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Old 05-30-2020, 12:41 PM   #1
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Gyro stabilizer

Iím looking into installing a Seakeeper gyro stabilizer in a new Fleming 65 ( soon to build). Plan to cruise San Diego to Alaska many times in the future as I have done in the past. Has anyone here have experience with gyro stabilizers? Cost is not a factor at this moment. Are they a pain to maintain? Whatís your experience with them?
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Old 05-30-2020, 12:53 PM   #2
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I toured a Nordy 62 for sale. The owner had installed two Seakeepers. Claimed they were worthless and a waste of money. Lots of money. However I suspect the poor performance was because the boat was very heavy and the SK's were installed in the lazarette. Can the Selene people give you honest feedback on how effective they are? Perhaps consider a zero-speed hydraulic stabilizer instead, or even a water flume tank if you're adventurous.
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Old 05-30-2020, 01:47 PM   #3
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I have a buddy who installed Sea Keepers in an 80' boat, which had Niads. He left the Niads and uses them exclusively while under way. The seakeepers are used while at anchor (if necessary) and when fishing offshore (particularly nice not to have the boat roll while fishing in the trough). He has had some maintenance issues, but I don't remember what -- perhaps cooling. And they require relatively frequent service (part of the reason he doesn't have them on while underway, unless fishing). If he had to choose between fins and seakeeper, he would choose fins. Some people complain about the relatively long time it takes to spool up the seakeepers, but it doesn't bother him and wouldn't bother me. Also, I have heard complaints about there being kind of a "snap" to the roll, but my friend hasn't noticed that. The big downside, from my perspective, is space. He had to give up room in a big fish freezer. I would have to give up the washer/dryer, and or a crew bunk.
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Old 05-30-2020, 01:57 PM   #4
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Was trying to stay away from fins, not only because of maintenance but also crab pots and such.
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Old 05-30-2020, 03:33 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Glenn View Post
Was trying to stay away from fins, not only because of maintenance but also crab pots and such.

That's a common fear, but I think completely unfounded. DEFINITELY install kelp cutters. They are little fixed fins that come down from the hull right at the leading edge of the stabilizer fin. I'm not sure how much cutting they do, but the deflect well. I've had stabilizers of two boats and around 30k nm and have never had anything get caught on them. It just doesn't happen in real life.

And if stabilization at rest is important, flopper stoppers are very effective, or you can add stabilization at rest to the ABT stabilizer package.
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Old 05-30-2020, 06:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Glenn View Post
I’m looking into installing a Seakeeper gyro stabilizer in a new Fleming 65 ( soon to build). Plan to cruise San Diego to Alaska many times in the future as I have done in the past. Has anyone here have experience with gyro stabilizers? Cost is not a factor at this moment. Are they a pain to maintain? What’s your experience with them?
The theory of how they work is good - the demos are impressive. However, there are always anecdotal stories to be heard, good and bad about any technology.

At you stage of a new build is certainly the time to make the decision, because the stabiliser could be placed in the optimum position without sacrificing existing items and space. All stabs will have moving parts and therefore wear and need servicing at intervals. There is much to like about having good stabilisation without projecting parts.

I suggest you contact several manufacturers of this type and seek information, not only from them, but request info from actual clients who have installed them, and if possible their contact details, so you can get personal feedback from actual use. This may present a somewhat different story..? Best of luck with your build anyway. The Fleming 65 is a lovely vessel. Please let us know which way you go.
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Old 05-30-2020, 06:28 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Captain Glenn View Post
Was trying to stay away from fins, not only because of maintenance but also crab pots and such.
There was a recent thread on these retractable rotor stabilizers that utilize the Magnus rotation effect:

https://rotorswing.com/

Tony Fleming will certainly have an opinion one way or the other!
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Old 05-30-2020, 07:34 PM   #8
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I have the ABT stabilizers with the Star option(stab at rest) on my Selene 80, very efficient both underway and at anchor. The issue I would have with the Gyro stabs is the difficulty to find competent technicians in my area for maintenance of the Gyro.
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Old 05-30-2020, 07:36 PM   #9
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I just wrap the crab pot lines around my props - keeps them away from my Naiads!
Btw most fin based stabilizers including Naiad offer a roll reduction at anchor feature. Like sea keepers, u will need to run a generator or motor to power the stabilization at anchor
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Old 05-30-2020, 08:11 PM   #10
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My 1970 Willard 36 has OEM vosper thorneycroft hydraulic fins. Last year on my way fro SF to Ensenada, I dropped a crew in San Diego. I cut the corner coming into SD and dragged a decent tendril of kelp 80 nms to Ensenada. I am replacing with Wesmar and will install a kelp cutter, which is a glorified way of saying a small metal deflector that keeps junk from wedging itself between hull and fin.

Im guessing you're a savvy boater but will say for others. If you go with fins, flopper stoppers will be helpful given the prevailing surge along the pacific coast. I'm not a 24/7 generator guy which is the deal killer for me even if I could afford Seakeeper and had room to install. Changing Generator oil every few weeks seems like a pain. To each their own. If you're not already familiar, you may want to read Ken Williams blog on outfitting a new GB60. I forget which direction he want, but had the same concern you do on SK vs fins.

Nice boat you're having built. Rarified air from best I can tell.

Good luck

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Old 05-31-2020, 08:08 AM   #11
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I know many boat owners who have Gyro stabilizers and most love them. They are in boats that either don't have a need for stabilizers at high speed or have both fins and gyros. We don't anchor or travel slow enough to desire Gyros. However, if I was looking at a 65' Fleming, I'd go one of two ways. I'd either go with zero speed fins or I'd far more likely go with Vector fins, as in Sidepower/Sleipner fins.

Side-Power Stabilizer Systems – Presentation – Sleipner

We had these in a 65' Sunseeker and loved them. We had tested the same boat with gyro and found these far superior due to their balance between speed and zero speed. I have a captain friend who was skeptical until a customer of his bought a 66' Sunseeker with Sidepower fins and he now praises them and recommends them widely. I know Princess has also had great luck with them. The 65' Fleming is in the size range that I have real experience with them. I know they've been used successfully on many other sizes and types of vessels, but I don't have personal experience with them there nor know anyone personally who does. They seem like a perfect solution for the Fleming though.

Otherwise I'd go with zero speed stabilizers over gyros. My reason there is that Gyros are not effective at speed and the 65' Fleming is capable of reasonable speed and the boat just isn't big enough in my opinion for both fins and gyros.

We've used zero speed for years and been pleased with them.

Now, one of my criticisms of gyro was the time to spool. Other captains tell me I'm wrong there, that while preparing to undock, while taxiing out from the dock or while getting started at other times, it's just not an issue as you have more than enough time. I've also criticized the annoying noise but been told by others that on a well sound proofed boat it's negligible or white noise. Having to run generators doesn't bother me as we run ours 24/7 anyway.

Still I find these other solutions preferable.
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Old 05-31-2020, 08:23 AM   #12
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Nobody knows more about F65s than Tony Fleming. His F65 sea time includes some pretty rough conditions. Suggest you contact him and while you're at it talk engine choices with him. He did a re-power a few years ago that looks and performs great.
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Old 06-08-2020, 03:01 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by makobuilders View Post
I toured a Nordy 62 for sale. The owner had installed two Seakeepers. Claimed they were worthless and a waste of money. Lots of money. However I suspect the poor performance was because the boat was very heavy and the SK's were installed in the lazarette. Can the Selene people give you honest feedback on how effective they are? Perhaps consider a zero-speed hydraulic stabilizer instead, or even a water flume tank if you're adventurous.
Twin Sea Keepers? That was a waste of money. The maintenence at 1000 hrs and 2000 hrs is horrendous. I've been on vessels that had them and they are only effective at anchor, just about the same time as flopper stoppers are. Fins are more effective and way cheaper.
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Old 06-08-2020, 07:33 PM   #14
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Twin Sea Keepers? That was a waste of money. The maintenence at 1000 hrs and 2000 hrs is horrendous. I've been on vessels that had them and they are only effective at anchor, just about the same time as flopper stoppers are. Fins are more effective and way cheaper.
Seakeepers are effective at Nordhavn speeds. They're not effective at planing speeds. I'm not hearing any complaints about the maintenance. The 1000 hour or annual maintenance is inspecting, other than flushing the cooling systems. 2000 hour maintenance involves some minor engine inspection and work.

Fins are not more effective at anchor or at 6 to 8 knots and fins sized for a 62' Nordhavn are only moderately less expensive.
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Old 06-11-2020, 08:03 AM   #15
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Seakeepers are effective at Nordhavn speeds. They're not effective at planing speeds. I'm not hearing any complaints about the maintenance. The 1000 hour or annual maintenance is inspecting, other than flushing the cooling systems. 2000 hour maintenance involves some minor engine inspection and work.

Fins are not more effective at anchor or at 6 to 8 knots and fins sized for a 62' Nordhavn are only moderately less expensive.
BALONEY - maybe you need to read more about them before commenting.
$100,000USD for one unit alone. Someone got sold a bill of goods.

https://www.yachtforums.com/threads/...0/#post-291953

There's a link to a French dealer and his maintenance schedule.
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Old 06-11-2020, 09:30 AM   #16
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BALONEY - maybe you need to read more about them before commenting.
$100,000USD for one unit alone. Someone got sold a bill of goods.

https://www.yachtforums.com/threads/...0/#post-291953

There's a link to a French dealer and his maintenance schedule.
What are you saying from my post is Baloney. I never said the service was outrageously high. Now, I know what the French dealer said and while Seakeeper does not agree with his recommendation of changing the hydraulic accumulators, his cost for the major of $1k to $1.5k is reasonable.

I have no idea what you're referencing though in the first part of your post, if it's even a response to me, since you quoted me.
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