Reasons to walk away from a boat AFTER the survey

[syjos]

I get a kick out some TF members basically intimating that it's pretty much ok for the seller to lie by default.

Sorry folks... that way of selling an item is simply not correct.

Openness about sale of any product is the root of being right with yourself and with others.

I agree 100%

 

[slowgoesit]

Hi all,

Thanks for all the answers.

It was disclosed by the owner but not to me.
I think I simply lost confidence so the best would probably to run ....

Sorry for your woes. It is a body blow when a boat you have invested time in is revealed to have problems. Your are lucky that you found out about potential problems BEFORE you own the boat.
For me, at this point, it would boil down to whether I would still be interested in owning the boat knowing about potential water intrusion and knowing that I will be responsible for repairing or finding a repair shop to do the repair. If the answer to that is NO, than get out now. There is no reason to proceed with the survey or additional cost.
If the answer is YES, or MAYBE, depending on the results of the survey, you will need to establish, to the best of your ability (or the surveyors) the extent of damage, and estimate of repair cost. I would increase any estimate you get by at least 25%, also add in time for repair, which is time you will not be able to use the boat. Request a reduction of purchase price that includes 1)repair (+25%), 2)cost of moorage and insurance for the expected repair time since it is an added expense and you won't be able to use the boat during that time. If the seller agrees, buy the boat and have it repaired. If not, walk. Based on his not being forthcoming with you in the past, I think the overall nature of the seller (and broker) has already been revealed, and they will refuse a reduction and find a sucker to purchase it for full price.

Personally, if it were me, I would get out now.

 

[syjos]

True what you say.

One thing with me is I don't purchase used anything from brokers... except houses. I much prefer to deal with the owner of a boat, car, truck... etc.

I'm also not afraid to ask tough questions to the seller so as to be sure and see how honest they are. If I feel they are trying to pull the wool over my eyes I bid them good day, and make my exit.

I agree 100%

I've been fortunate that I've only owned two boats over 34' in 35 years. Both were one owner and no broker. The first was listed by a broker but bypassed when he was slow responding. He was paid his commission by the seller since I found the boat from his listing.

My policy is to only buy one owner cars and boats. And avoid brokers and salesmen.

 

[denverd0n]

2-Talk to surveyor and have him start with his tests for water and dampness and checking the hull so if there is water present you can decide whether to continue the survey or not.

This would be my approach. Tell the surveyor about your concerns. Tell him to check that first. Tell him that if it is serious that will be the end of the survey.


Good luck.

 

[BandB]

This would be my approach. Tell the surveyor about your concerns. Tell him to check that first. Tell him that if it is serious that will be the end of the survey.


Good luck.

Except OP sounds like he's really soured on the deal and, if that's the case, then why spend another dollar on it, just run now.

 

[miraculix]

Hi all,

Thank you for alle the input.
Lots of ways to deal with an issue like that and I really appreciate all the good comments.

Finally, I walked away from the deal.

Too much hassle, not worth the time and potential additional problems.

 

[syjos]

Hi all,

Thank you for alle the input.
Lots of ways to deal with an issue like that and I really appreciate all the good comments.

Finally, I walked away from the deal.

Too much hassle, not worth the time and potential additional problems.

Good decision. You'll find the right boat soon.

 

[BandB]

Hi all,

Thank you for alle the input.
Lots of ways to deal with an issue like that and I really appreciate all the good comments.

Finally, I walked away from the deal.

Too much hassle, not worth the time and potential additional problems.

The best deals you ever make are often the ones you don't make. When in doubt, don't.

 

[Pete Meisinger]

Back to the original post. The time to walk away is the first time you catch the seller in a lie.

Although it is close, an omission is not a lie.

There are many ways to walk away from a deal, fewer ways if you have made a deposit.

Leave a loophole in the contract. Like pending survey, pending finding suitable financing, or insurance or dockage, etc. The operative word being "suitable".

pete

 

[firehoser75]

I bumped into my marine insurance broker at the Vancouver Boat Show last week. She informed me about many current issues with being able to obtain boat insurance, to say nothing about it being "affordable".
From what she said, it would be advisable to include a provision in an offer to purchase like: "subject to the purchaser being able to obtain suitable insurance coverage".
In this way, not only would it give the buyer a way to legally walk away, but depending on the boat itself (age, make/model, location, etc.) you may not actually be able to obtain "suitable" insurance!
To the OP, glad you feel that you made the correct decision. If you feel that way, then you definitely made the right call (for you).

 

[BandB]

I bumped into my marine insurance broker at the Vancouver Boat Show last week. She informed me about many current issues with being able to obtain boat insurance, to say nothing about it being "affordable".
From what she said, it would be advisable to include a provision in an offer to purchase like: "subject to the purchaser being able to obtain suitable insurance coverage".
In this way, not only would it give the buyer a way to legally walk away, but depending on the boat itself (age, make/model, location, etc.) you may not actually be able to obtain "suitable" insurance!
To the OP, glad you feel that you made the correct decision. If you feel that way, then you definitely made the right call (for you).

The standard contracts don't require provisions for reasons to walk away. They simply allow you to an agreed upon date to either buy or reject, but you can reject for any reason you want. Now, should then allow enough time to survey and then deal with insurance.

 

[syjos]

From what she said, it would be advisable to include a provision in an offer to purchase like: "subject to the purchaser being able to obtain suitable insurance coverage".
In this way, not only would it give the buyer a way to legally walk away, but depending on the boat itself (age, make/model, location, etc.) you may not actually be able to obtain "suitable" insurance!

Most savvy sellers, whether boats or real property, would be hesitant to accept an offer with too many contingencies. It's not a firm offer, too many ways out for the buyer.

And if the contingency is written correctly, and an offer came in with less contingencies, the first buyer would have to drop the contingency or walk.

A lot depends on whether it's a buyers market or sellers and desirability or rarity of the boat or real property.

 

[TripleGGG]

Absolutely the right move.

Hi all,

Thank you for alle the input.
Lots of ways to deal with an issue like that and I really appreciate all the good comments.

Finally, I walked away from the deal.

Too much hassle, not worth the time and potential additional problems.

 

[Andy G]

Sometimes walking away from the deal is not the end.

We have had our present IG 36 for about twelve years now.We had agreed the purchase price & were closing the deal to buy the boat subject to the usual surveyors report.

It turned out the boat had osmosis. After talking to the surveyor we felt this was not a deal breaker, however some financial adjustment would have to be agreed. The owner would not budge, so after talking to the broker we withdrew and got the deposit back.

We spent the next three months looking for a similar boat, nothing on the market that matched 'our' boat. Over this time we watched as the owner first had the boat lifted, then had the blisters ground out and the boat anti fouled.

I think he thought that would get around any further inspections. In our waterway it's a small world, the brokers & shipyards pretty much know what is going on and why.

Eventually, the broker wanted the boat off his mooring as it wasn't getting much interest.This forced a decision from the owner

To cut a long story short, out of the blue four months later the broker approached us to know if the osmosis could be sorted were we still interested.We still had not found a boat that matched the IG, so we were back in. One week later, with a quote for a complete bottom job from our yard agreed, we settled.

The thing is, had the negotiation taken place at the time of the survey, we would not have insisted on the full bells and whistle job that was ultimately agreed. Our surveyor initially suggested about a $10,000 reduction, the full job came to over 21/2 times that.

After all this time I look around similar boats and think none of them offer what we have. Still I suppose all of you probably think that way, well most of you.

 

[Joe Pica]

JUST an FYI for general knowledge. One should always pick your own surveyor. Go onto the SAMs web site and pick several surveyors and interview them and get references. Do not take the broker's recommendation. The surveyor works for you, however also to the standards of the SAMs accreditation. However there is a broad range of expertise as in any trade.
phenolic hammer soundings can reveal any serious core issues as well as heating the hull and then using infrared thermography imaging e.g. FLIR E85 to detect hull deck defects from moisture intrusions without destructive testing. Most surveyors will do an in yard hull defect survey separate from a full survey with sea trial. A buyers broker represents you and your interests and have fiduciary responsibility to you however there is no recourse against brokers outside of California and Florida which are the only two states that licenses brokers in any manner and issuing in the civil courts.

 

[Mako]

Sounds like you lost confidence in the owner's willingness to disclose defects... If the non-disclosure has really poisoned the sale, then the sooner you walk the better.

I think you hit the nail right on the head. Buying a boat should be about confidence - which is a combination of facts (like surveys and objective data) as well as your gut feeling.

I think it's a big mistake to ever get emotional when it comes to buying a boat. You should hate it and be disgusted and find everything terrible about it. Then fall in love with it after you own it.

We've got three pages of comments here from the OP and others about his lack of confidence. Walk away, bud!

Hell, I walked away from a new construction at a shipyard when I lost confidence. We already went through design and shop drawings and I lost thousands, but it was the right decision.

 

[dotgone]

Walk away. If you sacrifice the 10% so be it.. YOUR MONEY WAY AHEAD.
The surveyor can verify your problems/issues/concerns.
Unless the info it is all a hoax...
I would claim my deposit, pay the surveyor and thank the big guy for the warning. Buying the boat is only half the coast of ownership.
Fixing a problem boat can be very expensive.
again.. Walk Away.

 

[slowgoesit]

Walk away. If you sacrifice the 10% so be it.. YOUR MONEY WAY AHEAD.
The surveyor can verify your problems/issues/concerns.
Unless the info it is all a hoax...
I would claim my deposit, pay the surveyor and thank the big guy for the warning. Buying the boat is only half the coast of ownership.
Fixing a problem boat can be very expensive.
again.. Walk Away.

dotgone, the OP stated he walked away back in post # 36.

 

[Bryant]

Reasons to walk

Hi all,

We are about to buy a boat. After the initial showing that did not immediately reveal severe problems, and later some negotiation, we have signed a purchase agreement and paid 10% into the broker's escrow account. Now we are awaiting the survey and sea trial. By chance two days after we signed the agreement, we got the information that the boat has had significant issues with water ingress from the deck. These problems were not new, they seem to be in existence since the boat was new, and there was one repair trial by the company in the beginning. The boat is now ten years old. Two years ago the owner was told that that need an extensive repair where parts of the deck need to be removed and so on. However, they decided to do some temporary repair and to move on. So far their temporary fix seem to have solved the problem or just kept it under control. However, when we saw the boat it had been on the hard for a couple of months and it was covered. So water ingress from rain or seawater was not a problem for some time, maybe time enough for these areas to dry up.
During the whole negotiation, nothing was said about that.
I am pretty worried about this and I hope the surveyor is going to find these areas.
If there is a real problem, can we just walk away from this boat and get our money back?

Thanks,
Chris

I assume your contract has a “contingent on sea trial and survey” clause. For so many reasons, do not buy this boat!

 

[Waterman]

Slow goes it,
Many people on forums read the last posting and want to voice their opinion , even thought the entire story has changed, but they did not have the inclination to read the “whole story”. I have to laugh when someone responds to a for sale item that is 5 years old. Go figure ......

 

[syjos]

Slow goes it,
Many people on forums read the last posting and want to voice their opinion , even thought the entire story has changed, but they did not have the inclination to read the “whole story”. I have to laugh when someone responds to a for sale item that is 5 years old. Go figure ......

I agree 100%

Or post a suggestion or idea that has been made previously by someone else.

 

[BandB]

I think you hit the nail right on the head. Buying a boat should be about confidence - which is a combination of facts (like surveys and objective data) as well as your gut feeling.

I think it's a big mistake to ever get emotional when it comes to buying a boat. You should hate it and be disgusted and find everything terrible about it. Then fall in love with it after you own it.

We've got three pages of comments here from the OP and others about his lack of confidence. Walk away, bud!

Hell, I walked away from a new construction at a shipyard when I lost confidence. We already went through design and shop drawings and I lost thousands, but it was the right decision.

If it doesn't feel right, it probably isn't right.