Larger/older vs. smaller/new for the same price

[Caballero II]

What is CL? Damn it!!

Sorry, but please expand. It may be obvious to you, but I know Yacht World. I probably know CL, but not by that name. Would you really mind spelling that out? WTF is CL? Damn, I get that you're a pro (or at least think you are), but could everybody please spell out the entire name of whatever they're referring to before condensing it to an abbreviation?

Hi Nick

Open your wallet... "in your 60's" means [as you already professed] limited years of plentiful [boat worthy] health remaining. It's time for you to go boating... again!

Not sure of east coast [although born and brought up on the water... NY to Maine in 50's 60' to mid 70's]... but... in Nor Cal and north Pacific states there are still considerable numbers of good condition used boats for sale, at relatively correct prices.

I imagine you have been searching Yachtworld and other sales sites. CL is another great boat-sale venue. I've found that when looking for a great deal [of any sort] on CL one needs to visit CL every morning and night. The "good deals" usually only stay on CL for hours or maybe a day! And, your CL boat ad reviews can be specifically pin pointed at towns/cities in regions close or not too close.

Happy Boat-Search Daze! - Art

 

[socalrider]

Craigslist

 

[Art]

My mind, heart, and soul still want a 45+ foot boat, with delusional dreams of long-distance blue-water cruising. But my body is telling me to wake up and smell the coffee.

Yo Nick... now yer talken!

We have a 34' Tollycraft tri cabin. She's twin screw, dual heads [each with a "room" shower], good sized rear master stateroom, comfortable front V berth room, fly bridge, up galley in nice salon... etc...etc!

So... with me 69 and Linda 71 this is the "right size" boat for ease of handling, caring for and paying for!

Yes... we woke up and smelled the Community Coffee!!

BTW - 3rd to last photo Linda was only 59, me 57.

 

[Art]

Craigslist

Thanks... didn't mean to get the fellow's panties in a wad! 21st Century runs on acronyms. He could have at least said "Please"! LOL

 

[Caballero II]

Craigslist.

Thanks. Nothing runs on acronyms unless you've already defined them. Communication skills 101.

Thanks... didn't mean to get the fellow's panties in a wad! 21st Century runs on acronyms. He could have at least said "Please"! LOL

 

[Art]

Thanks. Nothing runs on acronyms unless you've already defined them. Communication skills 101.

You still haven't said - Please. Request skill 101!

 

[Nick14]

@markpierce, you're right, steel is the ultimate puncture-resistant material (nothing is absolutely puncture-proof, as the Titanic experienced...). A Coot like yours but with a little more speed would be ideal. As it so happens, Seahorse can build one. They call it the Scoot, and can power it to achieve 12-14 knots. Unfortunately, the current 25% tariff makes it untenable.

@Art, LOL, thanks! The Tolly 34 Tri-Cabin is a beautiful and wonderful boat! I wish someone would find the molds somewhere (if they still exist) and put it back into production. Unfortunately, go-fasts that look like Nike sneakers sell better these days than boats that look like boats.

I'm a big believer in the old saying, "Buy the smallest boat that will suit your needs.". There is a non-trivial caveat - our local New England waters can get nasty. The Block Island Sound washing machine exerts merciless evolutionary selection pressures on less than seaworthy designs, and getting caught in a squall or Nor' Easter off the coast of Maine can be a religious experience. Hull form and design matter a great deal, but things start to get dicey when size gets too small.

No sane person intentionally goes out in rough conditions. Sometimes the waters around here are like glass. But other times, even 10 miles up from the mouth of the Atlantic in Narragansett Bay there are often 4-6 ft whitecaps and fierce winds, and conditions can change fast. It's what you inadvertently get caught in that tests the mettle of a boat (and the crew).

 

[Phase3]

Nick14. I have PM’d you to give me a call about our Phase III.
When we purchased Phase III I was 57 and my wife 53. We are healthy folks but as your post so eloquently states, enjoying boating in a smaller boat that you are confident and comfortable in handling as we age is really important.
We call our Phase III, our geriatric boat. Joking of course but there is truth to it.
Wide covered side decks, large enough cockpit, single engine, stairs to the flybridge, easy access for repairs, were our priority.
Drinks for six, dinner for four and sleeps two. Works for us.

 

[Art]

@Art[/B], LOL, thanks! The Tolly 34 Tri-Cabin is a beautiful and wonderful boat! I wish someone would find the molds somewhere (if they still exist) and put it back into production. Unfortunately, go-fasts that look like Nike sneakers sell better these days than boats that look like boats.

Nick - TY for Tolly compliment. Keep your eyes pealed... ya never know... one might suddenly pop up on east coast. You might need to purchase a bit south; then come up on her own bottom.

Regarding Tollycraft molds. There seem to be several still available. Unfortunately, there is a guy who tried his heart out to resurrect the Tollycraft boat build. But to no avail. From last ad I saw the hull molds are very cheap and maybe free. Bet there are deck molds somewhere too!

 

[jimfrens]

I'd much rather pay a surveyor a couple hundred bucks to give a boat a quick look-over than spend time and money travelling to see it myself. Or ask on the forum for a local to go see it.

You're better off ignoring craigslist. The ratio of quality boats to junk is way too low. It's more difficult, but local boat yards can have gems waiting to be discovered that are not widely advertised.

 

[Nick14]

I'd much rather pay a surveyor a couple hundred bucks to give a boat a quick look-over than spend time and money travelling to see it myself. Or ask on the forum for a local to go see it.

You're better off ignoring craigslist. The ratio of quality boats to junk is way too low. It's more difficult, but local boat yards can have gems waiting to be discovered that are not widely advertised.

Completely agree with you @jimfrens!

I’ve gone to see about 30 used boats over the past 2 years. Every one of them was represented to me as being “perfect”, “needs nothing”, “bristol condition”, “better than new”, etc. etc. To my eyes, all but two were projects needing easily six figures worth of work (and I should have bought one of the two that were genuinely nice, but I moved too slowly because they were priced so high).

At this point in my life, time is the most precious, limited, and non-renewable resource. I spent many, many hours driving long distances to see those boats, only to find out within minutes of arriving that it was a wasted day.

I’ve had reasonable success in paying surveyors to do a preliminary visual ‘walk through’ look at boats for me. It’s saved me a lot of time that otherwise would have been wasted looking at more projects I’m not interested in (plus a couple of hundred bucks for a visual inspection was probably less than what it would have cost me to travel there myself). Plus there was the added safety benefit of not traveling during the time of pandemic.

I’m grateful for and appreciate the surveyors I’ve found who’ve been willing to do this kind of quick look at boats for me.

 

[Mako]

Very good advice. I’ve had a couple of times where paying a surveyor $300 for a technical walkthrough was both cheaper and more productive than flights, car rentals and hotels.

However not in all instances. When I was overseas I flew to Turkey several times to visit shipyards. No way a surveyor could have accomplished my goals in those instances.

 

[FF]

The thickness of GRP is the key factor in weather it flexes , not flexing gives the longest service life.

Many older boats were overbuilt which is a delight over the long term.

GRP resin was .17c a pound, no big deal to go to 5/8 or 3/4 thickness.

Sure its heavy but on a displacement boat hardly measurable in fuel burn.

 

[Hippocampus]

FF wonder why you say that? Been taught less resin more glass means stronger. Every attempt to create high glass to resin ratios increases strength. Newer resins are said to be stronger and more resistant to blistering. Newer clothes are also said to be stronger. Older boats hand wetted out or where thickness was created by chopper gun or mat aren’t stronger than vacuum bagged woven or e glass. Seen thick lay ups with voids, resin starved in areas and too rich in others. A good old boat is a good boat. A good new boat is a good boat and maybe better with much less risk of oil canning. Totally agree crap was built in the past and more in the recent past and present. Still prefer stick built which was more common in the past to liners. Don’t like the limited access in a liner boat and dependence on some hung over worker applying an high tech adhesive correctly. But beyond that the belief older boat were more commonly overbuilt I don’t think is really true.

 

[Art]

FF wonder why you say that? Been taught less resin more glass means stronger. Every attempt to create high glass to resin ratios increases strength. Newer resins are said to be stronger and more resistant to blistering. Newer clothes are also said to be stronger. Older boats hand wetted out or where thickness was created by chopper gun or mat aren’t stronger than vacuum bagged woven or e glass. Seen thick lay ups with voids, resin starved in areas and too rich in others. A good old boat is a good boat. A good new boat is a good boat and maybe better with much less risk of oil canning. Totally agree crap was built in the past and more in the recent past and present. Still prefer stick built which was more common in the past to liners. Don’t like the limited access in a liner boat and dependence on some hung over worker applying an high tech adhesive correctly. But beyond that the belief older boat were more commonly overbuilt I don’t think is really true.

Until you see/experience the considerable hull construction FRP fiberglass "material over builds" that occurred from mid 60's through mid mid 80's for many models of: Chris Craft, Hatteras, Uniflite, Tollycraft and other highly respected, well designed pleasure boat building companies.

 

[JLT]

New & smaller vs old & bigger - my experience

Just thot I'd pipe up about my new-to-me '81 Uniflite 41 Yachtfish, so obviously I'm in the "older & bigger crowd". The Uniflites were built like tanks, and this one has a stunning custom teak interior. The yatchfish model was basically the 36DC aft-cabin with a 5-foot bucket on the stern. A nice addition and a lot of boat for the money! She's had a ton of upgrades over time and very well-kept in general. Needed some deferred maint on the engines but they run sweet and and when that's been addressed she'll be ready to cruise. Had 2 surveys done & no surprises. Very few blisters in total and nothing structural. A true "oldie but goodie" with years of cruising left in her, starting right now! So, an old one that's been somebody's baby is what I'd recommend looking for...

 

[Art]

Just thot I'd pipe up about my new-to-me '81 Uniflite 41 Yachtfish, so obviously I'm in the "older & bigger crowd". The Uniflites were built like tanks, and this one has a stunning custom teak interior. The yatchfish model was basically the 36DC aft-cabin with a 5-foot bucket on the stern. A nice addition and a lot of boat for the money! She's had a ton of upgrades over time and very well-kept in general. Needed some deferred maint on the engines but they run sweet and and when that's been addressed she'll be ready to cruise. Had 2 surveys done & no surprises. Very few blisters in total and nothing structural. A true "oldie but goodie" with years of cruising left in her, starting right now! So, an old one that's been somebody's baby is what I'd recommend looking for...

Uni's are hack of a good boat. We had a 1973 31' sedan fisher. Got photos of your 41' Yachtfisher?

 

[FF]

"Been taught less resin more glass means stronger."

Yes that is correct.

The resin to glass ratio did not change , only the thickness of the laminate was above what is common today.

The Coasties require a 400% over build of expected loads on bigger than 6 pack inspected vessels , this is enough to reduce hull flexing to assure proper service life.

 

[JLT]

Now that's a beautiful lil ship! Love those old Tollys - she's a true classic!

 

[JLT]

Thanks! Just took ownership of her last Friday, but photos (and a re-christening) will be coming soon. Nice lookin Sedan fisher you got there, BTW!