Modern Retro Trawler

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Once I get through the 'toy shop' I am ready to go back to my boat.
 
mako, take lots of pictures for the "interesting boats"
 
@choices,

Just looked up your blog and I gotta say "WOW" I bookmarked it as a reference and I will dig into it today. Thank you so much for posting.

Todd
 
@Mako,

I really tried to convince my wife that we should go to that show as it's not very nice weatherwise here in North East Ohio right now. Unfortunately we could not make it work with our schedule. If they have the Trawlerfest in Baltimore again we'll be there for sure. I'd love to meet anyone from this forum that attends.
Todd
 
Trawler search first boat

Good Morning Everyone,

I think I found the first boat my wife and I are going to look at. It's a 1983 GB 36 located in Larchmont NY. It's an 8 hour drive from where we live but we are always up for a nice road trip. The boat is on yachtworld if you want to check it out.

I called the broker listed and spoke with him. He said the boat is basically a "time capsule" and that it is very solid but has not been updated. This might be the boat for us since I would like to install modern electronics and whatnot.

I failed to mention in my previous posts that I plan on doing all of the work myself. I am a Automation Technician (fancy word for maintenance guy in a factory) and am very capable. I've already purchased books on marine diesel engines and boat systems.

The one concern I have is the teak decking. The internet says these leak. Can a moisture meter help me out here? I asked the broker if the decks were soft and he said you can't tell because of the teak decking.

Todd
 
I think the OP is asking about 2 totally different projects. He wants to do the loop with his family, AND he wants to restore an old woodie. Both great ideas but kind of mutually exclusive. The restoration will mostly be him and his check book, unless his son and wife are also into this project, in which case it could be a bonding experience or a source of division. If the family is looking for a boating adventure and he goes the restoration route it will be like telling them...."Yes, lets go boating....in 3 years", in which case the older say may have moved on.

If you want to loop with the family do it now. After that's over, if you still want to do a restoration, go for it. There will always be old boats that need work. There will not always be a cohesive family unit with the availability and willingness to tackle the loop together. Just my two cents.
 
@Benthic2

Sorry for the confusion, yes it does seem as if I'm asking about 2 different things here. I'll clarify:

My wife and I have a time goal of 2 years to get on the loop. We have money saved up now that would allow us to get a nice old GB in good condition with some room for immediate repairs/upgrades. My wife would like us to get something this summer so that we can learn to cruise up at Lake Erie (we are 1 hour south of Cleveland/Vermilion) as we have zero trawler experience. I've sailed a bit on the lake in a 25' Hunter.

It would only be me working on the boat. I have 2 boys (21&22yo) who have work and relationships and are not into a boat project like I am.

It will be only my wife and I doing the loop with the occasional guest staying for a couple of days perhaps while we're somewhere cool (Charleston comes to mind).

With all that being said we are definitely leaning towards a "ready to go" boat.

The only thing we go back and forth on is do we push it back another year so that we can save more money and get a newer boat with more modern amenities. This is where my whole "restomod" question came from. We absolutely love the look of a classic GB 36. The first time we were at a marina up at the lake my wife saw one and said "OMG what is that, I LOVE that boat"... I had always wanted to do some sort of a boat adventure and right then and there I knew it was possible!

Thanks for all the back and forth, I really appreciate it. I came here for a reason.

Todd
 
Keep in mind, if you get an older boat that has some systems you want to upgrade, you don't necessarily have to do everything at once. If the existing systems are serviceable, you can upgrade things a little at a time while still using the boat. Particularly if you start out locally and have to take the winter off after the first season (instead of leaving for a loop right away). That gives you a whole 6 months to freeze your butt off upgrading things before the next season.
 
There tends to be a trend in boats to try to do everything to perfection and new owners go overboard with upgrades. One of the Nordhavn's I did move around a lot had one of those owners. He did a few things the boat really needed , but also did a bunch of stuff that albeit nice did not add a bit to the value of the boat or change much in function. He probably spent at least 50 grand more than I would of in his tenure with the boat. Often times people upgrade boats for the voyage they dream to take, and when its all done they never use the boat as they had wanted. Buy the boat most have said, the nicest you can afford and use it for some time to see what it really needs. In the process you can save a boatload of cash.
Hollywood
 
Agree with the general consensus here regarding size for a family of three as well as your talking about two projects: restoration refit and a cruising adventure.

I’ve been inspired a few nice examples of older classic trawlers going through a modernization. Refit. Most of these are focused on cosmetics and the modernization of appliances, systems, etc.

It does go to show how you can bring an older vessel up to current design and lifestyle standards.

Modernization of a Lord Nelson Victory Tug

https://www.dwell.com/article/lucy-the-tugboat-the-brooklyn-home-company-b0136173

A terrific Kadey Krogen refit

https://www.passagemaker.com/technical/belle-of-the-west-refit

We’re on a similar journey with our Kadey Krogen 54 while living aboard.

I’ll just say everything takes longer and costs more than planned but we’re able to tackle projects in chunks that keep us cruising.

https://www.instagram.com/mvfortitude/
 
@airstream345
Just gave you a follow on the gram. Lovely boat you have there. I appreciate you weighing in and your advice is solid. This is the way as they say. I've been warned by many not to be the guy who spends all his time docked or on the hard "upgrading" the boat never to set sail.

I looked into getting a KK39 after we established a budget for a newer used Nordic Tug 34. It would have to be an older 39 bc of the cost. I think that might be to much boat for now bc I am only planning on doing the loop then most likely the islands.

Todd
 
ORR first, know that I am not in love with GB because of all the exterior teak then, realize the broker said it's a 'time capsule'. To me that means to everything needs to up dated on the interior. Per updating the electronic ..... you are looking at about $30K. my last 2 boats, I learned to live with the included electronic while knowing the charts are not updatable and using up to date paper charts.

For me, if it had a wood hull and teak decks, I'd walk away.
 
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Maybe it's because I have a limited budget, but I have always been from the school of "buy the boat, use the boat, make sure it fits my needs BEFORE spending too much money on it"

Jim
 
Regarding the '83 GB36 the OP referenced, currently for sale on YW. It appears to be in good overall condition, and the Ford Lehman 120 is a pretty much bullet proof engine if maintained properly. Pics of the mechanical spaces are pretty limited.

Get a hull and mechanical survey if you are interested in purchasing.

Make sure whoever does the mechanical inspection also does oil samples, to include engine oil, transmission oil, and engine coolant.
The ad doesn't say whether the boat has keel coolers, or raw water cooling with heat exchangers. A 1983 could be either way. I prefer keel coolers, but some prefer heat exchangers. Either way, . Some particular areas to look at: Windows in these vintage GB's tend to leak. Also, I would personally factor in the cost of replacing the fuel tanks, and removing the teak decks. The teak decks, unless you are lucky enough to find that they bonded them to the fiberglass in this particular boat, instead of screwing them down, tend to leak, letting water pool on the top of the steel fuel tanks, causing deterioration of the fuel tanks, and necessitating their eventual removal. The tanks in this boat are 40 years old, they are probably in need or replacement either now, or in the near future. Having a single engine makes the replacement less difficult, but you're probably looking at $20k, and that's if you do it yourself.

This boat probably doesn't appear to have a generator, or a 12v/120v inverter, so be aware that you will not have any 120 power unless plugged at the dock.

The engine appears to have been "spray painted" sometime in the past.

The electronics are dated, but if serviceable, should be fine for the loop. Consider picking up a tablet and download Navionics for up to date navigational capabilities.

No mention is made of an autopilot, which, for the loop may not be absolutely necessary, but I would not have a boat without one personally.
The boat appears to be suitable as is, for limited cruising, but I would suggest the following upgrades/repairs. Prices are estimates:

  • Thoroughly inspect top of fuel tanks for ANY signs of leakage from failed teak deck fastening, repair as necessary. Worst case, remove decks, $5k to $20k, depending on whether you do it yourself, or hire it out.
  • Install a small generator, or go solar with inverter, and plussed up battery bank. $10k to $20k depending on who does the work
  • Replace fly bridge spray shield (the supports are installed, but the shield is missing) $200 to $500.
  • Consider purchasing a dingy. A good small (8 - 10') dingy with, say a 4hp outboard can be had used in the neighborhood of $3k to $4k. It appears that the Seller used to store a dingy on the aft cabin top.
  • Evaluate your ground tackle (anchor, chain and total rode). It appears to already have a Rocna, probably a Rocna 20 (33 lbs), which is an excellent anchor. Chain is probably 5/16". I would want at least 50' of chain and 200' of 1/2" 3 strand nylon. In any case, regardless of apparent condition, REPLACE the existing rope, unless the rode is all chain. Don't ask my why I recommend this.
With the dated electronics, original tanks, teak decks, and no generator/inverter, I think the boat is a little overpriced. If I were in the market, provided nothing major shows up in the visit, I would probably offer in the $65k range, leaving me some room for improvements. My offer would be contingent upon obtaining insurance, successful inspection and survey and obtaining financing, if that is your intent. Possibly on obtaining suitable moorage as well.

Take it slow, not all upgrades have to be done at once. Start using the boat first, and figure out which upgrades YOU really want/need. Best of luck with your search, and let us know how visit works out.


Edit, our last boat was a GB36.:D:dance:
 
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Good luck with that GB! It looks like you could use it for while before any serious $ needs to be spent. At its age, you can't expect any part of it to be "as new", but you can expect with 2495 engine hours, that things have been attended to in order to keep it running. If you are DIY enough, you will know quickly whether this is a good boat, just old, or one that is headed down that "needs work" path. Don't be afraid to take lots of pictures, especially of places you can't actually see with the naked eye, like the tops of the fuel tanks.
 
Benthic2 said:
I think the OP is asking about 2 totally different projects. He wants to do the loop with his family, AND he wants to restore an old woodie.
Click to expand...


I hadn't seen where Toad mentioned wanting a wooden (hull) GB; just thought he said "classic" or similar. I'd have thought that could include GRP hull and maybe wood superstructure depending on year...

??

-Chris
 
ranger58sb said:
I hadn't seen where Toad mentioned wanting a wooden (hull) GB; just thought he said "classic" or similar. I'd have thought that could include GRP hull and maybe wood superstructure depending on year...

??

-Chris
Click to expand...


An '83 GB is definitely fiberglass. They made the changeover in '72/'73
 
@slowgoesit

Thank you so much for the detailed suggestion list. This would be the first boat I look at so I seriously doubt we'll make an offer but you never know. You are correct, it does not have a generator. Two of the biggest things I'm concerned with are the teak decks and fuel tanks. I've been doing a ton of research on old GBs and those two issues (along with the windows leaking) are the major ones. I've yet to see a good YouTube video of someone DIY replacing the tank on one of these. I've no doubt I could do it provided I have the place to do the work. Conventional wisdom seems to dictate that you use a fiberglass or steel tank not a plastic or aluminum.

There are plenty of videos of people doing the decks. Definitely looks like a PITA but I just got done with a kitchen remodel and had to scrap 5 layer of linoleum to get to the subfloor so I think I could handle it.

As for the electronics yes, I was thinking of going the tablet route as my wife has a new one. I would also like to learn how to read paper charts and guides. I would want to install a new depth finder just to be on the safe side.

I'll keep everyone in the loop on this. I appreciate all the feedback!

Todd
 
teak decks

I did want to add that although I am well aware of the issues with 40yo teak my wife and I really like the look of a teak deck and platforms. When I spoke to the broker on this particular boat he did say that the rubber in between the teak slats needs replaced. I watched a YouTube video of a guy doing this and it looks tedious but his end result turned out nice.

Most likely water has entered into the screws that are used to fasten the teak to the floor. It would be foolish to think a boat this age does not have that problem.

Todd
 
Greetings,
Mr. ort. From your post #37..." "OMG what is that, I LOVE that boat" ONE of the cardinal rules when boat shopping or boat buying. IMO, is DO NOT GET EMOTIONALLY INVOLVED".


Sorry to be so frank but falling love with a boat comes after the fact. Again IMO. As mentioned, you're looking at 2 different boats. One for immediate use, to do the loop and to get experience (you can't get any boat learnin' with her sitting on the hard awaiting repairs) and one to do your resto-mod. They MIGHT be one and the same but I very much doubt it.
 
ranger58sb said:
I hadn't seen where Toad mentioned wanting a wooden (hull) GB; just thought he said "classic" or similar. I'd have thought that could include GRP hull and maybe wood superstructure depending on year...

??

-Chris
Click to expand...

"classic" in GB speak, refers to the layout, not the hull material.
In 1983 all are Fibreglass
 
Hey Everyone,

Update on the boat search: we've found a couple of Marine Traders that we'd like to look at. One is a 1991 the other a 1984, both 34'. The 91 is in Ontario (5hr trip for me). These have that "Grand Banks" look that we really like. If anyone cares to look they're both on yachtworld. I'm gonna call about the one in Ontario tomorrow.

Todd
 
I just bought a well maintained "old 1979" IG 44. With both toilets not working.

Now replacing both.

Have some exhaust risers leaking, they're next.

Fix what needs to get fixed so you can get out on the water safely and have fun and learn to pilot.

Everything else can wait - :)
 
open_road_toad said:
I did want to add that although I am well aware of the issues with 40yo teak my wife and I really like the look of a teak deck and platforms. When I spoke to the broker on this particular boat he did say that the rubber in between the teak slats needs replaced. I watched a YouTube video of a guy doing this and it looks tedious but his end result turned out nice.

Most likely water has entered into the screws that are used to fasten the teak to the floor. It would be foolish to think a boat this age does not have that problem.

Todd
Click to expand...
Typically, if the caulk has failed so may everything else. Check for missing teak screw bungs, cupped degraded planks etc. And if water has entered via the screws, check tanks, fuel & water, and anything else under them. Original steel tanks can rust, check also the filler connections to the tanks.
Removing old teak, repairing decks,and revamping the deck where the removed teak was is expensive. As is fresh teak.
 
Basically anything you buy will need some sort of work or upgrade. Even a clean survey does not preclude this. For example, when I bought my boat it was listed as having radar. It did. And the surveyor verified its function. BUT, it was so old the display was a cathode ray tube! So, $6000 later (and that's with me doing 95% of the removal and new installation) I have a modern radar that I can depend on, and it has 'brains' to help me get a decent display.

Ensure that where upgrades or refits are needed it is something you can tackle yourself. I was quoted $2450 for the radar installation and managed to get it done for $400 plus my own "sweat equity".
 
2savage said:
For example, when I bought my boat it was listed as having radar. It did. And the surveyor verified its function. BUT, it was so old the display was a cathode ray tube! So, $6000 later (and that's with me doing 95% of the removal and new installation) I have a modern radar that I can depend on, and it has 'brains' to help me get a decent display.
Click to expand...


Could well have been that the original radar with CRT would have worked fine for the next 20 years or so...

Nothing inherently wrong with earlier radars...

-Chris
 
BruceK said:
Typically, if the caulk has failed so may everything else. Check for missing teak screw bungs, cupped degraded planks etc. And if water has entered via the screws, check tanks, fuel & water, and anything else under them. Original steel tanks can rust, check also the filler connections to the tanks.
Removing old teak, repairing decks,and revamping the deck where the removed teak was is expensive. As is fresh teak.
Click to expand...
Replacing teak decks is indeed expensive. I know a guy who had them replaced in last year in Mexico. 40-ish foot Baltic sailboat. I believe it was in the neighborhood of $35k.

Peter
 
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