Installing a new generator

[Dieselpusher2021]

Hi, I'm looking at a boat that's never had a generator. I understand it will need a seacock, exhaust and wiring. I'm guessing $12-14k. Any imput or suggestions.

Thanks

 

[Donsan]

I saw a YouTube video of a couple that replaced an 8Kw Westerbeke with a 5Kw Northern Lights and I believe they said it was $25K.

 

[psneeld]

Fuel system too....

 

[Portage_Bay]

I use a crude rule of thumb to begin my estimates. Whatever "it" costs sitting on a pallet next to the boat that will be the cost to install, setup and shake out. It's not an infallible rule, but a place to start thinking about budgeting. Some will cost less, some more. My guess is because the boat has never had a gen the costs will be on the high side.

Unless you have considerable experience this is not a good DIY project.

 

[Redhook98]

$25k makes no sense, unless they got an inept yard to do it. Your estimate of $12-14k would be pretty close. A buddy did that about 6 years ago for less than $10k with a brand new 7.5KW Onan.

 

[Portage_Bay]

... and mounting. And switching does your main panel have room for the switches/breakers? If not where will your switches go?

 

[Ken E.]

Call Alaska Diesel Electric in Seattle to find out what they'll sell you a NL 5kw for. That will give you a starting point. $25k seem very high.

If you are contemplating mounting the genset in your lazarette, I'd suggest sounding out some opinions here first.....it's a wet, corrosive environment for a generator.

 

[Donsan]

$25k makes no sense, unless they got an inept yard to do it. Your estimate of $12-14k would be pretty close. A buddy did that about 6 years ago for less than $10k with a brand new 7.5KW Onan.

My memory could be bad or that may have included other work but I definitely came away with the impression it was not cheap.

 

[FoxtrotCharlie]

Last year i replaced and old 12.5 Westerbeke (was inoperable) with a 9k Kohler in sound box. Kohler was two yrs old (still under warranty) and i got it for $4,500 ($10k new). Cost me about $4,000 total to have the old one removed and new one installed with new exhaust hose and fuel lines, and remote installed at lower helm. Since you won't have to pay for removal of an old one, your all in cost with seacock, wiring .... could be about the same ie $14-16. These were Mobile prices on the labor.

 

[High Wire]

New install? It’s going to be $15-20k

 

[Comodave]

If you are not going to do any of the work then the 12 to 14K sounds about right. At 25K someone got taken...

 

[DavidM]

Lots of numbers thrown around so here are mine:


Installation (no matter the brand), about $5,000
Low end- NextGen 5KW about $7,500 with sound shield
High end- Northern Lights 5KW about $12,000 with sound shield


David

 

[syjos]

A 5.5 kw to 7.5 kw generator will be close to $10,000 depending on brand/type and if buying retail or wholesale.

In addition to the generator, you'll need a sound enclosure, water lift muffler, Gen Sep, exhaust hoses, exhaust outlet, RW strainer, thru-hull and seacock, fuel filter, fuel hoses, shore/generator selector, wire and connectors. That's another $2,000

Throw in a haul out for the thru hulls and crane or some way to get the generator aboard.

Hire the install out and that's around $4,000 to $10,000 labor depending on accessibility and where you are located. Portage Bay and DavidM are correct in their cost estimates.

Add sales tax if you are in one of those states.

If you hire the generator dealer to install it, you probably will be paying retail prices for hoses, wire, thru-hulls, mufflers etc. A DIY generator install will save you $$$$$

Installing a generator is not too difficult for an experienced DIY. Getting the generator on to the boat, through openings and into the engine room is the difficult part. Installing the fuel, water, exhaust and electrical are not overly complicated.

When you install the generator yourself, you will install it in a way that service items are easily accessible instead of installing it in the easiest spot to install.

I would not recommend it as a first time DIY project.

 

[mvweebles]

I just purchased a NL 6kw about 4 months ago. Gen itself was was around $9500. Remote panel is around $600-$800. Sound shield is around $1200. Lift muffler and separator runs about $600. You'll need some sort of panel transfer switch to select and isolate which runs around $200 or so. Start battery, cables, through hull, exhaust and raw water hoses around $500 or so. Pretty easy to be into it close to $14k in parts alone. 40-hours of installation time sounds about right so at $125/hr you're pretty close to $20k all-in. If your YouTube friends needed something big moved (engine?) to get the generator in, we'll, maybe $25k isn't wild after all.

 

[ksanders]

Remember guys that when you hire a boat yard for a job that you can and should get billed for every minute that the technicians cannot be working on someone else's boat.

A generator replacement same brand, similar vintage can be pretty straight forward.

Thats not the case with a new install or a brand swap.

First the boat yard is probably going to assign two techncians to the job.
All the time that they spend figuring out what to do.
All the time that they spend getting the materials rounded up.
All the time then doing the job.

Lots of decisions.

Where is the panel going to go
How do we fish the wires from the generator to the panel
How are the power cables going to tie in.

Lots and lots of decisions and planning. Time any reasonable person would take

My opinion is you’ll have 50+ labor hours wrapped up in the job and maybe more...Probably more.

$20K is not unreasonable at all.

 

[BrisHamish]

In case it assists the OP, here are some numbers in Aussie dollars based on a genset replacement I did last year. Old Onan 9.9 replaced with a new Nanni 16kw.

Nanni cost $20k AUD new. Sold the old Onan (4500 hours, 2006 build) for $5k AUD. Install cost about 12k AUD, the extra cost above removal of old/get new one in being marine electrician because new one was bigger and required (therefore) more amp wiring and breakers etc, and also I opted to go ‘deluxe’ on vibration isolation, which added some $$ - nice, but not strictly essential.

For what that is all worth, if it assists.

Hamish.

 

[Irish Rambler]

I might sound stupid but why not cut back on your electric consumption ? Do you really need it ?
I've found generators to be expensive to buy run/maintain and noisy however well they're insulated.
Think 'Out of the box'. First and foremost reduce your consumption, fit solar panels an updated charging system and use an inverter and yes, we do have a fridge, separate freezer, washing machine etc.

 

[IRENE]

I might sound stupid but why not cut back on your electric consumption ? Do you really need it ?
I've found generators to be expensive to buy run/maintain and noisy however well they're insulated.
Think 'Out of the box'. First and foremost reduce your consumption, fit solar panels an updated charging system and use an inverter and yes, we do have a fridge, separate freezer, washing machine etc.

This comment from Irish Rambler has merit.

Unless needed to run air conditioning, I recommend not having a generator.

The generator comes with needs for maintenance and spare parts. We need to run it regularly, loaded, to keep it healthy.

I would prefer to have lithium batteries, electric stove and oven, solar, and good alternators and inverters.

Best Wishes

 

[sunchaser]

Hi, I'm looking at a boat that's never had a generator. I understand it will need a seacock, exhaust and wiring. I'm guessing $12-14k. Any imput or suggestions.

Thanks

DP, a few questions

- is the vessel diesel or gas powered?
- what size, model and age is the vessel?
- what are your intended cruising plans?
- does the vessel currently have water heater, inverter, house bank and AC installed?

 

[FF]

The genset is not expensive IF it it is simply installed.


The simplest electrical hookup is to accept a tiny bit of work.


A 50A - 240V range socket (in a closet or locker perhaps) is used as the source to power the boat a plug from the shore power , and a plug from the noisemaker mean whenever the boat leaves the dock, the shore plug is pulled and the other simply pushed in. As the gear is not subject to rain , it can be low cost not "marine".


A simple fitting in the top of the fuel tank will allow feeding the unit with a pipe that only goes 3/4 of the way into the fuel tank.An outboard rubber fuel bulb at the unit can help if priming is a problem .


You will still need a sea cock and strainer and a good large diameter water lift muffler, but these are not big bucks to purchase or have installed..


Enjoy!.

 

[twistedtree]

I don't think anyone has mentioned the need to fabricate a bed for the generator. With a replacement this wouldn't be an issue, but with a new install, that's one more labor intensive project.


In my experience doing any manner of boat projects, pulling wires, cables, and hoses is VERY time consuming. I once spend an entire day getting a small cable from a cabinet on one side of a door to a cabinet on the other side of the door. And no beer was involved. I think it was Sunchaser who listed a bunch of these wire and cable runs, control panels, power selector switches. Even locating a place the draw fuel, return fuel, an external filter, and all the associated valves and fittings could be several hundred dollars and 1-2 days of work.


Hiring it out, and assuming it's done around an already planned haul out, I think you are looking at $20k+ It's just a lot of work, and work that's difficult to do in a finished boat.


Just for kicks, here's how I would roughly budget my time if I were doing big chunks of this project myself, which is how I would probably do it.


- Locate the generator, relocate existing stuff that's in the way. Fabricate a bed including grinding back paint or gel coat, cutting forms, and glassing in to form a solid bed. If you have decking already where you want to place the generator, you could just bolt down to that. But you risk creating a big amplifying drum for the generator noise, so I personally would be looking to make a really solid foundation. This is probably a full week of work all by itself.


- Locate a spot for the control panel, preferably near the boat's breaker panel. Hopefully you won't have to relocate anything else to make room, but I'm seldom that lucky. Cut a hole and install the panel. Figure out a path to get the control cable harness from the generator to the control panel. Actually, do this in conjunction with locating the panel, because if you can't get the wires through, it's not a good location. This would be a day if all goes well, and 2 days if it's harder. Note that you could punt and only have generator control right at the generator itself. Easy to wire, but harder to operate every time you want to use it.


- Figure out how you are going to tie in the AC power. You will need some sort of power selector switch that can handle the full boat power load, and figure out where to locate it, preferably by that same breaker panel so it's all convenient to use. Like the control panel, find a location for the switch and pull the wires through. Also figure out how you are going to handle neutral to ground bonding and wire that up too. One more day, and maybe some economy in pulling wires etc if co-located with the control panel.


- Figure out the fuel system. When to draw fuel, where to return, fittings and valves required, racor external fuel filter and fittings. Then in stall everything, pull the supply and return fuel hoses. 1 day, and maybe 2 if finding space for things is harder.


- Raw water supply: Where to locate the thruhull, shutoff, strainer, and how to route hoses through everything and to the generator. Install all of it. 1-2 days.


- Exhaust: Locate the muffler and separator, acknowledging that you will probably have to relocate a bunch of other stuff in the process. Locate the above water exhaust location, and the below water water outlets from the separator. Install thruhulls, shutoffs, and install hoses. 1-2 days


- Get the generator on board, get it into location and bolted down. 1 day.


- Install a start battery somewhere, and wire that to the generator. Do all the other hookups to the generator (raw water intake, anti siphone valve, exhaust, AC power, control harness.) Add coolant and oil, if required. 1 day


- Once back in the water, fire it up and see how everything runs.


So for me, it would be a solid 2 week job, and maybe up to 3 weeks. Now I'm no strapping young lad and don't work as fast. But I also have more than half a brain, so may spend less time scratching my head and drooling - maybe.

 

[Dieselpusher2021]

I don't think anyone has mentioned the need to fabricate a bed for the generator. With a replacement this wouldn't be an issue, but with a new install, that's one more labor intensive project.


In my experience doing any manner of boat projects, pulling wires, cables, and hoses is VERY time consuming. I once spend an entire day getting a small cable from a cabinet on one side of a door to a cabinet on the other side of the door. And no beer was involved. I think it was Sunchaser who listed a bunch of these wire and cable runs, control panels, power selector switches. Even locating a place the draw fuel, return fuel, an external filter, and all the associated valves and fittings could be several hundred dollars and 1-2 days of work.


Hiring it out, and assuming it's done around an already planned haul out, I think you are looking at $20k+ It's just a lot of work, and work that's difficult to do in a finished boat.


Just for kicks, here's how I would roughly budget my time if I were doing big chunks of this project myself, which is how I would probably do it.


- Locate the generator, relocate existing stuff that's in the way. Fabricate a bed including grinding back paint or gel coat, cutting forms, and glassing in to form a solid bed. If you have decking already where you want to place the generator, you could just bolt down to that. But you risk creating a big amplifying drum for the generator noise, so I personally would be looking to make a really solid foundation. This is probably a full week of work all by itself.


- Locate a spot for the control panel, preferably near the boat's breaker panel. Hopefully you won't have to relocate anything else to make room, but I'm seldom that lucky. Cut a hole and install the panel. Figure out a path to get the control cable harness from the generator to the control panel. Actually, do this in conjunction with locating the panel, because if you can't get the wires through, it's not a good location. This would be a day if all goes well, and 2 days if it's harder. Note that you could punt and only have generator control right at the generator itself. Easy to wire, but harder to operate every time you want to use it.


- Figure out how you are going to tie in the AC power. You will need some sort of power selector switch that can handle the full boat power load, and figure out where to locate it, preferably by that same breaker panel so it's all convenient to use. Like the control panel, find a location for the switch and pull the wires through. Also figure out how you are going to handle neutral to ground bonding and wire that up too. One more day, and maybe some economy in pulling wires etc if co-located with the control panel.


- Figure out the fuel system. When to draw fuel, where to return, fittings and valves required, racor external fuel filter and fittings. Then in stall everything, pull the supply and return fuel hoses. 1 day, and maybe 2 if finding space for things is harder.


- Raw water supply: Where to locate the thruhull, shutoff, strainer, and how to route hoses through everything and to the generator. Install all of it. 1-2 days.


- Exhaust: Locate the muffler and separator, acknowledging that you will probably have to relocate a bunch of other stuff in the process. Locate the above water exhaust location, and the below water water outlets from the separator. Install thruhulls, shutoffs, and install hoses. 1-2 days


- Get the generator on board, get it into location and bolted down. 1 day.


- Install a start battery somewhere, and wire that to the generator. Do all the other hookups to the generator (raw water intake, anti siphone valve, exhaust, AC power, control harness.) Add coolant and oil, if required. 1 day


- Once back in the water, fire it up and see how everything runs.


So for me, it would be a solid 2 week job, and maybe up to 3 weeks. Now I'm no strapping young lad and don't work as fast. But I also have more than half a brain, so may spend less time scratching my head and drooling - maybe.

Thanks, great input of the scope of the project. I knew most of it but had forgot some items. No wonder it's so expensive!

 

[sunchaser]

Without some boat specific and cruising goal details there is a well discussed dirt simple starting point - gas genset purchased at Home Depot. Or go hog wild and get the diesel version. Then a plug as FF recommends and you're in business.

I'll label it the Flywright plan. Used by hundreds if not thousands of boaters. Or millions of lit up land users.

 

[Ski in NC]

I've installed many generators, some into boats that never had them. The jobs, and the costs, ranged from quite basic to very complex and difficult. Depends on the boat and gen chosen.

OP, lots of good advice so far. To do any better provide details of the boat, pics of gen location, pics of AC panel, tell us size of gen, etc. Kinda flying blind without such info.

 

[High Wire]

Don't forget the loss of use of the boat while the install is going on. Likely the yard has other projects going on at the same time so the crew will not be working 100 percent on your boat. Mine was a remove and replace old for new and it still sat in the yard for a month.

 

[cafesport]

You might be putting the cart before the horse on this. After you buy the boat you might find out why there was no need for a generator. Perhaps it wasn’t designed to live aboard in Florida. Does it have air conditioning, a house battery bank, an inverter solar etc...

 

[oscar]

What model boat? Are there similar models that do have generators, ie is there a template for installation? What generators do they have? More data = better guesses on our part.

 

[bgillroy]

Installed new 9kw northern lights to replace existing old 7.5 Onan in 2017. All in was $14k do yourself (Genset with accessories and Shield was $11k ). For contractor install add $5k. Location Cape Coral FL

 

[Dieselpusher2021]

I might sound stupid but why not cut back on your electric consumption ? Do you really need it ?
I've found generators to be expensive to buy run/maintain and noisy however well they're insulated.
Think 'Out of the box'. First and foremost reduce your consumption, fit solar panels an updated charging system and use an inverter and yes, we do have a fridge, separate freezer, washing machine etc.

Only need it for A/C. Otherwise I'd be using solar. Thanks

 

[Brent Hodges]

Having installed several new generators in mostly new boats that didn't have one before, Twistedtree isn't far off. For something in the range of 8KW you can easily have 15K in materials, and probably an average of 6 to 8 days labor at close to $1K per day. Pretty easy to go over the $20K mark. I recently installed an 8.5 Phasor with SS on my own boat to replace a 30 year old Westerbeke. I was at least $12K in total materials and several days labor. Of course like others have said, this "easy swap" entailed pulling old equipment and wiring, rebuilding the bed it sat on, new hoses, fuel lines, on and on. Then of course there was a fair amount of "while I'm here with the old genset out of the way"!