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Old 08-28-2018, 02:17 PM   #21
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On another tangent: To me buying an older boat still scares me. I'm looking at some older Grand Bank 36's and a 42 classic this weekend and next week. The boats are both from the mid 80's. I'm still terrified at the idea of throwing down a fair amount of coin on a 30 year old boat! I'm hoping that when I see them in person I'll be blown away. There's only so much one can glean from Yacht World....

I see that many TF'ers have boats from the 80's. Have you had them for a long time? Or has anyone recently purchased a 30+ year old boat?
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Old 08-28-2018, 03:05 PM   #22
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In my opinion it is all about regular maintenance and upgrade. I saw 30 years old boat that were pristine as the owner was of great care and on the other I saw 10 years old ones that were rubbish as neglected as they were...

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Old 08-28-2018, 04:31 PM   #23
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The money spent on the vessel in question is not any different than the losses people take on a new boat purchase. Or buying art, Porsches or race horses.

Or the hundreds of car buffs who spend oodles of dough on fixing up 57 Chevrolets and selling for dimes on the dollars. If you are a used boat owner you’re thanking the bozo who bought your vessel new.

I applaud the owner for living his dream his way. +1
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Old 08-28-2018, 04:40 PM   #24
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The money spent on the vessel in question is not any different than the losses people take on a new boat purchase. Or buying art, Porsches or race horses.

Or the hundreds of car buffs who spend oodles of dough on fixing up 57 Chevrolets and selling for dimes on the dollars. If you are a used boat owner you’re thanking the bozo who bought your vessel new.

I applaud the owner for living his dream his way. +1

My thoughts exactly. Not every decision is a financial one. If so, most of us are stupid for even owning a boat as we would be far better off chartering as needed. Financially, buying a new car is one of the most stupid financial decisions anyone could make. Even so, I've done it twice in my life and I imagine I'm not alone. Just look at the cost of going out to a nice dinner. Ridiculous financial decision other than it gives us pleasure. My guess is that the refit on his Tolly gave him pleasure. Good for him.
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Old 08-28-2018, 04:51 PM   #25
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3 years ago we bought a 1987 41’ President. It had been fairly well maintained mechanically but neglected cosmetically. I lobe working on boats. This one is our 23rd boat. We have done a lot of fiberglass work and painted the whole boat. New hardtop on flybridge, new enclosure, new electronics, new stern thruster, new main electrical panel and rewire boat so it does not trip GFIs on the docks. New portholes and so many small jobs that I can’t remember. That said it is what I like doing and we bought the boat with that in mind. Any 30 year old boat will likely need some work the idea is to get a boat that your ability and desire to work on it match the work that is needed. Check out the boat carefully and make an informed decision. Good luck.
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Old 08-28-2018, 06:56 PM   #26
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Is it really that smart to take a $400k loss?
If it makes you happy and you can afford it, perhaps. To judge someone else's choice without knowing the entire story and call them stupid is....well....stupid. People make decisions I'd never make every day but that doesn't mean they're stupid.
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Old 08-28-2018, 06:57 PM   #27
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My thoughts exactly. Not every decision is a financial one. If so, most of us are stupid for even owning a boat as we would be far better off chartering as needed. Financially, buying a new car is one of the most stupid financial decisions anyone could make. Even so, I've done it twice in my life and I imagine I'm not alone. Just look at the cost of going out to a nice dinner. Ridiculous financial decision other than it gives us pleasure. My guess is that the refit on his Tolly gave him pleasure. Good for him.
Everyone who owns a boat has made a poor financial decision and for the same reason as his, pleasure.
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Old 08-28-2018, 08:11 PM   #28
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Almost 30 years ago I knew a guy in his late 20s who was busy spending his share of a family fortune and took an interest in sailing with no prior experience. Looking for something striking and unique he bought a 20 year old 46' boat for about 80k. Classic design but all original. Over the next 3 years he spent at least 300k on the boat. New winches, sails, deck hardware, completely repainted, new electronics, interior refinishing etc etc. Never really sailed the boat but had tons of fun working with a very good full service yard to fully restore the boat. It was truly striking and unique when he was finished.

After a few years he lost interest, sold the boat for $120k and moved on. I don't think he had any regrets. Buyers sailed the boat around the world.

People choose to spend their money in all sorts of ways. I've known a few who spent enormous sums restoring and maintaining classic sailing vessels, and was always appreciative that they were part of the community. Generally they had their eyes wide open and recognized that they would never come close to recouping their costs.
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Old 08-28-2018, 10:37 PM   #29
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Everyone who owns a boat has made a poor financial decision and for the same reason as his, pleasure.
Rubbish.
Plenty of people buy and live on boats because it is considerably more affordable than the land based alternative.
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Old 08-28-2018, 11:23 PM   #30
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Here on Longboat Key, there’s a lot of well-to-do people, one of which spent about the same money on an old boat and probably lost 90% of it on the sale. He still says dollar-for-dollar, doing it just the way he wanted made it the most fun he ever had.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:21 AM   #31
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What B&B said. As a single liveaboard when I bought the old girl (1976) it actually made sense and was sort of cost effective in the post Katrina housing situation here. Then I decided I really like her. Kept her and worked on her. Hole in the water you throw money into. Yep. Keeps me happy.
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Old 08-29-2018, 09:59 AM   #32
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Rubbish.
Plenty of people buy and live on boats because it is considerably more affordable than the land based alternative.
That may be true where you are, but here the costs very rarely make it so. Perhaps a few in San Francisco or other very high cost areas.
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:57 AM   #33
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Rubbish.
Plenty of people buy and live on boats because it is considerably more affordable than the land based alternative.

Well, like any blanket statement there are always exceptions. So BandB assertion wasn't entirely accurate. However, on the whole, I think the number of folks that live aboard is a very small percentage of boat owners. How many of those actually save money over living in a dirt home is another question. So certainly not impossible, but I don't think it is very common.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:08 PM   #34
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The only way you will save money is to defer all repairs and routine maintenance. If you buy a cheap boat and run it into the ground it will probably be cheaper than renting an equivalent apartment although an apartment with the tiny space of a cheap boat may be hard to find. Of course you will still have to dispose of a near derelict boat when you move on which will not be cheap and must be taken into account when calculating your total expenses.

Or you could just abandon it and let the taxpayers deal with it as others seem to do.....
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Old 08-29-2018, 01:22 PM   #35
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So academically brilliant but regarding common-sense and street smarts, in the lower 20th percentile.

(I'm a computer engineer, so before people start getting offended......)
Actually, from my understanding, just the opposite. Working class background and worked blue collar jobs to become top in his field. Owns several very successful companies and bought a 50 some' yacht to replace this one. I believe it's a Westport.
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Old 08-29-2018, 03:39 PM   #36
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The only way you will save money is to defer all repairs and routine maintenance. If you buy a cheap boat and run it into the ground it will probably be cheaper than renting an equivalent apartment although an apartment with the tiny space of a cheap boat may be hard to find. Of course you will still have to dispose of a near derelict boat when you move on which will not be cheap and must be taken into account when calculating your total expenses.

Or you could just abandon it and let the taxpayers deal with it as others seem to do.....
Not true.
Our vessel is a comfortable well appointed 3 bedroom 2 bathroom waterfront home with stunning ever changing ocean views and bought for cash.
She gets regular and ongoing maintenance done.

A comparable dirt home with ocean views would cost 15x more.
It would also require maintenance + rates, water,electricity, a car.
AND we would have neighbours

The worst part is it would require us to sell our assets, lose our income stream and get a job to pay the difference.
The banksters would own us again.
That would be going backwards on a monumental scale.
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Old 08-29-2018, 03:44 PM   #37
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Each situation is different and how you view a few of the emotional and tangible aspects of living aboard can swing that "economical" pendulum either way.
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Old 08-29-2018, 03:46 PM   #38
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Not true.

Our vessel is a comfortable well appointed 3 bedroom 2 bathroom waterfront home with stunning ever changing ocean views and bought for cash.

She gets regular and ongoing maintenance done.



A comparable dirt home with ocean views would cost 15x more.

It would also require maintenance + rates, water,electricity, a car.

AND we would have neighbours



The worst part is it would require us to sell our assets, lose our income stream and get a job to pay the difference.

The banksters would own us again.

That would be going backwards on a monumental scale.


You are definitely living the dream (or at least a dream). Sounds pretty nice and I’m really happy you are making it work so well.
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Old 08-29-2018, 04:50 PM   #39
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Old 08-29-2018, 04:57 PM   #40
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A 50 year old, $240K Tolly is mind-boggling.

A $600K refit on said Tolly is insane.

An $85,000 paint job?!? WTF?!?
Well put.
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