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Thank you everybody -

I have some experience sailing (sailboats) but not a lot.
I have a good amount of RV experience (motorhomes). I was going to retire in a motorhome, but the confluence of retiring baby boomers and "houseless people" has made that choice a bit too crowded and popular. Thus more and more laws are being written to limit them, and only in the desert can you be free.
I discovered the Great Loop and bells went off in my head. Mostly flat water and mostly slow. I can plan for half the time in a slip and half on anchor. I can still have a movable house that can stay or go as I wish. And a boat doesn't need tires!

BTW - I researched Barracuda house boats. Very roomy but how do you anchor? I don't see any with windlasses. So if you're going to anchor for a windy night (even in a protected waterway), what are they doing? And how do they pull up a heavy anchor/chain?

Mark
 
mpkoontz48 said:
Thank you everybody -

I have some experience sailing (sailboats) but not a lot.
I have a good amount of RV experience (motorhomes). I was going to retire in a motorhome, but the confluence of retiring baby boomers and "houseless people" has made that choice a bit too crowded and popular. Thus more and more laws are being written to limit them, and only in the desert can you be free.
I discovered the Great Loop and bells went off in my head. Mostly flat water and mostly slow. I can plan for half the time in a slip and half on anchor. I can still have a movable house that can stay or go as I wish. And a boat doesn't need tires!

BTW - I researched Barracuda house boats. Very roomy but how do you anchor? I don't see any with windlasses. So if you're going to anchor for a windy night (even in a protected waterway), what are they doing? And how do they pull up a heavy anchor/chain?

Mark
Click to expand...


They pull the anchor chain by hand. If you have 200' out your a better man than I am.
 
mpkoontz48 said:
I've been curious about the I/O drives -

Do they reduce thru-hull holes? Meaning, do they intake engine water?

Mark
Click to expand...
Our engine takes in water thru the inlet in the skag. It circulates thru the engine and goes back out thru the bottom of the outdrive. The outdrive is the only thru hull opening on our boat. Everything else is above the waterline.
 
mpkoontz48 said:
Out boards -

I know outboards can do the loop, but do they every make the jump to the Bahamas?

I've always considered outboards as flat-water engines, so I have no knowledge of how they could be used in larger (32+) boats. Any examples?

Mark
Click to expand...

All the time.
 
fgarriso said:
product-protection.jpg__395x204_q85_crop-scale_size_canvas_subsampling-2_upscale.jpg


And yes they will do rough water. This is 900 HP!:socool:
Click to expand...

Wifey B: We have triple 300 Yamahas on our Contender which we have for employee use. :)
 
One point everyone missed, and it can be an expensive one. Buy a boat close to home. If you are on the Great Lakes don't even look at a boat in Texas or Florida (although there are a lot of them), unless you are ready to leave the dirt home the day after you buy and load everything you are taking along and go to the boat. Bringing the boat home can cost a fortune, making several pre-cruise trips to the boat is also prohibitive.

Another "must have" for a tight budget cruiser is a generator. Especially if there is fix up stuff that needs power. (saws, sanders,120 volt lights) away from a marina. These repairs are far easier at a dock but can be done on the hook. A single guy can convert the "V" berth into a shop so you will definitely need an aft cabin.

Really nice older Albins can be had for less than $40,000, almost all with Ford Lehman diesels. Check the Albin Owners Group website. Don't be afraid of all the bad press the Taiwan Trawlers get. They are well built heavy, seaworthy trawlers. Just buy a good one. The windows often leak and the teak decks need upgrading generally but isn't that what you are looking for?

It costs about $1,000 a month to own a boat in the 35 - 40 foot range at a marina. Probably twice that for the first one or two years. Fuel will be your smallest expense.

Don't leave the dock for the loop without some savings. You really should have a minimum of $10,000. $20,00 would be better. I'm not saying you can't substitute a good credit card with a fairly high limit, but credit cards demand repayment. (they are funny that way).

Personally, I have a very marketable skill. (I am an R.N. and not above doing CNA work) I can easily hire on at almost any destination and earn enough to cover marina fees and living expenses and get the credit card paid down in a couple months. Is this an option for you?

Although, personally, I love the sound of gassers, but definitely go with diesel. The gassers nickel and dime you to death. ALSO!! don't even look at a stern drive!! Also known as I/O, There isn't one built that can handle a heavy slow boat for the long haul. They can't generally be repaired and replacement is always around $2,000.

GO FOR IT !!

pete
 
Anchoring any stock vessel can be easy or difficult... houseboats no different and many cruise the loop every year.


I own an Albin and wouldn't arbitrarily say they are well built or seaworthy...they are in a group of vessels that have a very "opinionated" following...good and bad...and I have plenty experience tearing one apart to basics and many other type boats as well. from hull rebuilds to major systems.


Outdrives can be a blessing or a curse..... maintained well and ther provide better maneuverability and can make draft a lesser issue...but there are several failure points on them that bear close watching, some with more water entry points than others. Like all boats and all systems...tradeoffs.


I agree the popularity of RVing is taxing existing places to prk...but don't think boating on the loop will be any better. plenty of places with marina/slip shortages and it seems to be accelerating. I hear of more boaters switching to RVs than the other way around...but heading south in a boat during the cold months can be a guessing game of anchor because I can't get into a marina?
 
Pete Meisinger said:
One point everyone missed, and it can be an expensive one. Buy a boat close to home. If you are on the Great Lakes don't even look at a boat in Texas or Florida (although there are a lot of them), unless you are ready to leave the dirt home the day after you buy and load everything you are taking along and go to the boat. Bringing the boat home can cost a fortune, making several pre-cruise trips to the boat is also prohibitive.

Another "must have" for a tight budget cruiser is a generator. Especially if there is fix up stuff that needs power. (saws, sanders,120 volt lights) away from a marina. These repairs are far easier at a dock but can be done on the hook. A single guy can convert the "V" berth into a shop so you will definitely need an aft cabin.

Really nice older Albins can be had for less than $40,000, almost all with Ford Lehman diesels. Check the Albin Owners Group website. Don't be afraid of all the bad press the Taiwan Trawlers get. They are well built heavy, seaworthy trawlers. Just buy a good one. The windows often leak and the teak decks need upgrading generally but isn't that what you are looking for?

It costs about $1,000 a month to own a boat in the 35 - 40 foot range at a marina. Probably twice that for the first one or two years. Fuel will be your smallest expense.

Don't leave the dock for the loop without some savings. You really should have a minimum of $10,000. $20,00 would be better. I'm not saying you can't substitute a good credit card with a fairly high limit, but credit cards demand repayment. (they are funny that way).

Personally, I have a very marketable skill. (I am an R.N. and not above doing CNA work) I can easily hire on at almost any destination and earn enough to cover marina fees and living expenses and get the credit card paid down in a couple months. Is this an option for you?

Although, personally, I love the sound of gassers, but definitely go with diesel. The gassers nickel and dime you to death. ALSO!! don't even look at a stern drive!! Also known as I/O, There isn't one built that can handle a heavy slow boat for the long haul. They can't generally be repaired and replacement is always around $2,000.

GO FOR IT !!

pete
Click to expand...
Thanks Pete - A couple of questions:

1) You said $1000 per month to own... What does that figure cover?
2) You said $10k (savings) before leaving for the loop. Is that "on top of" the $2700 a month SS payment? Note: I plan on slips only half the time.

Work: I will be 67 and retired when I go. But I work as a can "contractor" CAD jockey if I need to. But personally, I really need to find a "cash" business (if I need to work) so it won't affect my SS payment...

Mark
 
psneeld said:
Anchoring any stock vessel can be easy or difficult... houseboats no different and many cruise the loop every year.


I own an Albin and wouldn't arbitrarily say they are well built or seaworthy...they are in a group of vessels that have a very "opinionated" following...good and bad...and I have plenty experience tearing one apart to basics and many other type boats as well. from hull rebuilds to major systems.


Outdrives can be a blessing or a curse..... maintained well and ther provide better maneuverability and can make draft a lesser issue...but there are several failure points on them that bear close watching, some with more water entry points than others. Like all boats and all systems...tradeoffs.


I agree the popularity of RVing is taxing existing places to prk...but don't think boating on the loop will be any better. plenty of places with marina/slip shortages and it seems to be accelerating. I hear of more boaters switching to RVs than the other way around...but heading south in a boat during the cold months can be a guessing game of anchor because I can't get into a marina?
Click to expand...
I think the people leaving boating may find their choice "not that good" when they get there. Again, I want the freedom to stay for 90 days, or leave the next day if I want. Overcrowded camping spots NEED reservations now. But it seems a quiet river of "spot" can most times be found if you look (on the loop).
I'm kind of looking for a boat with a bad generator because I really what to go BIG with solar to eliminate that NEED to be at a slip. [But I'd have a portable generator for power tools and emergencies.]

Mark
 
mpkoontz48 said:
....

Work: I will be 67 and retired when I go. But I work as a can "contractor" CAD jockey if I need to. But personally, I really need to find a "cash" business (if I need to work) so it won't affect my SS payment...

Mark
Click to expand...


I'm not Pete but... you can work as much as you desire once you reach full retirement age and not loose any benefits. You will pay taxes on the income. And if you earn enough part of your SS income will be taxed also.
 
mpkoontz48 said:
I think the people leaving boating may find their choice "not that good" when they get there. Again, I want the freedom to stay for 90 days, or leave the next day if I want. Overcrowded camping spots NEED reservations now. But it seems a quiet river of "spot" can most times be found if you look (on the loop).
I'm kind of looking for a boat with a bad generator because I really what to go BIG with solar to eliminate that NEED to be at a slip. [But I'd have a portable generator for power tools and emergencies.]

Mark
Click to expand...


Not sure if it has been mentioned, but each state has its own rules for how long an out-of-state vessel can stay in their state before they are subject to their own state registration. Since each state's rules are different, you will need to check carefully with each as you travel.
 
Hi my wife and I sold our house and properties and bought a boat and prepared it to go looping. Sadly she passed away. I now live on the boat in titusville Florida. Come visit me at titusville municipal marina for a week. I'll show you the ropes and you can see for yourself then if that is what you want to do. I live on as and some retirement
Lemmeknow 407.325.8663....⚓?
 
As a sailboat owner I like sailboats. The 6' draft of my 40' boat is somewhat of a problem and I don't even consider doing the whole loop in it. Iv'e been aground numerous times and you can blame me or not, but sometimes it was just unavoidable due to currents, winds etc. A power boat/yacht can be expensive and comfortable, but I don't like the 2 - 3 miles to the gallon that some of the bigger 35 - 40 foot boats get. Even motoring I get at least 7 miles per gallon of diesel fuel. It just takes me longer to get there. The downside of diesel is the odor will never go away, but it is one of those things that after while a person gets used to, and I don't even notice it any more except when first getting on the boat after an absence. Unless you have a deep pocket just about any boat less than new is going to cost some of your budget in maintenance.
You need to accept that. You should consider also the costs of such things as safety equipment if going offshore. Doubtful at 40K the boat will have a life raft. Also doubtful that it will have all the other necessary safety equipment that insures your safety. Vhf Radio, EPERB. chart plotters, Radar Watermaker etc. Not to discourage you, but just to do your research of how it's done. My situation maybe 20 years ago. In the loop there are times you may be offshore. In the river system it is essential that you know the procedures for going through the locks. What to do when a tow is coming from the front and one is coming from the back and they are about to meet where you are.
Been there, done that at night, and it'is pretty scary. I also have a smaller sailboat that
only draws 42" inches and could probably do the great loop when conditions are right and would be a lot cheaper. If you are interested islankman@gmail .com
 
The loop is a whole different ball game than ocean cruising. Easy in some power
boats but somewhat difficult for the rest of us. Doing it in a sailboat, bridges is problematical due to low bridges. Carrying the masts or shipping them is required for most of the rivers until you get to Pickwick lake if not doing the Mississippi all the way down. After Pickwick it might be possible to do some sailing, but is it worth it? Its sort of like having a Radar or autopilot. Not too useful on the rivers.
 
mpkoontz48 said:
How do you wash dishes if you don't have 1 sink for warm soapy water soaking dishes, and another sink for rinsing into?
Click to expand...


You either: 1) wash the dishes & drain the sink, then rinse them all; 2) use a plastic dishpan for either washing or rinsing. A double sink takes up needed counter space, which is why many folks just cover the extra sink. I use a plastic bowl from Walmart instead of a dishpan because it takes less space & less water. Note: how you will wash your dishes is a minor question that you will solve the best way possible once you are living aboard.


Dollar values have changed since I cruised full-time in the 90's, but back then I knew couples who lived/cruised in Latin America as low as $100 monthly, though typical budgets were $500-$1000. These were folks on sailboats with auxillary diesels, & the boats ranged from very small to 40'+luxury yachts. My budget of $1,000 was considered luxury level & included dining out in port, though we most frequently anchored out, though we did rent a mooring in La Paz, Mexico one winter & a dock in Cartagena another winter. We all ate well & had a great time & drank plenty of margaritas (I made mine with Crystal Light). I think it might be more practical to consider traveling mostly via sail in more southerly latitudes, where the anchorages are plentiful & free, the booze is cheap & there are lots of other friendly cruisers (including single women). Good medical/dental care is very reasonable elsewhere in the world, too. I still go back to Costa Rica for some medical/dental, even though I have excellent insurance. Consider expanding your horizons, & if you've got 5 years before hauling anchor there's still time to play entrepreneur & grow your nest egg/income streams. My recommendation for #1 on your To Do list is to visit your local library & devour all the cruising books you can find. Even if not on the shelves, your librarian can order what you need. Before videos I used to check out a 16 mm. projector & borrow films for family viewing. My 2nd recommendation for your list is to take as many relevant classes as you can find. My late skipper & I studied not only attended every relevant lecture we could find, but took classes for several years--sailing, marlinspike, medicine at sea, weather, navigation, sailmaking/repair, ham radio, etc. You'll learn skills & make friends; you will also learn about yourself & what you really want to do the rest of your life--
 
To the OP

I am a frequent lurker here and an infrequent poster. I am chiming in on this post because I have in common with you that I am planning on doing the loop my first year of retirement and am just not quite ready to do it yet.

Being in dreaming mode, without having done it, I have read quite a few books and posts on the loop. It seems that you have been given some great advise here. I am surprised that two sources of information have not yet been mentioned to you. The first is Captain John ( Capt John's Cruising America's Great Loop ) . If you are looking to do the loop on a budget, you might want to read every word of his web page and blog. He has also written several books on the subject.

He is a huge advocate of not having to spend too much to be able to do the loop. He even rents boats out for the loop for those who are scared to take the plunge.

An example of his advise is to do the math on fuel usage. As soon as you choose a boat, you have also chosen how much it will cost you to do the loop. With side trips, 6,000 miles might be a safe estimate. So a 2 mpg trawler paying $4 per gallon will spend $12,000 per year on fuel. A dual engine gas planing or semi displacement boat could easily cross $20K to $30K for one year on the loop. On the other side, a sailboat with the mast down getting 6mph might only cost you $4,000 in fuel.

I personally don't look at the world the same way that he does. However, it insights are still valuable. My first divergence with him is that I am just not a sail boater, with or without the mast down. He has a huge preference in that direction and you will hear all of the arguments for that with him. The second difference is that I am currently happily married for quite a few years. So my ultimate loop experience and live aboard life will be for two. I don't think that Captain John's lifestyle quite works with an Admiral on board. That being said, you mentioned that you are divorced. So you may have more in common with his thoughts.

The second source of information is Americas Great Loop Cruisers Association. https://www.greatloop.org/ They have all kinds of info including thoughts on what boat to use.


They have fall and spring rendezvous, that include a day where you get to walk on all the volunteers boats and ask questions about their boat and how they like it with relation to the loop. I do plan on attending this.

IMO I don't know if I have ever met a boater who didn't think that their boat was the best. I also have met very few boaters who didn't openly or secretly want a different boat. It is the nature of it and why you have received so many different opinions.

My best.
 
Just because you have a fast boat, doesn't mean you have to go fast. Drive a typical cruiser at sailboat speeds and you will probably get pretty much equivalent MPG.

At cruising speed my boat gets about 3 MPG, but at 6 knots it'll double that. Add the current when going downstream in the center of the country and the mileage can be pretty good.

If you're retired, what's the rush?

As for the comment about buying close to home, depending on where you live, buying a boat from somewhere else can save you enough money that even with the cost of transport, you still come out ahead. Plenty of people do the loop and then sell the boat at the end (usually in the south) at a price just to get rid of it.
 
ssobol said:
Just because you have a fast boat, doesn't mean you have to go fast. Drive a typical cruiser at sailboat speeds and you will probably get pretty much equivalent MPG.

At cruising speed my boat gets about 3 MPG, but at 6 knots it'll double that. Add the current when going downstream in the center of the country and the mileage can be pretty good.

If you're retired, what's the rush?

As for the comment about buying close to home, depending on where you live, buying a boat from somewhere else can save you enough money that even with the cost of transport, you still come out ahead. Plenty of people do the loop and then sell the boat at the end (usually in the south) at a price just to get rid of it.
Click to expand...
My plan is to shop/buy down south when I retire. I'll just go to where the prospective boat is (probably Florida) and stay there until I leave (one way or another) in my RV.

Capt John's numbers seem to indicate the sailboat hull goes thru the water easier (cheaper). Even comparing a single engine trawler and twin trawler (same speeds supposedly) the twin uses more fuel. But I understand your point: If it takes 20 hp to push a boat thru the water at 7 kts, it shouldn't matter (much) if it's a big or small or multiple engines. It needs (mostly) the same amount of fuel to make 20 hp.
 
JohnnyCache said:
Hi my wife and I sold our house and properties and bought a boat and prepared it to go looping. Sadly she passed away. I now live on the boat in titusville Florida. Come visit me at titusville municipal marina for a week. I'll show you the ropes and you can see for yourself then if that is what you want to do. I live on as and some retirement
Lemmeknow 407.325.8663....⚓?
Click to expand...
Thanks JohnnyCache -

I won't be there for 5 years yet, so STAY ALIVE and I'll call you then. :)

Mark
 
Oldsarge said:
As a sailboat owner I like sailboats. The 6' draft of my 40' boat is somewhat of a problem and I don't even consider doing the whole loop in it. Iv'e been aground numerous times and you can blame me or not, but sometimes it was just unavoidable due to currents, winds etc. A power boat/yacht can be expensive and comfortable, but I don't like the 2 - 3 miles to the gallon that some of the bigger 35 - 40 foot boats get. Even motoring I get at least 7 miles per gallon of diesel fuel. It just takes me longer to get there. The downside of diesel is the odor will never go away, but it is one of those things that after while a person gets used to, and I don't even notice it any more except when first getting on the boat after an absence. Unless you have a deep pocket just about any boat less than new is going to cost some of your budget in maintenance.
You need to accept that. You should consider also the costs of such things as safety equipment if going offshore. Doubtful at 40K the boat will have a life raft. Also doubtful that it will have all the other necessary safety equipment that insures your safety. Vhf Radio, EPERB. chart plotters, Radar Watermaker etc. Not to discourage you, but just to do your research of how it's done. My situation maybe 20 years ago. In the loop there are times you may be offshore. In the river system it is essential that you know the procedures for going through the locks. What to do when a tow is coming from the front and one is coming from the back and they are about to meet where you are.
Been there, done that at night, and it'is pretty scary. I also have a smaller sailboat that
only draws 42" inches and could probably do the great loop when conditions are right and would be a lot cheaper. If you are interested islankman@gmail .com
Click to expand...
Earlier, someone here suggested a motorsailer, and I dismissed it as being "even more" maintenance for me. But after reading Capt John's site, and "thinking smaller" I started looking at motorsailers again and I found a good layout. The Cape Dory 300 looks small inside, but it's enough I think. And if you "tent off" the cockpit, and put patio furniture in it, it gives the configurable space I was wanting in a trawler... (Note: the CD cockpit is full width, no seats molded in.) So I was toying with demasting it in Florida, storing it, and doing the loop as a powerboat. Then when I've crossed my wake, I'd step the mast and (perhaps) try the Bahamas run. (I don't want a bluewater boat.)
The only problem is these CD 300 seem quite pricey to me even though they're old. But I have time to shop...
 
Carl Martin said:
The 70's to 80's Mainship 34 is a decent trawler that can be bought very reasonably. Typically come with a single Perkins that is reliable & less costly to work on than many brands. As with all trawlers of that age you need to check the decks & cabin for water intrusion. Here's a couple of examples:

https://sarasota.craigslist.org/boa/d/palmetto-1981-mainship-34t/6906540721.html
https://spacecoast.craigslist.org/boa/d/new-smyrna-beach-34-mainship-1984/6933015525.html
Click to expand...
Yes, my fallback is either the Mainship 34 or the Marine Trader 34 (single).

Mark
 
mpkoontz48 said:
~~~~
Do you think this could make the jump to the Bahamas?

Mark
Click to expand...
It's only 2 hours from Lauderdale to Bimini @ 30 mph. A better question might be "Where do you go from there?"
 
See if this helps on some of your questions. This is for a 35' "displacement trawler".

Data Input

Waterline length in feet:30
Beam at the waterline in feet:14
Hull draft in feet (excluding keel):3.5 feetVessel weight in pounds:25000 lbs Engine Horsepower:150 HPNumber of engines:
1Total Engine Horsepower:150 HP Engine R.P.M. (max):
2400 RPMGear Ratio:2:1Shaft R.P.M. (max):1200 RPM
Number of shaft bearings (per shaft):2
Desired speed in Knots:10 knots



Speed & Power Calculations

Basic displacement speed and horsepower requiredDisplacement hull speed (1.34 X sqrt of waterline length):7.34 KnotsMinimum horsepower required at propeller(s) for Hull speed:54.5 HP


Calculations based on desired speed and available HPHP required at propeller(s) for desired 10 knots speed:125 HPEstimated maximum speed with existing 150 horsepower:
This is the speed we will use for the propeller size.10.36 Knots At this point it is important to note that all of the calculations above are based on full RPM and HP. Most engines are rated to run at a percentage of thier full RPM. This is what will determine your maximum cruising speed.
 
Last edited:
mpkoontz48 said:
The Albin is a fine choice, but for "basically camping" in it. I'm also trying to LIVE in it as my only "home." This is what "lives" means to me:
Shower/bathroom
Cooking space
Fridge/freezer space
Hot water
Click to expand...

Lacking hot water/shower and a proper couch for watching TV (but not the other requirements) is why I am selling and looking to move to an MT30/34. But for you campers out there . . . you can't better this one!
 
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