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Old 01-17-2019, 07:51 AM   #21
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K.O. is not a cleaner, Dave...

Raritan only markets their "C.P. Cleans Potties" as a bowl cleaner--and it is an excellent one. But it's also the best sump and drain cleaner on the planet. C.P. is a bio-enzymatic cleaner that not only destroys odor on contact, but the enzymes in it "eat" hair, soap scum, body oils, galley grease and all the stuff that clogs sumps and drains and makes 'em stinky. All you need to is put 2-3 oz down the shower drain when it can stand at least overnight...the enzymes need time to work. Then flush clean water through the sump. You can even let it remain in the sump for weeks, 'cuz although the enzymes exhaust themselves in 24 hours, there's nothing in C.P. that can harm anything. To clean sink drains, close the seacock, then put about an ounce of C.P down the drain and fill the drain with water--again when it can stand at least overnight. That's it.

The above are instructions for MAINTAINING the sump. In your situation, I'd put an inch of water--no more--in the sump along with C.P. It's also likely to take more more than one application. 'Cuz although you CAN leave it in the sump indefinitely, it quits working after 24 hours.


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@HeadMistress can you please share more details on how the enzymes "eat" hair and how CP works to "eat" hair? I've spent approximately $100 on bottles of CP Cleaner just this year and have not seen the results I was expecting. I placed a human hair and dog hair into a cup with CP cleaner and in 24+ hours, the hairs are still fully intact. Other than maybe more effectively killing odor I do not see much benefit in this product and something less expensive can probably be used with similar results. Thanks.
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Old 01-17-2019, 08:24 AM   #22
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Head Mistress, my local West Marine does not carry it.

Gotts love a long haired Asian lady. They can fill up the shower box strainer in less than a week but, she's worth it. Apparently, she is the only woman who can tolerate me.
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Old 01-17-2019, 11:10 AM   #23
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This is the kind of information...

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@HeadMistress can you please share more details on how the enzymes "eat" hair and how CP works to "eat" hair? I've spent approximately $100 on bottles of CP Cleaner just this year and have not seen the results I was expecting. I placed a human hair and dog hair into a cup with CP cleaner and in 24+ hours, the hairs are still fully intact. Other than maybe more effectively killing odor I do not see much benefit in this product and something less expensive can probably be used with similar results. Thanks.
I find useful. Nothing like documented testing. Good job and thanks for posting.

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Old 01-17-2019, 11:18 AM   #24
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I find useful. Nothing like documented testing. Good job and thanks for posting.

Gordon
I also did an experiment with a second bottle, purchased at a different time, from different location, different batch, to help rule out the first bottle being defective. I also had the experience of the four bottles before not "eating" hair.
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Old 01-17-2019, 01:06 PM   #25
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I heard back from Raritan engineering that the product does not "eat" hair. They said it never has. Very interesting...
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Old 01-17-2019, 01:50 PM   #26
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Head Mistress, my local West Marine does not carry it.

Gotts love a long haired Asian lady. They can fill up the shower box strainer in less than a week but, she's worth it. Apparently, she is the only woman who can tolerate me.
Okay, found a bottle at my next West Marine. How many oz to put into a 50 gallon holding tank and how long to let it sit before a pump out?
With 2 on board, I pump once a week.
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Old 01-17-2019, 04:17 PM   #27
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Okay, found a bottle at my next West Marine. How many oz to put into a 50 gallon holding tank and how long to let it sit before a pump out? With 2 on board, I pump once a week.
None. C.P is not a tank product and neither I nor anyone else has ever claimed that it is. C.P. s bio-enzymatic toilet bowl cleaner that also happens to be an outstanding sump and drain cleaner. So I wouldn't put any into your holding tank.

I also did an experiment with a second bottle, purchased at a different time, from different location, different batch, to help rule out the first bottle being defective. I also had the experience of the four bottles before not "eating" hair.

You don't say how you used it, but as a sump cleaner you should only have needed 2-3 ounces each time... so 4 22 oz bottles should have been at least 66 "doses" that you're claiming didn't do whatever it was you expected it to do. There's an old saying, "Doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result each time is one type of insanity." I'd have quit after the first bottle didn't work. And most people for whom hair in a sump or drain is that big a problem would put a screen over the drain to keep it out of the sump.

Most people would expressed their concern privately to me via a PM or an email...that you chose to challenge me here leaves me wondering if you had any purpose in doing so other than attempt to discredit me.

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Old 01-17-2019, 05:53 PM   #28
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Head Mistress, "None. C.P is not a tank product and neither I nor anyone else has ever claimed that it is. C.P. s bio-enzymatic toilet bowl cleaner that also happens to be an outstanding sump and drain cleaner. So I wouldn't put any into your holding tank. "

It is impossible to clean the toilet bowl without pumping it into the holding tank.

I was hoping for a product that would attack the sludge in the sanitary tank.
Oh well, cleaning the shower/sink box is good enough.
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Old 01-17-2019, 08:53 PM   #29
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I also did an experiment with a second bottle, purchased at a different time, from different location, different batch, to help rule out the first bottle being defective. I also had the experience of the four bottles before not "eating" hair.

You don't say how you used it, but as a sump cleaner you should only have needed 2-3 ounces each time... so 4 22 oz bottles should have been at least 66 "doses" that you're claiming didn't do whatever it was you expected it to do. There's an old saying, "Doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result each time is one type of insanity." I'd have quit after the first bottle didn't work. And most people for whom hair in a sump or drain is that big a problem would put a screen over the drain to keep it out of the sump.

Most people would expressed their concern privately to me via a PM or an email...that you chose to challenge me here leaves me wondering if you had any purpose in doing so other than attempt to discredit me.

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Peggie,

I thought CP would be a great product primarily because you have been saying it "eats" hair. I used 4 bottles over 6 months on the boat in drains and toilets. I have nine drains and two toilets I used it on. I have two bottles remaining. After noticing it did nothing to hair, I conducted an experiment. I never said the hair was in the sump. I was concerned some might be getting past the screens/baskets I installed in my sinks and shower drains. I figured it would be good to let it sit in the drains and sump. I currently have no draining issues. I had a draining issue which was tied to an air vent being blocked on the sump which I resolved by fixing the air vent (at first I thought the drains might be blocked hence my purchase of CP). I actually do have one drain I am pretty sure dog hair is clogged on the exterior because it did not have a screen on it. I was hopeful your product would "eat" the hair and clear the blockage.

I didn't know I had to PM you with my concerns. This is an internet forum. You still have not explained your claim that the product "eats" hair. Raritan who I believe acquired the formula/product from you says it definitely does not and never has been able to "eat" hair. I do question what I spent $100 on, a chemical scent? I believe there are several other odor eating cleaners with enzymes that are a fraction of the cost of CP. Pet cleaners with enzymes come to mind.

If you can please explain the product's hair "eating" abilities it would be much appreciated.

Thank you
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Old 01-17-2019, 08:58 PM   #30
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Head Mistress, "None. C.P is not a tank product and neither I nor anyone else has ever claimed that it is. C.P. s bio-enzymatic toilet bowl cleaner that also happens to be an outstanding sump and drain cleaner. So I wouldn't put any into your holding tank. "

It is impossible to clean the toilet bowl without pumping it into the holding tank.

I was hoping for a product that would attack the sludge in the sanitary tank.
Oh well, cleaning the shower/sink box is good enough.
The way I see people handle sludge at the bottom of the holding tank is to shoot water from a hose into their holding tank. Loosen it up, pump out, and do it again. If you do it regularly, it should be easier moving forward.
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Old 01-17-2019, 09:22 PM   #31
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The way I see people handle sludge at the bottom of the holding tank is to shoot water from a hose into their holding tank. Loosen it up, pump out, and do it again. If you do it regularly, it should be easier moving forward.
I am not upset at the least with Peggie. Just asking, requesting further enlightenment. Peggie has solved MANY problems here and I welcome her knowledge, comments and recommendations.

Per using a hose to break up the sludge in the sanitary tank, "Mystery" what time are you showing up. LOL

I can only relate to you my experience with opening the sanitary tank on the Nordhavn. It was steel, perhaps stainless steel. I had been using OSORLOS on an irregular basis. Upon opening the tank, a leak in the steel pump out elbow, it was clean and no sludge but sure did smell. LOL
The sanitary tank on my AT34 is a "plastic" tank. I guess I will start using OSORLOS in this tank too unless, Peggie can see a reason not to use it. SMILE

Tomorrow, I will put a 'best guess' couple of OZ in the shower and sink drain box via the head shower and sink drains after we have uses it.

Thanks again Peggie for your wisdom, comments and recommendations.
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Old 01-18-2019, 08:13 AM   #32
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It is impossible to clean the toilet bowl without pumping it into the holding tank.

I was hoping for a product that would attack the sludge in the sanitary tank.
Oh well, cleaning the shower/sink box is good enough.

KO is their corresponding holding tank treatment product. CP is said to be compatible with KO (useful, since it travels from bowl to tank), whereas some bowl cleaners aren't so much.

Or Noflex advertises it's good for sludge. Presumably CP is also compatible.

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Old 01-18-2019, 02:12 PM   #33
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We use "Forget About It" in our holding tank. It's a 100% natural proprietary concoction that uses as its primary ingredient probiotic lactic acid bacteria to eat organic material. It eliminates sludge and odor from the system. And though we've used it in the bilge after the sump pump failed (and we ended up with a bunch of stinky shower stuff in there), it wasn't until reading this thread that I realized it might work in the sump itself to keep things clean.

I'll let y'all know what we find out...
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Old 01-18-2019, 03:03 PM   #34
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We use "Forget About It" in our holding tank. It's a 100% natural proprietary concoction that uses as its primary ingredient probiotic lactic acid bacteria to eat organic material. It eliminates sludge and odor from the system. And though we've used it in the bilge after the sump pump failed (and we ended up with a bunch of stinky shower stuff in there), it wasn't until reading this thread that I realized it might work in the sump itself to keep things clean.

I'll let y'all know what we find out...
I wonder if it would "eat" hair? Please do keep us posted! Thank you
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Old 01-19-2019, 10:38 AM   #35
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My grey water sump bilge pump could suck start a Harley Davidson, the issue is a sticking Rule flipper switch. I hate those switches.
Hoping a magic potion will stop it sticking,disinclined to bless the grey tank with a Johnson Ultra.
For anyone who still has a shower sump and hates dealing with it as much as I did (the gray goop, the failing float switch, the failing pump, etc., etc., etc.) - replace it with a Whale Gulper Gray IC, and forget about it.
https://www.whalepumps.com/marine/pr...oduct_ID=10040

I did, several months ago. Other than hearing it "gulp" when it kicks on (which I could quiet if it bothered me), I don't even think about my two showers and three sinks that drain into it.
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Old 01-19-2019, 01:45 PM   #36
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Replace those bugs

I have no experience with holding tanks on a boat or the anaerobic digestion process, so please have mercy on this post.

would a residential septic tank product like Rid x help in a holding tank to alleviate some of the build up of solids? I would think a lot of the problem with smells and build up would come from having the tank pumped out often, as it would remove any beneficial anaerobic organisms that are digesting the solid materials in the tank. A product like Rid x, or bugs in a box as we like to call them, are supposed to replace these bugs. Even in a residential septic system it is often recommended to add such a product after the septic tank is pumped out and cleaned.
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Old 01-19-2019, 01:58 PM   #37
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I have no experience with holding tanks on a boat or the anaerobic digestion process, so please have mercy on this post.

would a residential septic tank product like Rid x help in a holding tank to alleviate some of the build up of solids? I would think a lot of the problem with smells and build up would come from having the tank pumped out often, as it would remove any beneficial anaerobic organisms that are digesting the solid materials in the tank. A product like Rid x, or bugs in a box as we like to call them, are supposed to replace these bugs. Even in a residential septic system it is often recommended to add such a product after the septic tank is pumped out and cleaned.
Capitaine, I have asked this same question of other knowledgable boater and instructors. The answer was always the same, "Dont". In other words, never a satisfactory answer. Of course, the dosage would need to be adjusted..... Home septic tanks are usually concrete so nothing hurts them. I have no idea how Rid x would react to steel or plastic tanks. SHRUG. Also, home septic tanks go for years without being pumped, not so on a boat.
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Old 01-19-2019, 02:59 PM   #38
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I have no experience with holding tanks on a boat or the anaerobic digestion process, so please have mercy on this post.

would a residential septic tank product like Rid x help in a holding tank to alleviate some of the build up of solids? I would think a lot of the problem with smells and build up would come from having the tank pumped out often, as it would remove any beneficial anaerobic organisms that are digesting the solid materials in the tank. A product like Rid x, or bugs in a box as we like to call them, are supposed to replace these bugs. Even in a residential septic system it is often recommended to add such a product after the septic tank is pumped out and cleaned.

Better to read Peggie's book, with more explanation about aerobic vs. anaerobic systems, and why boats usually shouldn't have "septic" (anaerobic) holding tanks.

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Old 01-19-2019, 03:34 PM   #39
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I have no experience with holding tanks on a boat or the anaerobic digestion process, so please have mercy on this post.

You're starting from a false premise: that the holding tank on a boat is a septic (anaerobic) system. Treat it as one and it's guaranteed to stink because anaerobic systems can only be odorless if they're kept absolutely still...which is impossible on a boat. Keeping a marine holding tank or composter odor free requires that be maintained AEROBICALLY.

...would a residential septic tank product like Rid x help in a holding tank to alleviate some of the build up of solids?

Another boat owner on a quest to find products that can just be poured in a tank or the bilge or....instead of doing any hands-on maintenance <sigh> Why not just prevent the buildup instead? Flushing out the tank 2-3/x year, and especially in preparation for winter or other extended layup, is the best way to PREVENT sludge buildup and very easy to do.

I would think a lot of the problem with smells and build up would come from having the tank pumped out often, as it would remove any beneficial anaerobic organisms that are digesting the solid materials in the tank.

Nope...there are no "beneficial anaerobic organisms" in a holding tank. It's the anaerobic organisms that create the odor.

Bio-physics 101: When organic matter breaks down anaerobically it generates anaerobic gasses--sulfur dioxide, hydrogen sulfide, which not only stink but are toxic, and methane which is odorless but flammable. But when organic matter breaks down AEROBICALLY, it converts to CO2 which is odorless. Which explains why running streams don't stink, but stagnant ponds do...why it's necessary to toss/aerate compost piles, and why holding tank odor can be eliminated by increasing the amount oxygen/air exchange in the tank. That can usually be done passively by shortening, straightening and increasing vent line diameter but sometimes aeration is the only thing that works.

I've posted volumes about this here and on other sites in the and have written two books (see link in my signature) that explain how to set up a system that functions aerobically in detail. And I'm always glad to answer questions that aren't answered either place.

(This thread seems to have drifted away from sumps etc into holding tank maintenance...perhaps one of our mods might move it to a new more apppropriate home)

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Old 01-19-2019, 04:01 PM   #40
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And today, I shall recount my experience with CP in the shower and sink and drain box.
I poured a few ounces into the shower and sink drain to set. I put a couple of ounces into the drain box too. I let it sit for about 3 hours. Meanwhile I cleaned the strainer in the drain box.
I flushed the 2 drains and wiped down the drain box. CP made the sludge in the box easier to clean up.
I went to put the strainer back in, not to be found. I misplaced it between the cockpit and the shower box. Ah ha, I thought, I shall use the spare strainer. Not to be found. How can I misplace or lose things inside a boat that is WLL of 32ft and beam of 13ft?
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