Long Stay Container Fees

The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
Status
Not open for further replies.
This is not rocket science.... I doubt it would take a few weeks to train them....just keep the politics and unnecessary requirements out.

Just like nobody said 'magically', nobody said ' instantly' ether. If they had been able to run three shifts without union interference, when I recommended over 50 years ago, there would have been time to train guys, as I have already mentioned. Howvlong do you think it takes. After all, none of the functions they do are rocket science.
 
So, how willing would you be to work second or third shift? It sucks but, hey, it is not you so to hell with those longshoremen and the quality of their family life.


MANY people work a second or third shift. I went thru my whole like working odd ball shifts and the back of the clock. If it's part of the job, then you work it.... or get senior to bid a better shift. And some people like those odd ball shifts. If one doesn't like it, get another job.



Back in my college years, I loved the third shift. Work 7 hours, paid for 8 and work work your sleep around to have days or evenings free.



It's whatever you sign up for.
 
It makes the sense that I and that other guy described. Check the history of lonshormen unions , then compare to autoworkers.
Longshore union also tend to be a bit more violent. They kinda shot themselves in the foot when they went to war with the IBEW and Portland Port management. The shipping companies had enough and just shopped shipping containers to Portland. The union never recovered. A lot of them were laid off.
 
Longshore union also tend to be a bit more violent. They kinda shot themselves in the foot when they went to war with the IBEW and Portland Port management. The shipping companies had enough and just shopped shipping containers to Portland. The union never recovered. A lot of them were laid off.

There you go! Thanks for corroborating what theyre like.
 
There you go! Thanks for corroborating what theyre like.
I suggest you take a look at the 60 Minutes piece on this problem that was broadcast on Sunday evening. You will find that the unions are NOT the problem, not even close. You might shocked at some of the things that are in play but it is not worker availability. You will also learn that this problem is not going away anytime soon. The worst? The shipping companies astronomical price-gouging.
 
G Captain had an article discussing collapsible containers such that they could be huge in reducing these movement backlogs.

Cool idea...wonder why it took so long.

Interesting reading the absolutely hysterical comments some are making.
 
"Yes, and cities are known for 5 guys leaning on their shovels while one guy works, all union members too."

Modern tech has changed this , there are now shovels that stand by themselves!
 
AS much as I would hate to support someone's continued off base ramp...the ports aren't "really" operating 24/7....at least not near full velocity.

My friend was just there on a cruise ship and saw exactly 1 lift operator and ground crew through most of the night.

Not only have an eye witness report but the maritime resources support what he saw...not mainstream chatter.

Even multiple sources report that many overnight pickup slots go unused as there are no trucks arriving to transfer.

It's not the longshoremen union, or the ships...it's the lack of arriving and departing containers from outside forces that seem to be furthering the backlog now.
 
If the next link in the chain is not operating 24/7 (they mostly aren't), then having the ports do so will be minimally effective at best. That is what I took away from the 60 Minutes piece.
 
And more than one here has said 24/7 isn't really the problem....it's moving containers once off loaded to out of the port....or making more room at the port which folding container s might help...but is down the road a bit in volume.
 
I thought it was the 47 year old one. Then and now, union thugs stymying ports. But if one is left wing, theyre fine with that. Apparently Biden....not so much. But since he's a DEM, the LSM wont condemn him for it.
 
I don't quite understand how some here expect a problem that by one report has been developing 50 years and by many has developed for 5 or 10 years will be corrected overnight. However, I can tell you as someone who receives goods daily and ships them daily although only out of the country every few weeks, we've seen a little improvement in the last couple of weeks. Companies with their own trucks picking up at ports have seen far more, companies such as Walmart, Target, Costco, and Home Depot.

I was looking at something in detail yesterday as I wondered why we weren't experiencing the shipping problems some are. Very simple. We don't look for the cheapest shipper. The average trucker makes less than $50k per year and many of those have no benefits. I found several listings of pay by company. In one list, 29 paid on average $70,000 or more. Most of those also have benefits. Every company we use is among those. 105 listed pay less. Some pay $31,000 per year. Oh, and why won't Walmart have shortages? $86,000 per year and full benefits. I talked a bit to our head of our transportation. We have for each of our major routes to each of our major customers one line that gets all the business and one backup. We do not shop rates for each load. With department stores, they've often chosen the carrier or it's been done jointly. We don't have issues shipping from Greenville SC to Macy's Distribution in Dallas, because the regular carrier does it every time. Our Transportation Director has spoken to our carrier who picks up in Los Angeles regularly and they have drivers picking up there now 24/7. Still night shifts not equaling day, but drivers about to haul from Los Angeles to the East Coast have no problems picking up at night. Frankly, they're glad to get out of LA before the morning traffic.

Now, I still hope for reform in trucking, even after citing the above numbers. The hours worked for the $70k get overlooked. I think encouraging more miles in today's world where they're monitored every mile is stupid. I do believe a conversion to hourly pay will happen gradually or I hope it does. The driver only controls the hours they work. They don't control the route, the waiting time, the traffic. Perhaps dispatch and routing would do better. Breaks and meals are regulated. If a driver takes 12 hours for a route that was predicted to be 10 hours, it's not the driver's fault. If they speed to do it in 11 hours, it is their fault and not good for any of us. Major trucking companies now do monitor speed. Three major problems are traffic bottlenecks, equipment breakdown (and parts shortages are a problem today) and time to get loaded and unloaded. We will receive after normal hours and you can't imagine how appreciative drivers are. Instead of returning at 7:00 AM they deliver at 9:00 PM and often they're off the following day or they get a full run which they couldn't otherwise.

As an aside. Savannah is hilarious right now, but they're working on it. Five satellite lots but truckers don't know yet where or how to pick up. Some cursing, some laughing, but at least effort to take care of things. They already have two major expansion projects under construction. We love Savannah as we do Charleston, although it is much smaller.

Now, who is in trouble for the holidays. Small mom and pops I'm afraid. Especially if their vendor doesn't have their own US distribution centers.

That does bring us to another anticipated trend and that is more distribution centers throughout the country.
 
B&B, I certainly dont expect it to be corrected overnite, or by magic, as one guy suggested. Indeed, I advocate a council of despair. Its simply yet another example of the genersl deterioration of the states. Its gradually turing into a third world sort of country, and getting to mote resemble places like Brazil. The sea ports and their decades old dysfuction are just standing out more right now, along with so many other sectors.
 
I think a major impediment to improvement is that profits for shipping companies have never been higher. If they profit from the disfunction, they are not going to be motivated to solve it. The good thing about high shipping charges is that it will encourage innovation and while it may take a while, the invisible hand will eventually prevail.
 
B&B, I certainly dont expect it to be corrected overnite, or by magic, as one guy suggested. Indeed, I advocate a council of despair. Its simply yet another example of the genersl deterioration of the states. Its gradually turing into a third world sort of country, and getting to mote resemble places like Brazil. The sea ports and their decades old dysfuction are just standing out more right now, along with so many other sectors.
Ah, Wellington, now we agree on something, the disfunction of our system of government although you did not state such explicitly. Fifty states, all with their own laws and regulations. States rights and all that made sense, according to some, when the Constitution and Bill of Rights were written but no longer when it comes to many issues but not all. Of course, what those issues may be and my postulate are just one person's opinion.

The pandemic rules are an example. There should be national rules, not this hodgepodge, ever-confusing joke of a system we are using. We can debate what the rules ought to be but, because this is a national problem, it should be a national solution. Here is another in the form of a question - why should the State of California be allowed to impose their will on the rest of the U.S. on air pollution standards for auto emissions? Pure insanity.
 
Now that I live in Florida, I am shocked states are still allowed to plow and salt roads during the winter.

It ruins the roads, salt pollutes and my tax dollars go to fix the problems.
 
Last edited:
Ah, Wellington, now we agree on something, the disfunction of our system of government although you did not state such explicitly. Fifty states, all with their own laws and regulations. States rights and all that made sense, according to some, when the Constitution and Bill of Rights were written but no longer when it comes to many issues but not all. Of course, what those issues may be and my postulate are just one person's opinion.

The pandemic rules are an example. There should be national rules, not this hodgepodge, ever-confusing joke of a system we are using. We can debate what the rules ought to be but, because this is a national problem, it should be a national solution. Here is another in the form of a question - why should the State of California be allowed to impose their will on the rest of the U.S. on air pollution standards for auto emissions? Pure insanity.

Equally, the EU thought there should be EU wide policies for the pandemic......turned out each country did what they wanted.
 
.......The pandemic rules are an example. There should be national rules, not this hodgepodge, ever-confusing joke of a system we are using........

Do you really think we could ever come to a national concensus on vaccines, masks and school children ?? We are having violence at the individual municipality level.....there is NO WAY would could ever get a national rule that everyone followed. Even before Covid we had divisive issues like abortion, capital punishment and gun control that would create a gridlock in our gov't.

Note: I was careful not to pick a side of any of those issues so I didn't trip the "political" alarm. My point is not that being pro or con on any of those issues is right, just that there are people that will NEVER concede on some of those issues so compromise would not be possible.
 
Greg is right, you'd never get a consensus, nor would you want national authority if you really thought it through, on boating, on COVID measures, on a million other things. Yes, state and local variation may be messy and chaotic but-- well, I live in South Dakota and my brother lives in Los Angeles. We might as well live on different planets. I don't know how he tolerates California and I thank God every day for South Dakota. I'll put up with some regulatory chaos.
 
And oddly, given the events of the past 18 months, I don't think I'd ever want to visit or live in Australia either now. Funny, I was in a pet food store a few days ago and an Australian guy started to sing the Star Spangled Banner and yelled God Bless America!
I'm kind of shocked at what's happening there lately. I guess the rugged Crocodile Dundee image was silly fiction. Yet another example that national and international variation is an incredibly messy but vital human habit. Sweden, Austria. South Dakota, California...
 
And oddly, given the events of the past 18 months, I don't think I'd ever want to visit or live in Australia either now. Funny, I was in a pet food store a few days ago and an Australian guy started to sing the Star Spangled Banner and yelled God Bless America!
I'm kind of shocked at what's happening there lately. I guess the rugged Crocodile Dundee image was silly fiction. Yet another example that national and international variation is an incredibly messy but vital human habit. Sweden, Austria. South Dakota, California...

Wifey B: I'd love Australia or New Zealand or Tahiti. Or Aruba or Antigua. :D
 
Two container updates. The LA ports have had great success in emptying containers, but now have an increase from 55,000 to 65,000 of empty containers waiting for ships to pick them up.

And, US exporters pushing for more scrutiny of the alliances I mentioned earlier. Alliances controlled 29% of the market 10 years ago and not control nearly 80%.
 
A couple of updates:

One directly impacting boat production. Resins of many types in shortfall. First, the majority of plastic resins used in the US were hurt terribly by last year's Texas freeze and shutdown. Then Ida cut the petroleum resins including those for boat production. This is impacting everything from polyethylenes to paints.

Fruits and vegetables in short supply and one reason is lack of refrigerated containers.

California had weight limits of 80,000 pounds for carriers. They just increased that to 88,000 pounds.

Oh and just to excite you all, Victoria's Secret estimates half their merchandise delayed. Now, looks to me like just building an excuse to deflect their mismanagement and lousy sales. Expect to see that a lot. There will be companies genuinely hurt by delays beyond their control. But expect to see at least ten times as many blame bad results on shipping delays. Only ask why their competition is doing well. I do feel for the mom and pop that uses small carriers and orders late and has no real control, but I don't feel the same about VS which has caused plenty of their own problems.
 
Do any states still allow tractor trailers to tow two trailers ? I wonder if allowing that would help move stuff out of the ports faster ?
 
Do any states still allow tractor trailers to tow two trailers ? I wonder if allowing that would help move stuff out of the ports faster ?
I have seen a few trucks towing 3 trailers in Utah, Wyoming I believe.
 
South Dakota allows multiple trailers. In fact every once in a while you see three, not just two. Always makes me nervous and glad I'm not the truck driver, but then we allow all kinds of things like giant Class A RV's towing a boat and a car, or street-legal ATV's -- and you can get a permit to drive at 14. Not my kids mind you, but other people's kids. I keep telling my boys no cell phones or driving until you're 25.
 
Now, looks to me like just building an excuse to deflect their mismanagement and lousy sales. Expect to see that a lot. There will be companies genuinely hurt by delays beyond their control. But expect to see at least ten times as many blame bad results on shipping delays.


In the early days of COVID lockdown NASA was getting slammed hard by contractors with claims for supply chain disruption. Some were legit (like for steel) but many were taking advantage of the situation to gain money or time to cover their own slipshod management. Of course that game only lasted a certain amount of time before the gov’t caught on. I just assessed and helped adjudicate a potential claim which has now been filed away in the garbage can (figuratively of course).
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom