue with boat movement or windage at all. I mean, they’re meant to be installed on a roof for 25 years.

Ken

Yes rigid. I am wondering why the 100w panel is promoted over a 400w single when 4-100w cost more then one 400w.

I guess I was thinking get one 400w and less space needed to mount.

 

[kchace]

Certainly the larger panel is more efficient in terms of watts vs space and cost per watt. I would love to have 1000w or more of panels but I just don’t have the reasonable space. A 400w panel is pretty big and weighs at least 40 lbs. I would have certainly gone with bigger panels if I had the space. Where I originally did the 100 w panels. I first put in 1 then a year later figured out how I could put another with it. 2 was all that would fit and a bigger panel was just not possible. This year with a totally new mounting location on my bimini I did have room for 2 360w panels but I don’t believe my existing bimini could handle the at least 100lbs xtra weight of 2 360w panels and frame. So i went with 2 160w panels at 22lbs each. If this works out ok (meaning no undue issues with wind, movement, etc) I may consider adding a similar setup on my aft bimini section. I think the reason you see 100w panels a lot is size and maybe also a carryover from cost. Just a few years ago a 100w panel was $600. Plus not that many boaters use their boats as floating homes with all the power requirements as we do.

Ken

 

[socalrider]

There's one other advantage to 4x100 vs 1x400 panels: in applications where there's shading (e.g. from the radar mast I see in kchase's profile pic), output will be better from 4x100 wired in parallel. Even partially shading a panel will cause its voltage to plummet, so a bit of shade can knock out an entire panel (or a string wired in series). This is a really big issue with sailboats as you can imagine.

Certainly go with rigid panels over flex if you can swing it. For me, that would have meant a completely new bimini structure, which would have dwarfed the cost of the flex panels, even if they need to be replaced every few years. I also didn't like adding all that weight way up high. I think if I were to go rigid panels I might rig something off the transom/davits, which needs to be re-done anyway. Nice to imagine a spot of shade there, as I'll often hang a hammock off the davits. Swim step needs to be re-done too, so maybe I'll go for that if I have the stomach for such a comprehensive project.

 

[cerzasd]

Solar panels are typically installed on rooftops, building tops, or self-contained support structures.

 

[psneeld]

Solar panels are typically installed on rooftops, building tops, or self-contained support structures.

True the rigid panels are...not necessarily the flex panels which have come a long way and are much lighter.

 

[CarlF]

It’s rare to have the flex panels last more than 2 years in southern sun. They last longer in higher latitudes. I also know two people who mounted them to the deck and found they had discolored the gelcoat when they were removed.

 

[ksanders]

It’s rare to have the flex panels last more than 2 years in southern sun. They last longer in higher latitudes. I also know two people who mounted them to the deck and found they had discolored the gelcoat when they were removed.

Good video but it is four years old in a very rapidly changing market.

 

[motion30]

I'm really starting to lean toward this install option (flexible panels magnet-mounted to the Bimini fabric.) Which brings me to another question...

Is there any reason or need to put something between the panel and the Bimini fabric?

One issue would be heat dissipation. But I'm not sure what would help that, maybe some sort of mesh. Another would be stability. Maybe a stiff material which was less flexible than the panel.

Any reason to worry about either of these issues?

The flexible panels have been known to fail overheat and catch fire. Although not an overriding concern there is some concern

 

[Crossroads]

Initially, I too planned to install flex panels on our fly bridge bimini. Concerns of shading from the arch mounted antennas, radome, and radar reflector lead me to mount two 200w rigid panels on the aft fly bridge railing using standard handrail fittings and struts.

 

[kiteman]

Nice setup!

 

[Delta Riverat]

I'm considering these thin film panels.

They are not as efficient as silicon, also not as fragile. Rated for walk on and very light weight. Considering four of these for use on the aft bimini with rare earth (8 per panel) magnet mounts. Pros are light weight, easy install and a good amount (800 watts) of power. But kinda expensive.

For my boat it seems so far to be the best solution.

 

[Mainship Pilot]

Great information! One of my winter projects is to install 2 175 Flex Renogy panels on the roof of my Mainship Pilot II 30. I'll put in a 30 amp Renogy controller with a bluetooth monitor that I can use my phone to stay in touch with voltage and state of charge. I just installed 2 T145 6V's Trojans for the house. For those that have a similar set up, is it as simple as running the solar wires down to the controller, run a 30amp fuse between the controller and the house, then tie to the house from the inline fuse? I have a Magnum Freedom 20 2000W inverter after the house. I assume that the controller senses the incoming voltage from an inverter charger while on AC, as well as incoming voltage from the 80 Amp alternator, so as not to overcharge. Are my assumptions correct?

Side note, in my readings, I found that a "Plastic Cardboard" base (Coroplast) that you can get at Home Depot for about $30, and use as a buffer between the panel and the roof allows for breathing for the flex panel thus more efficient.

 

[socalrider]

I'm considering these thin film panels.

They are not as efficient as silicon, also not as fragile. Rated for walk on and very light weight. Considering four of these for use on the aft bimini with rare earth (8 per panel) magnet mounts. Pros are light weight, easy install and a good amount (800 watts) of power. But kinda expensive.

For my boat it seems so far to be the best solution.

Very interesting. Let us know how it goes. Looks like a step up from the Renogy units.

 

[socalrider]

Great information! One of my winter projects is to install 2 175 Flex Renogy panels on the roof of my Mainship Pilot II 30. I'll put in a 30 amp Renogy controller with a bluetooth monitor that I can use my phone to stay in touch with voltage and state of charge. I just installed 2 T145 6V's Trojans for the house. For those that have a similar set up, is it as simple as running the solar wires down to the controller, run a 30amp fuse between the controller and the house, then tie to the house from the inline fuse? I have a Magnum Freedom 20 2000W inverter after the house. I assume that the controller senses the incoming voltage from an inverter charger while on AC, as well as incoming voltage from the 80 Amp alternator, so as not to overcharge. Are my assumptions correct?

Side note, in my readings, I found that a "Plastic Cardboard" base (Coroplast) that you can get at Home Depot for about $30, and use as a buffer between the panel and the roof allows for breathing for the flex panel thus more efficient.

Wiring sounds right, but I'd add a fuse on the PV side (before the controller) as well. You can get inline fuses that plug right into the MC4 connectors coming off the panels, so it's very easy. If there's no shading you can wire the panels in series for a higher voltage from the panels to the controller (make sure to calculate your fuse amperage correctly). Also a good idea to wire a disconnect switch, though I skipped this part to be honest - the MC4 connectors are not meant to disconnect under load.

The Renogy panel will degrade substantially over the first year of use in my experience. Still they're pretty cheap and easy to install compared to solid panels, and produce enough for my use case (I have four of them, and four FLA GC batteries like yours).

 

[Mainship Pilot]

Wiring sounds right, but I'd add a fuse on the PV side (before the controller) as well. You can get inline fuses that plug right into the MC4 connectors coming off the panels, so it's very easy. If there's no shading you can wire the panels in series for a higher voltage from the panels to the controller (make sure to calculate your fuse amperage correctly). Also a good idea to wire a disconnect switch, though I skipped this part to be honest - the MC4 connectors are not meant to disconnect under load.

The Renogy panel will degrade substantially over the first year of use in my experience. Still they're pretty cheap and easy to install compared to solid panels, and produce enough for my use case (I have four of them, and four FLA GC batteries like yours).

Thanks SoCal, Good call on the kill switch and 2nd fuse, duly noted! My use is primarily at Catalina, so as you know, prime hours are full exposure to sun. Question,When you say after the first year there is a remarkable loss in output. Can you drill down on that? Are yours direct applied to the roof? Have you done a heat temp test on them under load to see if they are overheating? When you say they a depreciable degrade after year 1, how depreciable? Looking forward to your input as we will have similar experiences as both in So Cal. Thank you!!
PS: Stop by if you see us at the island!

 

[J.T kearney]

Crossroads
Is there a specific place you purchased your mounting hardware and stanchions? My railing is 1 1/2 inch and can't find any connectors

 

[backinblue]

Wouldn't a rigid panel make more sense and perform better than flexible especially if mounting on a solid hardtop? Flexible is a little cheaper to buy, but not drastically so.

 

[Mainship Pilot]

Wouldn't a rigid panel make more sense and perform better than flexible especially if mounting on a solid hardtop? Flexible is a little cheaper to buy, but not drastically so.

I'll assume this was directed at me, There will be times that we are island bound, and do some fishing along the way, so will need to put the dingy up on the roof along the rails. This would not be an option with rigid mounts. The flex offers just that, more flexibility! Not to mention, less holes in the roof for less intrusion to happen.

 

[socalrider]

Question,When you say after the first year there is a remarkable loss in output. Can you drill down on that? Are yours direct applied to the roof? Have you done a heat temp test on them under load to see if they are overheating? When you say they a depreciable degrade after year 1, how depreciable? Looking forward to your input as we will have similar experiences as both in So Cal. Thank you!!
PS: Stop by if you see us at the island!

With my four panels (700W) after a year I peak at around 500W. Mine are attached to a sunbrella bimini with rare earth magnets (back two which I put on once we're at destination) and 1/4-20 nylon screws/brass grommets (front two which stay on all year) Two of my panels delaminated and were replaced under warranty after two years. Yeah Catalina is a great place for solar! I'll look for you out on the island - we're SEA WOLF.

I'll assume this was directed at me, There will be times that we are island bound, and do some fishing along the way, so will need to put the dingy up on the roof along the rails. This would not be an option with rigid mounts. The flex offers just that, more flexibility! Not to mention, less holes in the roof for less intrusion to happen.

If you can do it, solid panels are way better. If you can't, flex are an option, just be aware that the cheap ones (Renogy) won't last for nearly as long as a solid panel. Can you put the dinghy on rails that would allow it to clear a solid panel?

CIGS is another option: a bit more expensive, but much more robust (walkable). I don't have personal experience but they could be worth researching if you want something lightweight and low profile for a hardtop. Worse efficiency and more expensive than solid panels.

 

[Crossroads]

Hello JT

I used boat canvas tubing clamps from our local shop, San Juan Canvas.
I did have to drill & Dremel a small slot into the panel frames so the clamps fit more unobtrusively. If you want more detail, I can grab a photo or two later today. I can check our tubing diameter as well.

 

[J.T kearney]

Crossroads
That would be great to get any info you have available. I have a pair of 200 watt bi-facial panels that I plan on installing early this spring but would like to have the ability to fold them down in off season. Love the look of your setup. Mine will also be connected to the flybridge aft rail.
Cheers
J.T.

 

[Crossroads]

JT, the canvas shop is closed for the holidays so I couldnt get any manufacturer ID for the fittings. They are common, tho, and any railmaker or canvas shop should have them.

Our top railing is 1 1/4" dia.

I cut a slot in the lower flange of the panel frame so the clamps would grip the vertical side of the frame.

After I installed them, I saw another boat that clamped the panels along the short edge, and was able to get three panels mounted in the same space. They supported the after edge with a tube frame mounted on the transom cap. Im considering this but on our small boat it might add too much clutter in the cockpit area.

 

[janice142]

Side note, in my readings, I found that a "Plastic Cardboard" base (Coroplast) that you can get at Home Depot for about $30, and use as a buffer between the panel and the roof allows for breathing for the flex panel thus more efficient.

Aboard Seaweed I now use starboard to offset all my panels. My concern was vibration and metal (aluminum frame) on fiberglass/gel coat could create leaks eventually. On my initial 75 watt panel the oak offsets rotted. Those were replaced by starboard. Subsequent panels use 3/4" starboard chunks under the attachment points.

I through-bolted mine using 5/16" bolts between 5 and six inches long. Even through hurricanes they have held. I did put my wires inside a hose to keep them out of the sun.

Starboard has been used for 10-plus years. One bolt had a water ooze a few years back which was solved by SilPruf.

 

[J.T kearney]

Crossroads
your install looks great!!! A lot of shops closed for the holiday and I'll start calling around next week. It's tough to find a 1 1/2 inch rail connector.
Thanks everyone
J.T.

 

[GoneFarrell]

J T,
We used drum set clamps for stuff..

https://gibraltarhardware.com/collections/drum-rack-clamps-accessories

Maybe look at that. Not "marinised SST", but can do the job.

 

[J.T kearney]

Gone Ferrell
Now that's thinking out side the box!!!! I found some on Amazon that are anodized aluminum but those base drum components look pretty beefy.

Cheers J.T.