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Old 12-27-2017, 10:27 PM   #41
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I think I just fell in love again! If that boat had a cockpit, I'd buy it and move aboard! (Don't tell the Admiral.)
For a 1990 boat to still look that good means it's a really well built boat and of course well maintained. What a wonderful boat. It's even stabilized but they didn't put thrusters on them in those days. That will cost $20-$30k. I have to have thrusters on a boat that size. I know there are people who have no need for them, which blows my mind.
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Old 12-28-2017, 07:12 AM   #42
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"I think I just fell in love again! If that boat had a cockpit, I'd buy it and move aboard! "

Take a look at the Midnight Lace series of boats , the FWD cockpit makes nice days underway glorious days !
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Old 12-28-2017, 09:40 AM   #43
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My 52’ Choey Lee has everything you are looking for except the stabilizers. But they are available with stabilizers in the price range OP is looking for. True stand up engine room and separate laundry area. I can walk anywhere on my boat without ducking my head. Except the lazarette.

Just delivered an ‘88, 44’ DeFever this month. My back was killing me by the end of the delivery. Spent a lot of time in the Machinery Spaces and they are not even close to true stand up heights. My observation.
Not even close to stand-up heights? Geez, I'm 6'1" and don't have any problem working in the engine room of my Defever 44. True, I cannot stand up fully but most of what I need to accomplish is not done standing up. I'm not on the boat but as I recall, the clearance is 5.5 feet. Not many boats can boast this.
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Old 12-28-2017, 10:01 AM   #44
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Not even close to stand-up heights? Geez, I'm 6'1" and don't have any problem working in the engine room of my Defever 44. True, I cannot stand up fully but most of what I need to accomplish is not done standing up. I'm not on the boat but as I recall, the clearance is 5.5 feet. Not many boats can boast this.
Which in no way refutes what he said. Not even close to stand up height. Doesn't mean it's unacceptable.
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Old 12-28-2017, 11:18 AM   #45
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Not even close to stand-up heights? Geez, I'm 6'1" and don't have any problem working in the engine room of my Defever 44. True, I cannot stand up fully but most of what I need to accomplish is not done standing up. I'm not on the boat but as I recall, the clearance is 5.5 feet. Not many boats can boast this.


Well, I am 6’1” also as is the new owner. I did not measure the height of the machinery space but it didn’t feel like more than 5’ from the floor plates to the lowest headknocker but I can stand corrected. Also the door is, what, 4’ tall? Required a feet first or head first entry. I had issues with the starboard coupling pin during the trip so I was in and out of there a lot and had a sore back to prove it. Being 63 and post three surgeries may have something to do with my lack of flexibility in this regard.

I did change the Racor filters on both engines and generator during the trip and found the most comfortable way to do that was move around on my knees. If I owned the boat I would own a set of knee pads.

I am not knocking the boat, which I quite liked for the trip. But I wouldn’t tout the ER headroom as one of its salient features.
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Old 12-29-2017, 06:46 AM   #46
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"If I owned the boat I would own a set of knee pads."

A metal milk crate works well., if you prefer sitting.
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Old 12-29-2017, 10:12 AM   #47
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"If I owned the boat I would own a set of knee pads."

A metal milk crate works well., if you prefer sitting.
You can also have plenty of standing room and still need to get on your knees or use a crate or stool. Everything you need to do will not be at height. One thing I suggest is whatever ER and other working conditions your boat affords, organize it and develop a plan to be able to safely and comfortably do what you need to. This goes from hand holds, knee pads, ear protection, protective clothing to how things are organized and stored and tool kits. Think of things as you would if you were an industrial engineer trying to reduce time required and develop procedures to do it safely and with the least time and effort. If you need a crate or something to sit on, get it, don't talk about getting it, and get the best you can for the need you have. The upfront effort will pay off many times over.
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Old 12-29-2017, 10:26 AM   #48
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You can also have plenty of standing room and still need to get on your knees or use a crate or stool. Everything you need to do will not be at height. One thing I suggest is whatever ER and other working conditions your boat affords, organize it and develop a plan to be able to safely and comfortably do what you need to. This goes from hand holds, knee pads, ear protection, protective clothing to how things are organized and stored and tool kits. Think of things as you would if you were an industrial engineer trying to reduce time required and develop procedures to do it safely and with the least time and effort. If you need a crate or something to sit on, get it, don't talk about getting it, and get the best you can for the need you have. The upfront effort will pay off many times over.
I had considered 'adopting' what appears to be a homeless dairy crate but I figure the cops were watching and I am STILL to pretty to go to prison.
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Old 12-29-2017, 12:45 PM   #49
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My requirement for a standup engine room is my belief the easier the engineering spaces are to access the more they will be entered to inspect and maintain, especially underway. Little maintenance is preformed at eye level but quite a bit of inspection is.
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Old 12-29-2017, 03:25 PM   #50
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My requirement for a standup engine room is my belief the easier the engineering spaces are to access the more they will be entered to inspect and maintain, especially underway. Little maintenance is preformed at eye level but quite a bit of inspection is.
Every boat is a compromise. I have seen stand up engine rooms where access was still bad. Twins you couldn't fit between without risk of burning and with no protective rails. I've yet to be on any boat under 60' in which I could stand at full height in the engine room in it's entirety. But then that's something I'm use to on land and water.
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Old 12-30-2017, 07:42 AM   #51
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My boat the engine is under a hatch has almost no sitting room.

This is hardly a problem as the fuel filters are not located in the ER , nor is the battery set.

Oil changes are about the only reason to visit , and with a hand cranked drum pump, 8 gal are quickly removed .

One does work fast as the oil is at high operating temperature , so the oil detergents can carry away the goop.

Other service items are belts for hyd pump for steering and of course an alternator belt .

Only the steering pump belt night need to be replaced underway , perhaps 5 min.

As a diesel there is no need for an alt that dies to be repaired instantly.

I have had many boats over the years and have no concept why anyone would be willing to give up the space to be able to stand next to operating engines .

Most repairs are done dockside , where touching the engine is no problem.


"I had considered 'adopting' what appears to be a homeless dairy crate "

The best milk crates are all metal, probably 30 years out of date.
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Old 12-30-2017, 01:44 PM   #52
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I agree that most repairs will have to wait until the vessel has stopped, whether at dock, anchor or at sea. My experience with the sailboat has not been pleasant when I had to perform repairs or maintenance of any kind while under way. Even with a cold engine there are many ways to damage your space suit with the rocking and rolling. My research has led me to believe that at the minimum, an engineering space inspection should be preformed at least once an hour while underway. If you have to raise cabin sole hatch’s or crawl through the lazzerett hatch while the vessel is rolling and pitching, safety for the crew would dictate those inspections should be discontinued. Conversely, if you can gain access comfortably and safely, standard watch procedures can be followed. You are probably not going to find “standup” engineering spaces in a 40 foot boat. That is one of the reasons that a 49-54 foot boat is being considered.
Our plans are not to be marina yacht lizards, we have a nice house in the country in South Florida. I would rather sip scotch by my pool with no one within 500 feet than cool my jets at the slip. It is like living in a condo. Been there, done that. Lots of Tee shirts. Down to the Keys or out to the Bahama’s will be our main destinations. Once there, swinging at the hook is the preferred option. We like people, just not crowds.
Happy New Year!!! May you have West winds and safe voyages.
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Old 12-31-2017, 07:15 AM   #53
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"My research has led me to believe that at the minimum, an engineering space inspection should be preformed at least once an hour while underway."

Boats are more reliable than autos (after the first 500 hours) do you stop hourly to inspect the car engine? Of course not!

A lifting hatch will allow your EYEBALLS access ,to inspect as often as desired, although rugs or floor sound damping can make it a chore.

WE have found that once after shutdown is sufficient to inspect the engine room.

That way we know all is well for an AM departure or a midnight anchor drill .

With the low cost a camera and lamp could be mounted below ,

but to actually monitor an engine Murphy Alarm Gauges do a far better job.
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Old 12-31-2017, 07:52 AM   #54
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iflypby,

Do you fly a PBY like your avatar suggests? I'm sure that would be worth a thread by itself.

Would be a great second home.
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Old 12-31-2017, 11:27 AM   #55
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I do, or should say that I have. As happens to most older vessels, the Cat has been down several years for restoration. She is one of the last LandSeaire conversions which modified the old girl into a flying yacht. Hopefully she will be back airworthy in the next couple of years.Click image for larger version

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Old 11-26-2018, 09:08 PM   #56
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If you are retired and living aboard you shouldnt really have time constraints.
You can sit back, have a few adult beverages and enjoy that anchorage while waiting for some better weather.

2 years living aboard on the hook doing around 500nm/mth and as yet to be in weather where we wished we had stabilizers and the upside is we never had the added maintenance cost drag and fuel burn that comes with them.

We have had to change course slightly and tack to avoid roll, but never more than a couple of hours of that and, we have noticed considerably better ride with more weight/full tanks.
Larger heavier boat is good.

Flopper stoppers on the other hand are something we will be putting on, roll at anchor is rare, but has been annoying enough to have chased us from an otherwise ideal anchorage to another anchorage 100+ nm away to get out of it after several days/nights of little sleep.
Most stabilizers won't address this problem.
Simi 60, did you ever install flopper stoppers on your boat. I am 2 years away from pulling the trigger with a pretty good idea of what I will be looking for. The boat (used) must have active stabilizers otherwise a no go per the future admiral. My concern is roll at anchor and the only way to go it appears is using flopper stoppers. No interest in a gyro retrofit on a boat bought w/o stabilizers.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:23 PM   #57
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Simi 60, did you ever install flopper stoppers on your boat. I am 2 years away from pulling the trigger with a pretty good idea of what I will be looking for. The boat (used) must have active stabilizers otherwise a no go per the future admiral. My concern is roll at anchor and the only way to go it appears is using flopper stoppers. No interest in a gyro retrofit on a boat bought w/o stabilizers.
Not sure if this will be helpful, but roll at anchor is something you get pretty well habituated to, within limits, of course. I remember tying up to a mooring buoy outside Lahaina and thinking how wonderful it felt not to be rocking and rolling underway anymore. When we were motored ashore I looked back and the mast of our boat looked like a metronome set to Allegro. But by comparison to the open ocean, it felt completely stable when on board. Flopper stoppers do help, though.
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Old 11-27-2018, 01:21 PM   #58
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Well, I sense from your post that you kinda get use to it. I started with a wife that would just look at a boat and get seasick. So I started big, cruise ships. Here she had anxiety leading up to our first cruise but in the end all was OK. We went on to take 4 more cruises with no incidents to speak of. Then in 2017 we took a offshore powerboat course in BVI. We "learned" on a 43 ft power catamaran. My wife did have some minor discomfort early on but it waned as the days on the water passed. We moored most of the time in calm to relatively calm water. A cat is relatively stable at anchor. My wife was ok but noticed that some of the monohulls at anchor rolled. She understands I want a monohull so she asked is that going to happen to us when moored or anchored. I said "no honey we will have stabilizers". Well 1/2 lie as active stabilizers we be on the "must have" list. They will not as you know work at anchor unless you have the gyros. Thus my question about flopper stoppers.
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Old 11-27-2018, 02:00 PM   #59
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Well 1/2 lie as active stabilizers we be on the "must have" list. They will not as you know work at anchor unless you have the gyros. Thus my question about flopper stoppers.
You can get zero speed stabilizers as well. Don't have to be gyros.
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Old 11-27-2018, 02:28 PM   #60
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This is why besides financial issues I need 2 more years of research. I will look into the zero speed stabilizers. Thanks B
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