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Old 09-10-2018, 08:47 PM   #81
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Please stay stay safe guys and gals. All can be replaced accept you.
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Old 09-10-2018, 09:26 PM   #82
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I'm no student of Fla law, but I don't think it is as simple as you stated. .
Florida Statute 327.59 Marina evacuations.—
(1) After June 1, 1994, marinas may not adopt, maintain, or enforce policies pertaining to evacuation of vessels which require vessels to be removed from marinas following the issuance of a hurricane watch or warning, in order to ensure that protecting the lives and safety of vessel owners is placed before interests of protecting property.
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Old 09-10-2018, 09:42 PM   #83
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I'm no student of Fla law, but I don't think it is as simple as you stated. In maritime law, you cannot deny a ship safe harbor in a storm. But in a marina with contracts you can certainly require them to go elsewhere well prior to the arrival of the storm.

If they refuse to go, that's where it gets complicated. Can't really kick them out, but contract might not be renewed afterward.
Known as "forced Majure" probably have the spelling wrong but its basically means you can't be denied entry or forced out of port because of WX or mechanical issues..I don't know if its been applied to yacht,hurricane situations but..
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Old 09-10-2018, 09:43 PM   #84
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Just throwing this out, in my experience the National Hurricane Center is getting pretty good at predicting hurricane direction of travel. They often underestimate the strength. Always prepare for the worst.

Following is the hurricane plan for the coral Reef Yacht Club in Miami Florida. It does require removal of boats.
This hurricane plan for Coral Reef Yacht club is in direct violation of Florida state law which clearly states that “marinas may not adopt, maintain or enforce policies pertaining to the evacuation of vessels during a hurricane watch or warning.” Perhaps there are different rules for yacht clubs versus marinas.
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Old 09-10-2018, 09:57 PM   #85
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Is coral reef the same or part of Ocean Reef?
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Old 09-10-2018, 11:05 PM   #86
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Is coral reef the same or part of Ocean Reef?
No, there is no relation.
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Old 09-11-2018, 01:23 AM   #87
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I'm not a well trained weather guesser though I have been in a fair bit over the years. I read this today and thought it might interest some folks around here. Appreciate any learned members comments...

Cliff notes -

Opening - "If I am right, this will be the most costly disaster for the Carolinas and Virginias on record. In addition, given our winter forecast, we expect the core of the cold and snow, relative to average, to be near these same areas, which for them means this could very well be the most extreme six-month period on record. A hurricane as strong as Hugo or Hazel, flooding rains due to Florence’s slow movement, the possibility of an exceptional winter — you can’t get much more extreme than that."

Close - "But remember the bottom line: Florence was predicted in advance, and the misery this is going to cause should be front and center. Hopefully, the response is ready to meet the challenge, which for the Carolina's and Virginia's is liable to be the costliest on record when the flooding is factored in."

https://patriotpost.us/opinion/58148...ow-we-got-here
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:30 AM   #88
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Forecast for New Bern took a big turn for the worse last night. Calling for 70 to 90 mph Thursday night. Sustained 45+ for a day. Lots of rain. I'm on my way to LA right now for a big wireless industry convention, Ann is heading north tommorow to stay with friends.
This is one of those times I definitely am glad we don't own the big boat anymore.
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Old 09-11-2018, 05:35 AM   #89
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Yep... we are in the crosshairs now. We are inland in Cary, but boat is in New Bern. Not sure how to feel about it. Hopefully the winds die quickly when it makes landfall and the river doesn’t rise too far.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:04 AM   #90
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I dont know how many remember the rains and flooding from the one hurricane in the carolina's back in the 90's or 2000's that knocked out all the ATMs for over a week. You couldnt use them for days either as debit or CC.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:14 AM   #91
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https://andrew.rsmas.miami.edu/bmcnoldy/tropics/atcf/latestATL.png

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Old 09-11-2018, 06:45 AM   #92
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Tom if you're still in Northwest Creek that's about as good as you can hope for. It'll be all about the surge there. Good luck!
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:59 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
Florida Statute 327.59 Marina evacuations.—
(1) After June 1, 1994, marinas may not adopt, maintain, or enforce policies pertaining to evacuation of vessels which require vessels to be removed from marinas following the issuance of a hurricane watch or warning, in order to ensure that protecting the lives and safety of vessel owners is placed before interests of protecting property.

Might hinge on when a hurricane watch or warning is issued?

Perhaps requiring boats to move can be legal if before a watch or warning is issued?

Has one been issued yet for that the area where that marina is?

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Old 09-11-2018, 07:01 AM   #94
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Tom if you're still in Northwest Creek that's about as good as you can hope for. It'll be all about the surge there. Good luck!


We are still there. We are kinda panicking today and are headed BACK to the boat to double-check the tie and do as much as we can.
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:08 AM   #95
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Florida Statute 327.59 Marina evacuations.—
(1) After June 1, 1994, marinas may not adopt, maintain, or enforce policies pertaining to evacuation of vessels which require vessels to be removed from marinas following the issuance of a hurricane watch or warning, in order to ensure that protecting the lives and safety of vessel owners is placed before interests of protecting property.
BB that's very interesting, esp. the date it was implemented. When I lived in Key Largo (roughly 2005-2010) the Mom & Pop marinas still made folks sign a storm evac clause. Sadly (depending on your bent), I think most of them have sold out and have become much more commercialized. When we left we were living in one of only 3 (that I knew of) privately owned RV parks on Key Largo. The rest had sold out to developers and folks in them were on borrowed time until the economy turned and the building would start.

PS we were only paying $50/month for a slip back then!!!!
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Old 09-11-2018, 08:46 AM   #96
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BB that's very interesting, esp. the date it was implemented. When I lived in Key Largo (roughly 2005-2010) the Mom & Pop marinas still made folks sign a storm evac clause. Sadly (depending on your bent), I think most of them have sold out and have become much more commercialized. When we left we were living in one of only 3 (that I knew of) privately owned RV parks on Key Largo. The rest had sold out to developers and folks in them were on borrowed time until the economy turned and the building would start.

PS we were only paying $50/month for a slip back then!!!!

I expect if challenged, the clause would be found illegal and struck from the contract. But that doesn't stop people from putting it in contracts and asking people to leave. Assuming the law dates back to '94, I'd be surprised if there isn't already some case law on this.


And speaking of these requirements to remove you boat... where exactly are they all supposed to go? Around here, nearly everyone hauls out in the winter, so there is space for everyone. That's the good news. But it also takes months to haul them all out in the fall, and months to launch them all again in the spring. So no way to haul everyone in 2-3 days. And there is very limited free space in marinas in the region, so it's not like everyone can go to some marina far away, especially when you consider that "far away" in hurricane terms is hundreds of miles, and perhaps a thousand ore more where a storm is going to sweep a coast line. I know some marinas offer hurricane haulout deals where they will reserve space and haul you. But that can't serve more than a fraction of the boats in the water


So how is this supposed to work?
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:11 AM   #97
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I expect if challenged, the clause would be found illegal and struck from the contract. But that doesn't stop people from putting it in contracts and asking people to leave. Assuming the law dates back to '94, I'd be surprised if there isn't already some case law on this.


And speaking of these requirements to remove you boat... where exactly are they all supposed to go? Around here, nearly everyone hauls out in the winter, so there is space for everyone. That's the good news. But it also takes months to haul them all out in the fall, and months to launch them all again in the spring. So no way to haul everyone in 2-3 days. And there is very limited free space in marinas in the region, so it's not like everyone can go to some marina far away, especially when you consider that "far away" in hurricane terms is hundreds of miles, and perhaps a thousand ore more where a storm is going to sweep a coast line. I know some marinas offer hurricane haulout deals where they will reserve space and haul you. But that can't serve more than a fraction of the boats in the water


So how is this supposed to work?
Land evacuations are already underway and mandatory evacuations are expected to include up to 2 million people. We've seen how challenging that is and they're in vehicles that run 60 mph. Even that is a plan with challenges. How far to go? You can leave the coast but if you only go 50 miles inland you may well be caught in some extreme floods. Think of those who evacuated from the coastal areas of Texas but only to Houston.

Now, then you go to boats, many of which only run 8 to 12 knots and no interstate highways to carry to hotels hundreds of miles away. Jarrett Bay may have the most known hurricane haul out in NC. Their record is 220 boats.

There are going to be so many challenges from Florence. There are likely to be as many as 100,000 homes lost or severely damaged based on Hugo. I think right now of the 3000 lives lost in Puerto Rico and my only advice is to protect your health and life. That's first. Your home is way down the list as second. Your boat barely makes the list as a very distant third. If you can do all three, that's great, but most can't.

I can't imagine leaving one's home for this, yet it's what we must do. We have family with us who left their homes in Myrtle Beach. I'm not sure they would have but there's a four year old and even if they might not have put their lives first, they put hers as the priority.
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:28 AM   #98
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Re: Good advice from what barnicles (#90) - When the power goes down, cash is king. If you're staying, an ATM run or two is in order while you still can. A lot of folks tend to overlook this.
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:52 AM   #99
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Take 2 people with completely different training and experience and mindset thrust into a survival situation.

One dies or suffers greatly, the other barely notices....

Hard to say what is right for individuals...easier to say what is generally a good idea...if that's even necessary in today's info bombardment and government nanny state world.

Plus there's a big difference between being 20 miles inland but only 5 feet above sea level and 5 miles inland and 40 feet above sea level....plus whether you are in open land or a tightly packed population or forested land.
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Old 09-11-2018, 10:16 AM   #100
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For those of you in harms way. I've been in the middle of many hurricanes (USCG), living in Houston, and now SW Florida.

Personally felt the eye of Ike, Ida, and Irma.

Our 52,000 lb 49' DeFever was set 22 feet up in the parking lot during Ike. We were at anchor for Ida, and secured our Albin in our Hurricane hole marina here in Cape Harbour during Irma.

Run from Water, Hide from Wind.

Baton down the hatches now. Take lots of pictures of how well you secured your boat and how well you neighbors secured theirs. It makes a difference to be able to demonstrate to your insurance company your efforts to secure your boat.

Take off personal items you don't want to lose.

Sorry for the grim suggestions, just be very, very, careful and be very, very safe.
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