New Granite Counter Tops

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oceancrosser

oceancrosser

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
50
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Kristine
Vessel Make
DeFever 53 POC
Good Day All,


We have a DeFever 53 and are considering replacing all the countertops (galley and three heads).


I have a bid for granite but some of my fellow boaters are advising me to stay away from granite and choose a quartz type material. Of course it's not their money they are spending.:whistling:



Has anyone had any negative experiences with granite?



Thank you,


All the best,


Rusty

DeFever 53 POC
Iuka, MS
 
Granite works fine for us, including some granite trim in the salon that is only about 4" wide. The mfg tried to talk me out of it (after the options were selected, the grand total price established and agreed to, on the basis that it would crack. I told them that wouldn't be my problem and suggested they do a good job reinforcing it. (They also tried to get out of bull nose.) But, everything has worked out just fine. Another friend spec'd granite on his boat, but got marble, which is much more porous and stains easily -- he found out when a guest to his boat christening left a glass of red wine (with a little on the base) on his counter. The builder (different from mine, but one of the well-regarded Taiwan yards) wouldn't do anything for him.
 
This is the "pushback" I am getting. "It will certainly fracture or break" however no one has granite on their boat.. they just heard this.:confused:


Thanks for replying so promptly.


Rusty
DeFever 53 POC
Iuka, MS
 
Love our granite (black with blue/silver streaks) counter with undermount sink. Installed it 4yrs. ago when we rebuilt this boat. We use it as a cutting block and routinely put hot pots and frying pan on it.
 

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Granite needs to be sealed and quartz doesn’t. That is the big maintenance difference. As to whether or not is can/will crack is another question.
 
We had granite on our last boat, and all recent Nordhavns have granite. We also have had it in three houses. I've never hear of any cracking, but Nordhavns are heavily built boats. It will only crack if poorly supported.


That said, do consider whether you are pushing the builder beyond their capabilities. If they have never seen granite on a boat, I'd be worried. You will live with their learning curve.
 
Comodave said:
Granite needs to be sealed and quartz doesn’t. That is the big maintenance difference. As to whether or not is can/will crack is another question.
Click to expand...

Spray once a week .... 15 seconds.
4 yrs, two round trips Toronto - Bahamas, no cracks.
 
oceancrosser said:
Good Day All,


We have a DeFever 53 and are considering replacing all the countertops (galley and three heads).


I have a bid for granite but some of my fellow boaters are advising me to stay away from granite and choose a quartz type material. Of course it's not their money they are spending.:whistling:



Has anyone had any negative experiences with granite?



Thank you,


All the best,


Rusty

DeFever 53 POC
Iuka, MS
Click to expand...
Granite has fallen out of favor in the housing market and is now a minus to a Housing price. Its hard to spot garbage and will break dishes.
 
"Granite has fallen out of favor in the housing market and is now a minus to a Housing price. Its hard to spot garbage and will break dishes."

As a home builder I completely disagree with this statement. Granite has become expected in our market and products that wouldn't break dishes would be considered inferior. (laminate)
 
We build and sell new homes. Granite is a natural product and we warranty for one year only. Quartz is a man made product and we warranty our work for ten years. 'nuff said.
 
I put quartz in my previous home, and I have granite in my current home.
My preference is quartz. It is permanently sealed and my carbide scribe will not scratch it. I can scratch the granite with a screwdriver in places.
Depending on the color of either dirt may be hard to see. They will BOTH break dishes but I can only remember us dropping and breaking one glass in 10 years. So that's a non starter.
In Connecticut, quartz is (10 years ago) less expensive than quartz and granite dealers are few.
Here in Florida, granite shops are extremely plentiful, therefore much less expensive than up north, at least in my experience.
 
This is one of my pet peeves. Much of what is called granite is not actually granite. In particular the black "granite" counter tops are actually a stone called larvakite. Granite consists of the minerals orthoclase, plagioclase, quartz and biotite or hornblende. Depending on the source of the granite it will be either a mix of white (or very light gray) from the orthoclase and plagioclase, clear (quartz) with flecks of black (biotite and hornblende) or white and pink (oxidized orthoclase and plagioclase with clear quartz) with black specks (biotite and hornblende. Granite is never black. The light colored minerals (plagioclase, orthoclase and quartz) make up 90+ percent of any granite.


I am 100% confident of my comments since I taught mineralogy and igneous petrology for my entire working career as a professor of Earth Sciences and geochemistry.


Granite is pretty tough unless the slab you get had a natural fracture in it. Remember, pretty much all actual granite has been around for at least 10s of millions of years and more likely 100+ million years. As long as it is well supported it won't break UNLESS you twist it or hit it hard in an unsupported spot. Hitting it hard would be something like giving it a good whack with a 3-4 pound hammer. Then it will break because it is brittle. The finer the grain size in a typical granite the tougher it will be. As far as scratch resistance goes granite is pretty good. The quartz is harder than any steel but the plagioclase and orthoclase can be scratched by hard steels. Carbide will scratch every part of granite. If you failed to scratch a piece of granite with a carbide tool you just weren't trying.


The only downside of granite on a boat is the weight. Granite weighs 3-3.5 times what a plywood/formica counter does and about 1.5 times what Corian does. However, if you want light weight, you can make a composite granite counter from 1/4" or less granite glued to an aluminum honeycomb. Granite glues very nicely with epoxies.
 
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geoleo said:
Granite has fallen out of favor in the housing market and is now a minus to a Housing price. Its hard to spot garbage and will break dishes.
Click to expand...


What a load of crap!


In the high end of the housing market Granite is still the preference, Quartz has gotten better but cannot compare in iridescence.


The "industry" loves working in quartz as it almost eliminates the fracturing issues associated with some real stone tops.


To the O.P. I think if you have the right configuration and allow for flex and pick a stone that is not veined your probably fine.


HOLLYWOOD
 
When the market is strong (not currently), I invest in high-end ($8M -$20M) spec homes in west LA. In that admittedly rarefied market segment, it has definitely fallen out of favor. And, since those type homes set the standard of "ultimate luxury" for other segments, I don't doubt that granite is falling out of favor (maybe not in an easily perceptible way), and will continue to do so.
 
MYTraveler said:
When the market is strong (not currently), I invest in high-end ($8M -$20M) spec homes in west LA. In that admittedly rarefied market segment, it has definitely fallen out of favor. And, since those type homes set the standard of "ultimate luxury" for other segments, I don't doubt that granite is falling out of favor (maybe not in an easily perceptible way), and will continue to do so.
Click to expand...

If granite in the kitchen is what it takes to cause a price drop in such a home the value must really plummet if the don't like the color of the paint in the 8th bedroom :)

PS. What the Kardasians (or anyone else) find as haute decor has never really concerned me :)
 
I've got granite on our Eastbay and quartz at home. The boat came with it, and it does require sealing. I spec'd Silestone quartz for the house to avoid staining and maintenance. Either would likely be fine on your boat provided the install was done right. But you'd want to know that cabinetry is able to hold the weight and not allow the material to flex or come loose under bad conditions.

You might also want to consider weight and how it might affect trim. It'll depend on the thickness. 3/4" might be 12#/sqft. 2" can be upwards of 30#/sqft. A simple example might be a galley counter that's 2' deep and 6' wide. 3/4 vs 2" would be 144# or 360#, quite a difference. Factor that into how it's going to get onboard too!
 
In concrete countertops I believe they put some rebar in for structural support. I would be concerned about the rebar rusting in a saltwater environment. Maybe not, but it might be a problem. Besides the weight may be an issue since they tend to be thick countertops.
 
I'd be more concerned about cracking. Seems like concrete would be asking for more trouble than granite or quartz. At least with a granite/quartz product you're not looking a lot of curing time and issues related to that. From what little I've read the weight seems on-par with stone type products, but would certainly vary based on content of the mix.
 
[QUOTEThe quartz is harder than any steel but the plagioclase and orthoclase can be scratched by hard steels. Carbide will scratch every part of granite. If you failed to scratch a piece of granite with a carbide tool you just weren't trying.
][/QUOTE]

I tried hard to scratch the quartz. It didn't.
The granite scratched with little effort. Not all of it but the black specs did.
Win to quartz.
 
jleonard said:
I tried hard to scratch the quartz. It didn't.
The granite scratched with little effort. Not all of it but the black specs did.
Win to quartz.
Click to expand...
I try to avoid abusing surfaces, regardless of their composition. My wife, on the other hand... Thus quartz at home, mainly to avoid staining problems. But 5 years now and all the Silestone counters are still perfect. The only place we put granite was a laundry room counter, and that was because the supplier had off-cuts from other jobs. We just paid for installation.

Which, as a side note, is always a good thing to check if you want to put a fancier counter on something. Most counter/tile shops are going to have left-overs from other jobs. For a small counter area it might be a real bargain compared to selecting a whole slab of your own.

One other point to consider is counters on boats often have an upward lip around the perimeter. Either as part of the material itself or some sort of edging. The heads in ours don't, but the galley has a teak rail around it. There's also a lip of granite around the openings for the in-counter freezer and dry storage. They make for a nice areas to keep things from rolling around a bit when under way, without being 'in the way' when using the galley.

Be sure to factor touches like that into the plan. I shudder to think what the added expense would be to not only replace the granite in our EB47 but also to re-do the wood rail and lip sections. Lots of really precise cuts translates into a lot of added labor and time on-site.
 
Comodave said:
Granite needs to be sealed and quartz doesn’t. That is the big maintenance difference. As to whether or not is can/will crack is another question.
Click to expand...
Yes, twice a year granite must be sealed with silicone. We had lots of granite in our former dirt home. It took about 20 minutes to seal the surfaces. Granite has been installed in I'll bet hundreds of thousands of homes.
 
geoleo said:
Granite has fallen out of favor in the housing market and is now a minus to a Housing price. Its hard to spot garbage and will break dishes.
Click to expand...
And quartz is softer?
 
Thanks to all those who have contributed to this thread. I truly appreciate the advice.



There were several compelling reasons for us deciding to use quartz versus granite.


1) Fortunately the DeFever 53 provides a significant amount of counter space with an exceptionally long area dividing the galley and the salon. Although not impossible, this area was going to be a challenge making sure it was supported enough to hold a large (heavy) plank of granite.


2) Distributional weight was a consideration too. Since the galley is located on the port side, I would be forced to counter-balance this with additional weight on the starboard side and I already have several hundred pounds of lead on the starboard side now. I didn't want to add more.


3) Durability! I like the ruggedness of granite, but you can't beat the in-destructiveness of quartz. When we were getting granite samples I was amazed how little effort the petite sales women used with a small hammer to provide us with pieces to take to our boat.



4) Although not a big deal and since we have granite in our dirt home, maintenance was a concern. I don't mind doing the work to maintain our boat, but heck..., why not do something "maintenance free"! It would free me up to do some other task assigned by the admiral.


We have accepted the increased cost of quartz but since we are talking about less than 70 square feet to complete the job, the price difference was less than 2 boat units. Yes, I could have figured out something else to do with the extra money, but what's the old saying.. "happy wife.. happy life".


Again, thank you all for helping me. Hopefully I can provide some before and after pictures.


Travel safe,


Rusty Bliss
"Kristine"
DeFever 53 POC
Iuka, MS
 
MYTraveler said:
When the market is strong (not currently), I invest in high-end ($8M -$20M) spec homes in west LA. In that admittedly rarefied market segment, it has definitely fallen out of favor. And, since those type homes set the standard of "ultimate luxury" for other segments, I don't doubt that granite is falling out of favor (maybe not in an easily perceptible way), and will continue to do so.
Click to expand...


Any ideas why?
 
catalinajack said:
Yes, twice a year granite must be sealed with silicone. We had lots of granite in our former dirt home. It took about 20 minutes to seal the surfaces. Granite has been installed in I'll bet hundreds of thousands of homes.
Click to expand...

DuPont granite sealant products last much longer. Our house based countertops are approaching 6 years and still impervious.
 
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