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Old 01-22-2019, 09:05 PM   #21
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Migrating from a sailboat to a motor yacht or trawler. Much confusion.

Is there anyone still making a modern pilothouse like the Cherubini? Any of them with a modern plant like the Volvo IPS?

The Swift Trawler and others are similar, but Iím talking about where the cabin is the full beam, like the Cherubini Independence and the pilot house is narrower with a side door to access the foredeck.

I really like the look and layout of the Cherubini. (Ranger tugs are like tug versions of this concept, and Iím looking at them. Too bad they donít make a 40-50 footer with two heads and IPS.)
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Old 01-22-2019, 09:32 PM   #22
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You want a pilot house style boat with pod drives?
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Old 01-22-2019, 09:35 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Reformed-sailor View Post
Is there anyone still making a modern pilothouse? Any of them with a modern plant like the Volvo IPS?

The Swift Trawler is similar, but I’m talking about like the Cherubini Independence where the cabin is the full beam, and the pilot house is narrower with a side door to access the foredeck.

I really like the look and layout of the Cherubini. (Ranger tugs are like tug versions of this concept, and I’m looking at them. Too bad they don’t make a 40 footer with two heads and IPS.)
Before you get your heart set on an IPS drive boat, you might want to look where service facilities are and aren't. While I wouldn't say they are failure prone, if you accidentally hit a submerged object on plane, if the IPS is still attached, you will probably need some service. When you go off the beaten path (much of the Great Loop) you will probably find little to no support available. Not saying there's anything wrong with them, but just like a European motor, I would be hesitant to picking propulsion component that I likely couldn't get serviced in many of the places I planned to cruise.

Ted
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Old 01-22-2019, 09:44 PM   #24
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Isn`t the IPS designed to drop off if well struck by an object and retrieved after? And while it`s a different can of worms, don`t they come attached to a Volvo?
The McGregor sounds a good idea for a long solo trip. Then something else long term, with more creature comforts and size.
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Old 01-22-2019, 10:28 PM   #25
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Isn`t the IPS designed to drop off if well struck by an object and retrieved after? And while it`s a different can of worms, don`t they come attached to a Volvo?
The McGregor sounds a good idea for a long solo trip. Then something else long term, with more creature comforts and size.
Yes, it's my understanding as a safety feature, it will break off so as not to leave a large hole in your hull. Finding it is the first issue. Not sure if you can reattach it and how much the parts cost. Probably also requires a qualified IPS mechanic.

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Old 01-22-2019, 10:40 PM   #26
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I'd certainly agree with the IPS drives. They are a "high risk" feature that's just not needed for the most part. Of the friends that have them a high percentages are not real happy with them. Comments about failures and just running rough and "clunking".... and they are not the end all.
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Old 01-23-2019, 08:25 AM   #27
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A fly ridge wonít fit under the bridge clearances in the great loop.

Iíll check out MJM and Sabreís. Downeasters do fit the bridge clearance, much like express cruisers. But are they trailerable? Or do you think they are appropriate for a Panama crossing?
Au contraire, ref bridge clearance. Many flybridge boats like ours have done the Loop. Our minimum air draft (given the hardtop) is just over 16', another 1Ĺ' with the radar... The 19' minimum can't be all that hard to solve, given the number of flybridge boats that have done it already. (And I suspect Ted's boat is taller than ours, actually.)

I don't know that MJM, Sabre, Hinkcley, etc. make boats that are "trailerable" in the owner-does-it-routinely sense... but they're all likely more easily (less expensively) shipped than would be many flybridge boats that need their "lid" removed for that kind of over-the-road transit.

Not sure I'd consider the Panama Canal an "ocean" thing. Even Sea Ray SunDancers can make that transit... and I think I'd be more concerned about the long legs up the west coast... I wouldn't hesitate to run an MJM/Sabre/Hinckley across the Canal and then north...

But in any case, almost any boat that's decent for coastal travel could likely work. And there are lots of stories out there about Ranger tugs and C-Dories going back and forth from Seattle to Alaska. Seems fairly common, so if they can do it, I'd expect there are many others.

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Old 01-23-2019, 08:29 AM   #28
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Isn`t the IPS designed to drop off if well struck by an object and retrieved after? And while it`s a different can of worms, don`t they come attached to a Volvo?
The McGregor sounds a good idea for a long solo trip. Then something else long term, with more creature comforts and size.
There are also Cummins/Zeus (ZF) and ZF pod FWIW, versions...

I've seen pics of the inside of a McGregor. Doubt I'd be up for 6000 NM (or whatever our Great Loop is) in one... Even a Ranger 31 would be cramped (but better), but then there's two of us, and usually a critter of some sort...

Happens there's a nice looking Ranger 31 in our marina just now, new tenant since late Summer... Looks very decent, but haven't taken a tour yet...

-Chris
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Old 01-23-2019, 08:32 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Reformed-sailor View Post
The Swift Trawler and others are similar, but Iím talking about where the cabin is the full beam, like the Cherubini Independence and the pilot house is narrower with a side door to access the foredeck.

I really like the look and layout of the Cherubini. (Ranger tugs are like tug versions of this concept, and Iím looking at them. Too bad they donít make a 40-50 footer with two heads and IPS.)

Some in the 40-50' "motor yacht" category have that kind of interior and otherwise covered space, along with lower helms and side doors... if you can abide the styling.

-Chris
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Old 01-23-2019, 08:44 AM   #30
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I believe the original MJM boats in the 40'+/- range were designed so they could fit inside a standard container for shipping anywhere. I think they were originally I/o's, but also can come with IB, pod, and outboard configuration. Not cheap.
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Old 01-23-2019, 10:19 AM   #31
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I met a guy doing the downeast loop.
He had a big boat with zeus drives.
He had just gotten the boat having replaced a smaller one.
He wasn't happy and it wasn't because he was spending a $1,000 a day for fuel.
It was like the boat took the fun out of the trip.
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Old 01-23-2019, 11:15 AM   #32
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IPS are very prone to prop damage... and there are 4 of those to get buggered up. I have a close boating buddy that has replaced props a couple times and both were river or canal travel. One at lo speed canal travel.
The drive it self is very rugged. I was surprised there was no shaft damage w the high speed encounter w a log the size of a telephone pole.
I was also very impressed w/ the prop shop that repaired these to like new condition - you couldn't tell they had been turned "inside out"
We were unable to remove the piece of log even after haul out w/o out removing the props. That duo-prop arrangement just wedged it in.
Removed about 12 ft of the log to get the boat into the haul out slip - what you see is the "smaller" section that remained.

The issues he has had w/ the Volvo's is whole 'nother story.

I'll take my single screw w/ keel & sand shoe and twin thrusters any day!!
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Old 01-23-2019, 11:52 AM   #33
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Maybe look at MotorSailer with easily deck stepped mast. You can motor and only raise a sail in perfect (to you) conditions.

Look at Nauticat, Fisher, Schucker, Cabo Rico Pilothouse, Island Packet, etc
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Old 01-23-2019, 12:20 PM   #34
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Ranger Tugs has exactly what you are looking for, but the initial orders are high.

You can look at some of the details here. Boat is priced new at where you want to be in a few years.

The TugNuts ‚ÄĘ View topic - Ranger Tug R41
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Old 01-23-2019, 12:50 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reformed-sailor View Post
Is there anyone still making a modern pilothouse like the Cherubini? Any of them with a modern plant like the Volvo IPS?

The Swift Trawler and others are similar, but Iím talking about where the cabin is the full beam, like the Cherubini Independence and the pilot house is narrower with a side door to access the foredeck.

I really like the look and layout of the Cherubini. (Ranger tugs are like tug versions of this concept, and Iím looking at them. Too bad they donít make a 40-50 footer with two heads and IPS.)
Take a look at the Helmsman trawlers. Interior layout of the 43 is almost identical to the Cherubini. Being a semi cusom build, you might be able to get IPS drives.

Ted
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Old 01-23-2019, 01:39 PM   #36
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Take a look at the Helmsman trawlers. Interior layout of the 43 is almost identical to the Cherubini. Being a semi cusom build, you might be able to get IPS drives.

Ted
I may be a bit biased on the Helmsman... but, I would strongly suggest you give it a hard look. Exceptional build quailty as a real value.

While not offered with IPS, it is extremely maneuverable with the single engine and bow and stern thrusters.
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Old 01-23-2019, 02:56 PM   #37
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What is your interest in IPS drives? Frankly IMO those drives are for gadget minded occasional boaters who want (and need) the help of fingertip electronics to maneuver around the dock.

Real captains like straight prop shaft drives: single with a bow thruster or twins with or without .


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Old 01-23-2019, 03:49 PM   #38
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I should add, my budget is flexible but Iím targeting boats that sell today for around $1M-$1.5M, assuming that in 2023 the 2019 built boat will have lost %30 of itís value or more.

No contest.

If you have that sort of coin and know anything about cats for me the decision would be so very simple


https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...no-20-3223885/
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Old 01-23-2019, 05:47 PM   #39
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When pod drives first came out, there were quite a few issues, many of them computer related. The newer gen systems are much better, but you are still looking at annual haul outs for lower end service. IE, the cost to maintain is higher than a shaft with a prop.

Some people with newer systems have 0 issues, others don't. Part of the reason is many fast planing boats such as express cruisers use their boats a few times per month in the Summer, don't understand the systems, and are not willing to invest the $ to keep these systems happy.

Pods (Zeus or IPS) are more efficient than a prop and a shaft, and are designed mainly for faster speed planing boats. They are not a good fit on a slower speed trawler, and that is why you don't see them on FD and most SD slower speed cruising hulls.

I have been there, and would not go back there.
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Old 01-24-2019, 08:35 AM   #40
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"Maybe look at MotorSailer with easily deck stepped mast. You can motor and only raise a sail in perfect (to you) conditions."

A fully battened main allows great versatility as the main dioes not beat itself to death luffing.


For raising and lowering a mast a tabernackle was the preferred method , but it is an in port operation.

In the 1800's the Thames Barges used a lutchet , which was a mast that pivoted , the weighted foot came up thru a deck hatch.

A man and a boy could lower the mast passing under bridges , with little loss of speed .
Counterbalance was the key.

Sort of hard to figure a fwd cabin arrangement that would work tho.
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