Mainship 430 or Bayliner 4788

[Seevee]

All,

Trying to decide between a Mainship 430 or a Bayliner 4788 and need advise. I could almost flip a coin, but am leaning toward the Bayliner. GF is leaning toward the Mainship. She likes the aft cabin and the step down galley. I like the Bayliner cockpit, aft fly bridge for storing a larger dinghy and the pilot house. Both of us could be talked into either.

Here’s some other differences:

MAINSHIP BETTER
Price About 10% more but not enough to make a difference

Side walkway Mainship: Superior, all the way around while Bayliner has Partial, and tricky walkway from helm door to cockpit.
Master Stateroom Mainship: Aft cabin, much more room, GF loves it, I could care less
Handed easier with walk around
Engine Yanmar 370, I have one now, but Cummins 370 is not bad.
Generator Mainship: Kohler, Westerbeake in Bayliner will probably need work
Engine access Mainship: Good, Bayliner Tight, but salon panels remove
Marina costs Mainship: at 43 ft Bayliner: is 47 ft, and over 50 overall
Shore power Mainship: Bow and Stern Bayliner: Side
Operate Single Mainship with full walk around at a lower lever for lines.

BAYLINER BETTER
Salon Bayliner, Large open area,
Galley Toss up but GF likes the galley a few steps down
Pilot house Bayliner Excellent additional area for folks and piloting. None for Mainship
Overall looks Bayliner Looks stately, Mainship: looks cute
Performance Small edge to Bayliner, a bit faster and less fuel consumption
Dinghy storage Bayliner Crane for overhead, Mainship: has tip up on swim platform
Aft cockpit Bayliner excellent with overhead shade, Mainship none.
Generator access Bayliner in lazaret, Mainship: Really TIGHT
Place for kayak Bayliner: Can use crane from upper deck Mainship: Really tight
Place for bike Bayliner: Can use crane from upper deck
Mainship: Doable, but tight
Boat Lift Bayliner would probably work ok with my 40K lift.
Mainship would be tight.
Maneuverability Same
Draft Same

Other thoughts or ideas?

 

[Datenight]

Seevee,

From what you have described I would lean toward the Bayliner. Berthing costs however will be more (as you know) every year.

Are you buying the boat together or is it all on you? Does it look like you will be together forever? Sorry to be so personal but to me those are important points.

I wish you the best.

Rob

 

[rslifkin]

I'm surprised that the numbers point to the Bayliner being faster. It's lighter, which explains the better efficiency, but the Mainship 430 hull looks pretty much like a full planing hull, while the Bayliner has softer chines, etc. Looking at the weight numbers, the Mainship is a little on the heavy side for a faster 43 footer (36k dry) while the Bayliner is shockingly light at just under 30k dry.

 

[smitty477]

I'm surprised that the numbers point to the Bayliner being faster. It's lighter, which explains the better efficiency, but the Mainship 430 hull looks pretty much like a full planing hull, while the Bayliner has softer chines, etc. Looking at the weight numbers, the Mainship is a little on the heavy side for a faster 43 footer (36k dry) while the Bayliner is shockingly light at just under 30k dry.

"while the Bayliner is shockingly light at just under 30k dry."
If you are getting this from the powerboat guide it has always been inacurate - a dry unloaded 47 comes in at over 32K and they typically can weigh 38K pluis in the slings when loaded.

"I'm surprised that the numbers point to the Bayliner being faster."
21 to 23 knots WOT is a pretty good number for medium loaded 47 with a clean bottom and running gear. Cruise anywhere between 14 and 18 knots dependent upon your goals for the trip.

 

[Shrew]

The Bayliner gives you what looks like much more salon space. I love the access directly from the wheel house to the bridge. I like that you can store the dinghy on the bridge level as well. We are huge fans of the cockpit. We use the cockpit on our 350 more than the flybridge when at anchor. The Bayliner is starting to look like a pocket yacht, which is cool.

The 430 has nicer side decks. If you're not running AC, aft cabins get hot.

 

[ksanders]

I'm on my 4788 right now, and have never been on the Mainship, so I'm admittedly biased.

The lack of side decks on the 4788 is not a detractor, it is a positive feature in my opinion. Why??? More salon room. If you need to go from the pilothouse to the cockpit it's only a few steps away. Docking is easy as there is a nice cleat right outside either of the pilothouse doors.

Our pilothouse gets used a lot. Since it is so large with a full sized settee and helm, it is another place to hang out. I am sitting in my pilothouse right now as a matter of fact.

The covered large cockpit is another great place to hang out. If it's hot and sunny, or rainy, the cockpit is the place to be. We have a pair of chairs back there and enjoy sitting watching the world go by while at anchor.
If we want to be in the sun the huge flying bridge or the foredeck is the place to be.

The flying bridge level boat deck with the 750 pound capacity crane is hard to imagine being without. I can launch or retrieve our heavy Zodiac by myself in just a minute or two. It's out of the way and not blocking the great view from the cockpit, since it's not swim step mounted.

Lots of things to like about the 4788

There's a reason why there are so few for sale, and really good ones even more difficult to find.

 

[Bacchus]

We have a Mainship 34HT so similar in some respects.
We live the wide safe side decks but we do a lot of locking, docking and rafting and willing to trade inside space for ease of above.
Many cant understand "wasting" that space when it could add to more usable interior... especially true from PNW boaters that really appreciate interior space for Wx considerations.
So the answer is like other things... it depends... how you will use it and what are your must, wants and priorities.
That said I do like the look of the Bayliner and would love to get aboard one some day.

 

[rslifkin]

From the side view, I don't think the Bayliner side decks would be much of an issue for locking or docking. There's enough side deck plus you have the cockpit aft. No direct side deck to cockpit travel, but provided you've got at least 2 people on board, that shouldn't be a big issue.

That said, I do love my walkaround side decks. But I don't have a pilothouse (and therefore not as quick / easy side deck access from the helm), so that likely sways my opinions a bit.

 

[smitty477]

One of us often single handed our Bayliners - likely much more often then most. Typically we just stepped off the side from the pilothouse door where we had previoulsy left two lines temporarily looped off to that side cleat near the door. One came from the aft cleat and one from the fwd cleat so we had both in hand at departure.
When we needed to travel from the bow to the stern we walked back to the closest pilothouse door...down the half flight of steps ....and thru the saloon to the cockpit.
Never really gave it a thought as there was no drama,ladders, or jumping involved.
Please keep in mind that the Bayliner is a good 6 feet longer than the Mainship - if that should make a difference.

 

[AlanT]

From the side view, I don't think the Bayliner side decks would be much of an issue for locking or docking.

As a former 4788 owner I can agree with this, and with KSanders that in practice the lack of side decks is not a significant detraction in actual practice even single-handing - and we have never thought it was necessary (or safe) to use the 'ledge' to move from pilothouse door to aft cockpit as mentioned by the OP. We have only ever used that ledge to set a supplemental fender from the high hand rail when stationary and rafting since you can't reach that handrail from the top deck.

No one yet has commented on the quality of the interiors of the two boats. I am not familiar with the quality of the Mainship interior, but the 4788 is definitely plasticky with some exposed gelcoat and generally cheapish interior fittings (Veneers, Doors, Wall coverings). It didn't really bother me as long as the boat did what we needed. But eventually it did.

 

[smitty477]

As a former 4788 owner I can agree with this, and with KSanders that in practice the lack of side decks is not a significant detraction in actual practice even single-handing - and we have never thought it was necessary (or safe) to use the 'ledge' to move from pilothouse door to aft cockpit as mentioned by the OP. We have only ever used that ledge to set a supplemental fender from the high hand rail when stationary and rafting since you can't reach that handrail from the top deck.

No one yet has commented on the quality of the interiors of the two boats. I am not familiar with the quality of the Mainship interior, but the 4788 is definitely plasticky with some exposed gelcoat and generally cheapish interior fittings (Veneers, Doors, Wall coverings). It didn't really bother me as long as the boat did what we needed. But eventually it did.

"No one yet has commented on the quality of the interiors of the two boats. I am not familiar with the quality of the Mainship interior, but the 4788 is definitely plasticky with some exposed gelcoat and generally cheapish interior fittings (Veneers, Doors, Wall coverings). It didn't really bother me as long as the boat did what we needed. But eventually it did."

The finishes in our Bayliner's never affected any of our boating or boating plans.
YMMV

 

[porman]

I've been on both boats and am familiar with both. The Mainship is going to be 48 feet long with the dinghy tipped up. Ours is 52 feet long with the dinghy hanging flat from the davit. The interiors are about the same quality in my opinion, some gel coat showing, wood quality not like a Grand Banks. Top speed is about 17 knots, cruise is 8 or 9 at about 4 gallons per hour total. At the last haul out the operator said it was about 36,000 lbs and that was pretty loaded. We drive from the enclosed flybridge, so lots of going up and down steps. A pilot house would be better in that respect. My preference would have been a pilot house boat, but our Mainship came along at a price that we couldn't pass on. I don't regret that as we really love our boat.

 

[Comodave]

We looked at a 4788 seriously but what finally stopped us from proceeding was the engine room size or lack of. I decided that it was just too small and access wasn’t good. If it has the centerline panel modification then that would be better. But the boat has a lot to offer. Keep in mind that the hull is cored below the waterline so check it carefully.

 

[fgarriso]

It's YOUR choice your the one who has to live with it, and your mate.

 

[Graeme Walker]

The 30k weight on Bayliner 4788 is a stipped version, add options; airconditioning, FB fridge, generator, etc.... I had mine weighed last year, 24k back sling, 16k front sling, this was half diesel/water.

 

[BruceK]

You`re in trouble. GF likes the Mainship.
Putting it on paper to look at and decide is good. I do it when the choice is tight, it helps.
Do both have twins or just the Bayliner?
I`ve seen marina neighbours work on their 4588 Hinos, it`s not good. Only been on a Mainship 395(I think it was),ER was a crawl space for a python, this one must be way better.
I remember mouse fur interior linings in the 4588. Personal thing.
Mainships get bow slap at anchor. ? Bayliner. Is the owners cabin in the Bayliner the fwd one or is there a good size double behind it?
Good luck deciding. I used to allocate + and - marks to add up, but it`s just a guide, some +s are more important and get more weight, same for -s.

 

[Southern Boater]

I remember mouse fur interior linings in the 4588.

Ah, the good old mouse fur, aka Marine Hull Liner. Certainly was a popular choice in the late 80’s and early 90’s. It will do a reasonable job to prevent condensation in moderate conditions though and robust with cleaning products.

 

[ksanders]

The 30k weight on Bayliner 4788 is a stipped version, add options; airconditioning, FB fridge, generator, etc.... I had mine weighed last year, 24k back sling, 16k front sling, this was half diesel/water.

Yep, mine weighed 44K a couple times at haul out.

don't know where they came up with that 30K lbs number because I've never heard os a 4788 even close.

 

[Seevee]

Datenight: What an appropriate handle for asking person questions...

And, yes, that's important. The GF is pretty permanent, I've know her and been with her over 50 years... more on that off, but we've shared property successfully over that whole time, even when we weren't together. Non issue.


BUT, I still like to make her happy, but for the most part I do all the choosing.



All: The BIG issue for me is the lack of the cockpit. I suppose on the Mainship, I could put two chairs back there and rig up an umbrella. Or, over the aft stateroom I could also rig up an umbrella or Bimini which folks have done.



The pilot house is another thing... really nice for AC or heat if needed.



Interesting to note the weight on the 4788 is stripped down, which make my 40K lift more of an issue. I haven't installed that lift yet, so I may want to look at a bigger one.


Also, from the comments, looks like the 4788 is faster... by about 5 knots or more. Not a huge issue except when running large water like the gulf, or great lakes.


Kevin, thanks for being such a great source on the 4788, you have swayed me.


Another thing.... seems like getting a good 4788 is difficult now, but there's a few 430s out there. The age of the 4788 is getting up there and I don't want a project. The unknown is if and when the market will turn. Suspect once this Covid thing quiets down (late summer?) things will change and the wanna be boaters (and RVers) will sell their toys and head back to the bars.



Normally, it has been a buyers market with boating (and real estate, too), but right now, clearly a sellers market. And that makes the buying more of a challenge.

 

[smitty477]

Yep, mine weighed 44K a couple times at haul out.

don't know where they came up with that 30K lbs number because I've never heard os a 4788 even close.

"don't know where they came up with that 30K lbs number"
That would be for a completely base boat and dry - gas engines, no genset, no AC units, no washer/dryer, no flybridge canvas or entertianment center, etc.
Similar to the weights on the fully basic Bayliner 4588 and the real weights for the vast maojorty of them out there.

 

[smitty477]

You`re in trouble. GF likes the Mainship.
Putting it on paper to look at and decide is good. I do it when the choice is tight, it helps.
Do both have twins or just the Bayliner?
I`ve seen marina neighbours work on their 4588 Hinos, it`s not good. Only been on a Mainship 395(I think it was),ER was a crawl space for a python, this one must be way better.
I remember mouse fur interior linings in the 4588. Personal thing.
Mainships get bow slap at anchor. ? Bayliner. Is the owners cabin in the Bayliner the fwd one or is there a good size double behind it?
Good luck deciding. I used to allocate + and - marks to add up, but it`s just a guide, some +s are more important and get more weight, same for -s.

"I remember mouse fur interior linings in the 4588. Personal thing"
Bayliner 4788 master interior.

 

[smitty477]

Datenight: What an appropriate handle for asking person questions...

And, yes, that's important. The GF is pretty permanent, I've know her and been with her over 50 years... more on that off, but we've shared property successfully over that whole time, even when we weren't together. Non issue.


BUT, I still like to make her happy, but for the most part I do all the choosing.



All: The BIG issue for me is the lack of the cockpit. I suppose on the Mainship, I could put two chairs back there and rig up an umbrella. Or, over the aft stateroom I could also rig up an umbrella or Bimini which folks have done.



The pilot house is another thing... really nice for AC or heat if needed.



Interesting to note the weight on the 4788 is stripped down, which make my 40K lift more of an issue. I haven't installed that lift yet, so I may want to look at a bigger one.


Also, from the comments, looks like the 4788 is faster... by about 5 knots or more. Not a huge issue except when running large water like the gulf, or great lakes.


Kevin, thanks for being such a great source on the 4788, you have swayed me.


Another thing.... seems like getting a good 4788 is difficult now, but there's a few 430s out there. The age of the 4788 is getting up there and I don't want a project. The unknown is if and when the market will turn. Suspect once this Covid thing quiets down (late summer?) things will change and the wanna be boaters (and RVers) will sell their toys and head back to the bars.



Normally, it has been a buyers market with boating (and real estate, too), but right now, clearly a sellers market. And that makes the buying more of a challenge.

"Also, from the comments, looks like the 4788 is faster... by about 5 knots or more. Not a huge issue except when running large water like the gulf, or great lakes"
I do not know the Mainships speed - but this is fast cruise speed for the 4788 with a 12.5 RIB up top and towing a 19' RIB behind (17.5-18Knts)....

 

[South of Heaven]

The Mainship 430 seems too similar to your old Mainship. I'd go with the 50 foot Bayliner instead. Totally different rig.

 

[Bacchus]

Larry
Don't know if its important but one way to take out some of the emotions and he vs she is what I always recommend to newcomers ( I know thats not your situatuation)
Write down how you i tend to use the boat
What are your musts ( not negotiable)
What are your wants ( wouldne nice)
Don't wants

Trick is have the SO do the same separately
Then review, combine, compromise to get to one list both can support (frequently just do it her way or agree which aspects you take priority which she decides)

Then compare boats to the must, want, don't want list
If a techie or want / need to get anal about it spreadsheets, weightings for wants and rankings (scores) for each. You can do the math and see how the result comes out.
Doesn't mean you have to go with it if it doesn't feel right but it is a good way to get open discussions out in the open that helps avoids future remorse.

Good news is I dont think you can go wrong... lots of satisfied owners of both.

 

[Seevee]

"Also, from the comments, looks like the 4788 is faster... by about 5 knots or more. Not a huge issue except when running large water like the gulf, or great lakes"
I do not know the Mainships speed - but this is fast cruise speed for the 4788 with a 12.5 RIB up top and towing a 19' RIB behind (17.5-18Knts)....

Smitty,


So what kind of fuel burn did you have at this speed? Dont believe the Mainship will do 17 knots.


Talked to a guy with the Bayliner that implied that his high speed cruise in the 17 knot range burned over 50 gph, any truth to that?

 

[Seevee]

Larry
Don't know if its important but one way to take out some of the emotions and he vs she is what I always recommend to newcomers ( I know thats not your situatuation)
Write down how you i tend to use the boat
What are your musts ( not negotiable)
What are your wants ( wouldne nice)
Don't wants

Trick is have the SO do the same separately
Then review, combine, compromise to get to one list both can support (frequently just do it her way or agree which aspects you take priority which she decides)

Then compare boats to the must, want, don't want list
If a techie or want / need to get anal about it spreadsheets, weightings for wants and rankings (scores) for each. You can do the math and see how the result comes out.
Doesn't mean you have to go with it if it doesn't feel right but it is a good way to get open discussions out in the open that helps avoids future remorse.

Good news is I dont think you can go wrong... lots of satisfied owners of both.

Don,



Great idea. His and hers wish lists! Like it and will try it.

 

[Seevee]

The Mainship 430 seems too similar to your old Mainship. I'd go with the 50 foot Bayliner instead. Totally different rig.

Good point but that's one reason for going with the 430. I already know the boat, engines and generator. But the boat layout with aft cabin is a huge difference.

 

[rslifkin]

Talked to a guy with the Bayliner that implied that his high speed cruise in the 17 knot range burned over 50 gph, any truth to that?

That's definitely a high number, as a pair of Cummins 6BTA 370s won't burn 50 gph combined at WOT.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

I am partial to the pilothouse, so that would tip it in favor of the Bayliner for me. I'm sure St. Pete provides an abundance of nice weather, but I am sure there are times when Mother Nature pushes you inside to the lower helm. Hard to beat a real pilothouse for those times.

 

[porman]

Seevee, I'm happy to answer any 430 questions you have. Just send me a PM.