LA to Anacortes

[sndbowen]

How about a MS 395 to the Bahamas?

We crossed to the Bahamas 20 years ago in our Valiant 42 sailboat.

I would love to make the trip again, but not sure if a MS 395 is capable/safe for such a trip.

Opinions/thoughts would be welcomed.

 

[Phyrcooler]

I have a 42 foot Ocean Alexander and am told it would not be able to make the trip from Los Angeles to Anacortes.

Is there a boat this size that could?

I am maxed out at my dock so cant go larger.

You HAVE, or you are considering buying? If you already “have”, I am assuming the boat is new to you, and unsure of it’s capabilities??

I’ve been on several in the past and strongly considered purchasing, so did a bunch of research. I found them to be well built, and have a reputation of doing well off shore. Talked to several owners and one former owner who absolutely loved theirs. She should be as good as any for the run - assuming boat is maintained and seaworthy. As others have mentioned, it’s about weather, and in several locations, timing - in getting in and out of harbors or crossing bars.

 

[DDW]

In reasonably settled weather just about any boat is capable of crossing from Florida to the Bahamas. Strangest one I know of is in a small amphibious automobile. Straight from SC is a bit more challenging, but you can easily drive the ditch to Florida and leave from there.

 

[Shrew]

Nonsense. We have a guy on one of TF's sister sites that took a Maxum 41 SCB from Punta Gorda, FL to Cancun, MX and then on to Roatan in Honduras towing a 20ft center console.

He didn't hug the shore, he crossed the Gulf of Mexico. He did note that he had to watch the weather and picked the weather window. The total trip took about 100 hours.

 

[mvweebles]

We crossed to the Bahamas 20 years ago in our Valiant 42 sailboat.

I would love to make the trip again, but not sure if a MS 395 is capable/safe for such a trip.

Opinions/thoughts would be welcomed.

I wouldn't hesitate to take a Mainship 395 in decent condition to The Bahamas. I'd be cautious a out weather but that's a given in most boats. Would be a nice boat to have in the Bahamas.

Good luck

Peter

 

[Phyrcooler]

We crossed to the Bahamas 20 years ago in our Valiant 42 sailboat.

I would love to make the trip again, but not sure if a MS 395 is capable/safe for such a trip.

Opinions/thoughts would be welcomed.

Plenty of Mainships ie: 350/390/395/400’s make offshore runs comfortably. Mine has run the California coast, as well as down to the tip of Baja and back twice. I’m most familiar with the 390, and found that it’s raised shear line forward, and widely flared bow kept her pretty dry in elevated seas. A bit rolly at anchor, but overall, I’d be completely comfortable running her down and around the islands.

 

[mvweebles]

Nonsense. We have a guy on one of TF's sister sites that took a Maxum 41 SCB from Punta Gorda, FL to Cancun, MX and then on to Roatan in Honduras towing a 20ft center console.

He didn't hug the shore, he crossed the Gulf of Mexico. He did note that he had to watch the weather and picked the weather window. The total trip took about 100 hours.

Towing a fishing boat!?!? That boat carries 400 gals diesel and its a good 400 nms to cancun plus crossing the gulf stream - twice as it normally ox-bows into the Gulf. Braver man than me.

I assume he made it back? Didn't lose the tow along the way?

Peter

 

[mpstan]

Recently purchased an OA42 Sedan; following

 

[ghostrider454]

It's not the boat, just the operator may not have enough experience on long distance delivery.

Santa Barbara waters can be rough, but no worse than Juan de Fuca.

 

[ghostrider454]

Towing a fishing boat!?!? That boat carries 400 gals diesel and its a good 400 nms to cancun plus crossing the gulf stream - twice as it normally ox-bows into the Gulf. Braver man than me.

I assume he made it back? Didn't lose the tow along the way?

Peter

I did a couple of tows - sportfishing boat from Guatemala to Golfito to meet Dockwise. Some genius in Guatemala decided to remove the rudders.....

 

[grandbanksbayfield]

?West Coast or the Great Lakes?

Amazingly, it sounds a lot like the Great Lakes except on a much larger scale. Without huge bars, our ports are very easy to get into and not to far apart, but you still have to make a plan and go for it. Getting adequate rest is the big problem. Far offshore is usually best --no day-trippers, small fishing boats, etc. Go for it.

 

[ghostrider454]

Amazingly, it sounds a lot like the Great Lakes except on a much larger scale. Without huge bars, our ports are very easy to get into and not to far apart, but you still have to make a plan and go for it.

NO. GL are much rougher at times because of shallow depths and it's a LAKE - NOT more than 250 mi across. Waves are tighter - usually 4-5 seconds.

OCEAN - big difference. Waves are broader - 8 seconds or more. Wind travels 1000mi or more without obstruction. Depth is greater in Pacific.

 

[mvweebles]

NO. GL are much rougher at times because of shallow depths and it's a LAKE - NOT more than 250 mi across. Waves are tighter - usually 4-5 seconds.

OCEAN - big difference. Waves are broader - 8 seconds or more. Wind travels 1000mi or more without obstruction. Depth is greater in Pacific.

Need to differentiate between wind-driven chop and ocean swells. Wind-chop are localized reaction to wind. Fetch (distance of uninterrupted water), duration, and wind speed are the determining factors and will create similar wind chop whether on the Great Lakes or the Pacific Ocean. Very shallow water does matter, but there is not a significant difference in wind-chop in 100-feet of water vs 1000 feet of water (though in deeper water, sustained wind chop will form swells). 25-kts of wind blowing for a couple hours across 20-miles of open water will build 5-ft/5-sec chop. Same 25-kts blowing for days across 300-nm of water will build 8-ft/8-sec chop (my best guess based on experience). Given the size of the Great Lakes, us coastal/ocean sailors should be more sensitive to the steep seas that can easily be encountered, especially given Chicago is known as the Windy City.

Swells are the result of distant weather systems and vary based on sea depth and rise-up of sea floor to create breaking waves. They often come from multiple directions and can create confused seas, especially with wind-chop on top. Prolonged wind-chop can create ocean swells, but usually, wind-chop ceases shortly after the wind stops. Swells can travel 1000's of miles.

One of my memorable days at sea was headed down the California coast on my Willard 36, about this time of year. There was a 12-foot swell running at about 20-seconds under calm skies. I didn't even need the stabilizers turned-on except to make meals. Was like running on an old country road in a Buick Roadmaster.

Personally, the Great Lakes sound like they'd be a blast to cruise. I've driven around the perimeter of Michigan and liked the small towns that dot the coastline, and of course headed into Canadian waters has more of the same. Looks like great cruising - gotta love fresh water too!

Peter

 

[tozz]

[snip] Given the size of the Great Lakes, us coastal/ocean sailors should be more sensitive to the steep seas that can easily be encountered, especially given Chicago is known as the Windy City.

This made me go look up the origins of the nickname Windy City:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windy_City_(nickname)

Best thing to come out of the morning exercise...finding out that Cincinnati was known as "Porkopolis" and then Chicago claimed it for themselves!!

-tozz

 

[DDW]

Amazingly, it sounds a lot like the Great Lakes except on a much larger scale. Without huge bars, our ports are very easy to get into and not to far apart, but you still have to make a plan and go for it. Getting adequate rest is the big problem. Far offshore is usually best --no day-trippers, small fishing boats, etc. Go for it.

Having done the length of the Great Lakes and the West Coast, I can assure you that they are not very similar. Differences in fetch and depth, yes, but the main difference is the distance between tenable ports in any weather. Several hundred miles on the West Coast. Also, the Oregon and N. California coast has some of the highest incidence of gales in any temperate latitude.

 

[Takoradi]

This made me go look up the origins of the nickname Windy City:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windy_City_(nickname)



Best thing to come out of the morning exercise...finding out that Cincinnati was known as "Porkopolis" and then Chicago claimed it for themselves!!



-tozz

While Chicago can indeed get very windy, that’s not why it’s called the “Windy City”. In the host city competition leading up to the 1893 World’s Fair, there was a lot of hyperbole used by politicians in both New York and Chicago. The New York press decided that Chicago was the “Windy City” because of all the hot air emanating from their politicians!

I was walking from Palmer House one beautiful spring day without enough wind to rustle a leaf. Then I stepped out of the lee of the big buildings and nearly got blown to Iowa.

Tak

 

[Alaskaflyer]

This morning in west central Lake Superior:


Northwest gales to 40 knots. A slight
chance of rain showers. Waves 7 to 10 feet occasionally to
13 feet.

The buoy now is showing a period of 5-6 seconds.

Fairly dangerous and certainly very uncomfortable in a small vessel i.e. anything less than 100 feet. Those conditions in a 33 patrol Safeboat rival the best carnival gravity scrambler ride. Compared to normal 12 foot ocean swells... well, a poor comparison, really.

The Edmund Fitzgerald was defeated by waves in the 25-35 foot range. Again, in typical open ocean waters, that’s nothing that would normally greatly challenge a boat of her size (yes I know lakers are purpose built, but even so...), but on the Great Lakes with the period and steepness of gale-driven “seas”...I can’t even imagine.

 

[DDW]

Yeah, I did the length of Lake Erie (which is the shallowest) in 35 with buoys reporting 12' at 7 sec. But it wasn't that bad, because in a lake, there is always a windward shore and in the GL many ports to run to if needed. You can't do that in the ocean.

 

[mvweebles]

Yeah, I did the length of Lake Erie (which is the shallowest) in 35 with buoys reporting 12' at 7 sec. But it wasn't that bad, because in a lake, there is always a windward shore and in the GL many ports to run to if needed. You can't do that in the ocean.

One of the most notorious stretches of weather on the Pacific is Golfo de Tehuantepec at the southern end of Mexico's Pacific coastline. It's 250-nms from Huatulco on the WNW edge to Chiapas on the ESE edge. The temptation to take a straight shot across is irresistible......except the area is well known for extremely high winds ("T-Peckers"). Southerly winds funnel through the isthmus and accelerate, often generating 50+kt winds as far out as 100 nms (similar phenomenon as Santa Ana's in SoCal, except 4x the velocity and much more frequent). As you can see from the Google satellite shot attached, it's pretty shallow in the bay - similar conditions that sank the Edmund Fitzgerald in the Great Lakes.

Southbound sailors will sit in Huatulco waiting for the perfect weather window to sail across the T-Pec, which can take weeks of waiting with the most worrisome cruiser setting the pace for all as there is always a better wx window 'next week.'

The head-scratcher for me is you can take the beach route (i.e. follow the beach staying 1-2 nms off the shoreline) and stay perfectly safe and comfortable even in 50-kt winds. I forget exactly, but I think it adds less than 40 nms to the distance and you reduce your risk by 95%. Except for elevated risk of hitting an unlit panga, why not take the Beach Route?

To circle back to the original topic, transiting the US Pacific Coast is a sizeable trip and not for a rank amateur, but it's certainly do-able in an OA42 with a moderately skilled operator and crew. There are weather challenges and lack of Plan B options due to distance between harbors, with only a handful of all-weather harbors along the 1000 nm coastline. But many cruising areas have special hazards - the Great Lakes are no different I suppose. When I find myself underestimating, I think of Gordan Lightfoot "The lake, it is said, never gives up her dead."

Peter

 

[Fletcher500]

I went through the Gulf de Tehuantepec several times on oil tankers in the 80's. One crossing was one of the worst wind and high seas I had ever seen. I don't normally get seasick, but I was feeling it on that one. The local fisherman in that area are brave. They will take their small Pangas out in terrible conditions. They probably don't have a choice in the matter.

 

[ghostrider454]

I've been on oil tankers in Suez to lakers in the GL and tugs worldwide - crossing oceans numerous times. My son and I were on the Fitz the year before she sank. There's nothing rougher than Lake Superior in Oct-Dec time frame. I'd rather be on a panga than either of the others. Lower center of gravity usually means less upchucking on the bridge deck. You don't notice it as much four decks down.