Registration Fees could increase in Cali

[rjwilliams11741]

We live in Nevada. Pay $25.00 per year here for boat registration on our small runabout. Kept our Trawler in California (Documented) and as was required registered our dinghy in California. Cost of $20.00 for 2 years. Certainly going from essentially $10.00 per year to $35.00 per year is a steep jump but certainly not our of sync with other states. California does not require, at this time at least, state registration on Federally Documented vessels.

 

[rjwilliams11741]

Excise tax? Is that a one time charge on the initial purchase of the boat, like a sales tax? You don't pay that tax every year, do you??

I'm assuming that the "tax" being quoted is an annual property tax.

 

[Portage_Bay]

I'm assuming that the "tax" being quoted is an annual property tax.

Yes, it is essentially a property tax. From https://dor.wa.gov/taxes-rates/other-taxes/watercraft-excise-tax

Watercraft excise tax

What is the watercraft excise tax?

It is a tax on the fair market value of non-commercial boats, 16 feet and over, used on Washington waters. This tax is in lieu of the property tax. (emphasis mine)

Some commercial vessels that are not subject to the watercraft excise tax may be subject to personal property tax, commonly referred to as the Commercial Vessel Tax (pdf).

How do I pay the tax?

The Department of Licensing and its agents, including county auditors and authorized private firms, collect the tax. The tax is paid annually by boat owners and is due by June 30 each year. The tax for newly registered boats is prorated to the following June 30.

What rate do I pay?

The rate is .005 of the fair market value. There is a minimum fee of $5.00.

What are the funds used for?

Funds are distributed to the state general fund.

 

[jgwinks]

I'm assuming that the "tax" being quoted is an annual property tax.

And does WA have a regular sales tax? Here we pay 6% on everything but groceries, but no personal property tax. Costs the same to run a state no matter how they charge the taxes. They get their big bite out of a boat when you buy it. So I paid 6% of the purchase price, and the three year registration is $244 on my 41 footer. And if I move to another state and have to register there, most give credit for the tax already paid.

 

[Art]

Just for S&G...

Imagine tax rates [of all sorts and throughout many levels] after our U.S. gets past the several compounding multi trillion dollar expenses of C-19 pandemic... and its oncoming years of lingering economic hardship effects.

Then comes the many trillion dollar expense needs to successfully attack global warming. Can we spell T-A-X!!

Batten down the hatches! Red sky in morning!

 

[Portage_Bay]

And does WA have a regular sales tax? Here we pay 6% on everything but groceries, but no personal property tax. Costs the same to run a state no matter how they charge the taxes. They get their big bite out of a boat when you buy it. So I paid 6% of the purchase price, and the three year registration is $244 on my 41 footer. And if I move to another state and have to register there, most give credit for the tax already paid.

Yes, we pay sales tax at the time of purchase which varies by location within the state. We also pay excise tax that first year of ownership and each year after.

 

[kthoennes]

Oh, I don't mean to turn this into a political discussion, truly, but the COVID money flood and other money floods will never be paid off. It's statistically and practically impossible. It's all monopoly-game money. To keep this tied to the topic -- boat registration fees and taxes -- look at the fees and taxes discussed so far here. Look at how poorly (painfully, third-world slowly) the CG's boat documentation office in Falling Water, WV operates with just about everything other than online annual renewals which are automated. None of these boat fees or taxes or appropriations seem to make any difference or have much connection to their intended purpose, ultimately.

 

[bligh]

That's a lota boats! Do you rent out small boats?

"I also have a bunch (20 ish?) of green stickered vehicles."

"What about that fee on a vessel worth $500? or $1000?"

A green stickered vehicle is a quad, snowmobile, utility vehicle, offroad motorcycle, snowcat, etc. Not a boat.

 

[bligh]

I am not clear, is this a rant over $35 a year?

Well there is the $35 a year.


Plus the sales tax paid each time a boat changes ownership

Plus the 65 cent tax for each gallon of gas.

Plus the invasive species fees.

Plus all public launch ramp fees.

Plus parking fees for your tow vehicle.

Plus the 1-2% property tax you pay annually on any vessel over $5000.


So, no, its not just about the $35 a year.

 

[Art]

Oh, I don't mean to turn this into a political discussion, truly, but the COVID money flood and other money floods will never be paid off. It's statistically and practically impossible. It's all monopoly-game money. To keep this tied to the topic -- boat registration fees and taxes -- look at the fees and taxes discussed so far here. Look at how poorly (painfully, third-world slowly) the CG's boat documentation office in Falling Water, WV operates with just about everything other than online annual renewals which are automated. None of these boat fees or taxes or appropriations seem to make any difference or have much connection to their intended purpose, ultimately.

This is not about politics... but rather it is referring to monetary needs/policy. We're talking about "bean counters" - counting bean$ here... not politicians running for office. Taxes are one item that big-time bean counters use to balance their books.

"COVID money flood and other money floods will never be paid off."

Of course [well... most likely] not.

However, increased interest amount, due to increased loan principal amount, will need to consistently be paid. That's the primary way financials are structured. "Loans" are not considered truly abandoned [non performing] until their at least interest payment has stopped, or, the loan has been appropriately restructured.

Currently... most nations' loans are still performing!

 

[bligh]

$35 per year for most boats sounds pretty reasonable,

Ted

Right, but your not already paying and additional 13% income tax to your state.

(plus all the things i mentioned above)

 

[DDW]

But again, a state spends what it takes in. States vary quite a lot in how they take it in, but the expenditures are very well documented. California is spending about average, ranked 22'd out of 50 states. So other states may not be getting $35 from boat owners, but they are getting it from you or your neighbors, somehow. The perception that California is high tax and spendthrift is mistaken. 21 states spend more, including some 3rd world-ish ones.

 

[magna 6882]

What gets me is the 80k in sales tax(10.1%)plus the annual fees and taxes and i dont see much if any being spent on our waters. We have derelict boats almost everywhere and in some areas the water looks so dirty i question running in it for cooling the engine. I do see hotels being purchased to provide housing and setting up drug injection sites. Fun times.

 

[markpierce]

Oh, I don't mean to turn this into a political discussion, truly, but the COVID money flood and other money floods will never be paid off. ....

It will result with inflation like other federal overspending. Thus, taxes on long, long-term capital gains will be primarily on imaginary gains, so, confiscation of assets results. In my world, capital gains would be taxed like other income, but indexed to eliminate inflationary effects.

 

[backinblue]

Anyone who chooses to live in CA and continues to support the people who run the state and have gotten into the condition it's in should know what to expect. Granted that CT is not far behind.

 

[slolooper]

All boat owners are rich and should be taxed accordingly.

 

[Mark Laurnen]

WA is no better. I just walked out of the Assessor’s office. As I expected ... $10,600 “use tax” to put my documented vessel in WA waters full time. Although this is a one time initiation hit, as I understand it, annual property taxes will be multiple hundreds of dollars. When I was told to fill out a WA state title application, I said that documented vessels do not require a title, in WA or any other state. The response was “it’s not really a title, just a means of cataloging ownership data”. The clerk was, however, extremely nice and helpful.

 

[Raduran]

Registration for boats here in Alaska started in 2019. The cost is $24 per year. Separately, as a CA transplant to Alaska, it was our experience that the fees in California typically rise annually. The registration fee increase (which was substantial) in CA for RVs pushed a number of vehicles to be located in to Oregon, Nevada and Arizona. Other fees that are not as easily identified are the regulatory requirements that state agencies impose such as the CA Coastal Commission. They have regulations that have driven up the cost of operations for marinas and other shoreline businesses that are passed on to the public.

 

[seadancer]

You're whining about $35/year?

 

[DDW]

Anyone who chooses to live in CA and continues to support the people who run the state and have gotten into the condition it's in should know what to expect. Granted that CT is not far behind.

CT is one of the most spendthrift states right behind Alaska and Hawaii. Almost twice as bit a spender as CA per capita. And while in AK and HI the money is free (comes from oil and tourists), in CT the money comes from you.

 

[kthoennes]

My brother moved from our home in CT where we grew up, to California. I didn't know insanity ran in the family.

 

[caltexflanc]

Here in North Carolina, you will be charged a state registration fee on your documented boat, and often times also a city property tax and a separate county property tax.

Ya gotta pay to play...

 

[backinblue]

CT is one of the most spendthrift states right behind Alaska and Hawaii. Almost twice as bit a spender as CA per capita. And while in AK and HI the money is free (comes from oil and tourists), in CT the money comes from you.

I wasn't talking about what people spend, I was talking about what people are charged to live here/there. CT is pretty heavily taxed, but at least our gas is still in the $2.69 range and people who buy boats only pay half the normal sales tax. I don't think that's likely the same in CA. The point is, if you choose to live or have to live in a highly taxed state, expect you will pay more for everything. A friend and co-worker is retiring to NC from CT. A full year at a marina there is less than half what he pays for a summer season here. Probably less than 1/3 if you add in winter storage.

 

[bligh]

But again, a state spends what it takes in. States vary quite a lot in how they take it in, but the expenditures are very well documented. California is spending about average, ranked 22'd out of 50 states. So other states may not be getting $35 from boat owners, but they are getting it from you or your neighbors, somehow. The perception that California is high tax and spendthrift is mistaken. 21 states spend more, including some 3rd world-ish ones.

Can you cite this information?


I see that California budget of 227 Billion (that's $227,000,000,000.00) is 2 times what the next closest state is. Who are you kidding? California out-spends them all!

 

[backinblue]

But again, a state spends what it takes in. States vary quite a lot in how they take it in, but the expenditures are very well documented. California is spending about average, ranked 22'd out of 50 states. So other states may not be getting $35 from boat owners, but they are getting it from you or your neighbors, somehow. The perception that California is high tax and spendthrift is mistaken. 21 states spend more, including some 3rd world-ish ones.

Not sure exactly what you are saying, but you'll have a hard time convincing me that CA is not a high tax state unless you are talking bout 1 specific tax.

 

[lwarden]

Can you cite this information?


I see that California budget of 227 Billion (that's $227,000,000,000.00) is 2 times what the next closest state is. Who are you kidding? California out-spends them all!

Spending per capita I suppose is what Mr. DDW is citing:

https://www.kff.org/other/state-ind...d":"Per Capita State Spending","sort":"desc"}

 

[AKDoug]

Actually the California state budget spending per capita is #22 out of 50 states, just above average. Well below states like North Dakota, Arkansas, Kentucky, West Virginia, etc.; all of those states spend more per person. Alaska is the high flyer, more than double the spending per person than California.

Doesn't make California government exactly thrifty, but we are going to have the chance to recall our governor again here shortly.

Alaska is the high flyer because there are no roads to rural communities, everything floats or flies to get there. Coupled with a huge number of indigenous people who live on the government dime (state and federal). Infrastructure development is stopped by groups whose goal is to turn the entire state into a park (they will never visit).

The state added the registration fee to documented vessels two years ago, correct that it's a sticker and no numbers.

California has money surpluses because they don't pay their bills, if that state paid what it owes to various pension plans and other underfunded public systems there would be no surplus.

If I banked everything coming in and didn't pay my bills I would have a budget surplus too Unfortunately they'd be coming for me...

 

[DDW]

Yes it is state government spending per capita that is important. You cannot compare the total budget with a HUGE state like CA with an economy that would be #6 in the world if it were a country, with CT - a tiny state with a tiny population and a tiny economy. But you can compare them per resident. And this is state government budget, which equals what they take in in tax since state governments cannot deficit spend (in the federal tradition). By this measure, each resident of CT pay 135% the state tax burden compared to each resident of CA.

I'm not going to defend how CA runs their government (and I note that the governor is about to face a recall election). But the taxing and spending is what it is and not a secret.

Alaska does not spend what it spends because is has to, it spends because it can. That is the luxury of natural resource exploitation. In another couple of decades that will change, and Alaska will change.

 

[markpierce]

California has a very high percentage of poor people who pay little in taxes but are dependent upon subsidies from state and local governments.

 

[backinblue]

Yes it is state government spending per capita that is important. You cannot compare the total budget with a HUGE state like CA with an economy that would be #6 in the world if it were a country, with CT - a tiny state with a tiny population and a tiny economy. But you can compare them per resident. And this is state government budget, which equals what they take in in tax since state governments cannot deficit spend (in the federal tradition). By this measure, each resident of CT pay 135% the state tax burden compared to each resident of CA.

I'm not going to defend how CA runs their government (and I note that the governor is about to face a recall election). But the taxing and spending is what it is and not a secret.

Alaska does not spend what it spends because is has to, it spends because it can. That is the luxury of natural resource exploitation. In another couple of decades that will change, and Alaska will change.

CA will also change as people flee the state for lower taxes. BTW those leaving are the ones paying most of the taxes. How will that affect per capita tax/spend in the future? CT may be a small state by comparison, but also the highest average income per capita.