External voltage regulators....

[Bob Nala]

Was wondering how many of you have one onboard. I have heard that they can improve charging. They also help you get more out of your alternator. Question is are they worth it.

External Regulator | Pacific Yacht Systems

 

[Seevee]

Absolutely... wouldn't be without.

 

[C lectric]

I have had one for many years and yes they do make a difference.
Now they have temp. sensors for both the batteries and the alternator which are important to avoid overheating and destroying the batt and/or the alternator.

But again yes.

 

[Comodave]

Absolutely worth it.

 

[FF]

" Question is are they worth it."

Yes,,,, if you have a larger , better alt than can do the work.

 

[Bob Nala]

Thanks for the replies, sounds like a no brainer. Any recomendations on makes and models?
Cheers

 

[O C Diver]

Absolutely worth it.

I currently use a Balmar MC-614. Been very happy with it for 3 years.

Started with a Sterling. First one died around a year old and was replaced under warranty. Second one died and it was time to find something more reliable.

Ted

 

[DDW]

The standard for years has been the Balmar MC-614. There are lesser Balmar models and some competing brands that do about the same thing.

Top of the class right now is the Wakespeed W500. The main difference is that the Wakespeed actually observes the charge going into the battery (as well as voltage) and regulates based on that. The Balmar and all the others only guess at the charge, inferred using voltage as a proxy for current which can have large errors. The downside of the Wakespeed is cost.

 

[FF]

Big DC juice works best with a big (large frame) alt.

Check with a Detroit D or other large truck supply.

A Leece Neville or Ptestolite alt of about 135A should run under $150 , under $135 when on sale.

It will require purchasing a pulley to match your belt and a fan for the direction you wish to spin it.

You can take 100A on most V belts although a dual belt pulley will allow the belts a good long no hassle service life.

If your engine or tranny has a PTO , an alt to fit will be more costly but a good investment.

Large truck alts are not built to the sparks standard required for a gas powered boat.

 

[Pau Hana]

The standard for years has been the Balmar MC-614. There are lesser Balmar models and some competing brands that do about the same thing.

Top of the class right now is the Wakespeed W500. The main difference is that the Wakespeed actually observes the charge going into the battery (as well as voltage) and regulates based on that. The Balmar and all the others only guess at the charge, inferred using voltage as a proxy for current which can have large errors. The downside of the Wakespeed is cost.

Yup. Love the Wakespeed regs I installed.

One thing to note- a twin engine install is massively simplified as the Wakespeed regulators connect via a Cat-5 cable vs a centerfielder with all its small wires.

 

[Hi Ho]

I have a Sterling ProReg-D 12/24 volt that has worked good and very easy to install.

 

[Marco Flamingo]

I have the Balmar ARS-5. The only things it doesn't do that the more expensive regulators do is Lithium (which I don't have) and alternators over 150A (which I don't have).

These regulators have more bells and whistles than most are willing to program. My PO had changed a couple of things out of the 10 or 12 things it can regulate. He had also skimped on not installing the battery and alternator heat sensors, both important in getting the best performance. Get your battery manufacturer's charging profile and follow it. Get a separate battery monitor that shows exactly what's happening at the batteries. It doesn't have to be an expensive one.

Safely getting 25-30% more out of your charging system and batteries is probably easier than adding more batteries.

 

[Scottwb96]

As some other mentioned, depends on what you're doing. If you always run a gen or on shorepower or have a small house-bank, then maybe not needed as much. But with the growing power needs aboard boats now-a-days, bigger house banks and not wanting to run gen's all the time, having a solid ER set up correctly for your battery chemistry and size is a MUST HAVE!!!

I have 2 Wakespeed WS500's networked together charging my house bank (800ah). I went with them because of the "next-gen" abilities over the Balmar's. I also HATED that stupid magnetic tip screwdriver needed to program them and the horrible UI menu. WS500's can literally be programmed on your kitchen table with a cell phone and a USB cable...
I also like the N2K output they now have as well. I can see my alt info on all my MFD's across the N2K network.

 

[twistedtree]

WS500's can literally be programmed on your kitchen table with a cell phone and a USB cable...

What did you use to do this?

 

[AKDoug]

Another ARS-5 owner, flawless for the past eight years.

 

[Scottwb96]

twistedtree-

You can download the Wakespeed app for your phone... In there, it has a ton of already loaded configurations for popular brands (batteries, alternators, BMS, chemistries, etc.). Once you have the app, you just connect to the WS500 with a USB cable from phone to device (inside cover plate).

If you REALLY want to dive into the programming, Off Grid has a very user friendly tool for programming... 4th pic is the PC software programming option.

WS500 Configuration Tool-Config Version Life Time- Windows

 

[sean9c]

It might also be mentioned that the OP can't just add an external regulator to his existing alternator. You can have an alternator modified, removing the internal regulator and set it up for an external one. Or better yet use this opportunity to upgrade to a better, externally regulated, alternator

 

[Scottwb96]

It might also be mentioned that the OP can't just add an external regulator to his existing alternator. You can have an alternator modified, removing the internal regulator and set it up for an external one. Or better yet use this opportunity to upgrade to a better, externally regulated, alternator

100% ! ! ! Definitely agree with looking into an upgraded (more amperage) option if available.
Guessing that if you have an INternally regulated alternator it's also probably <100a.
With that in mind, you would need to go to dual belt pulley at about 100-150a. I believe above 150a you need to switch to serpentine (if not already installed).

 

[kthoennes]

Boy, after scanning Scott's post #16, I'm not sure I can handle that additional complication in my life, even if it helps my boat light up the entire marina, make dinner for us and do the laundry. And I've watched a lot of Jeff Cote's videos too, they're great, I love the guy, but I only have so much time in life. I'm installing new alternators this spring. Double pulleys already so that's nice, but the old ones are original to the boat and only 50 amp. I'm going with a relatively simple upgrade to 70 amps, simple swap, same wiring pattern (Marine Power 454's). I'm already wondering about whether I should replace the wiring with something heavier, just for that relatively small amp increase. It never ends. External regulators might be a big improvement, I don't disagree, but at some point I only have so much time and mental capacity to maintain complex systems. I had to figure out the error message lights and repair a Keurig coffee machine at home this week. Even the coffee machine is eating pieces of my life with higher complexity.

 

[Scottwb96]

kthoennes-
The app for the device makes it REALLY easy. Just click through the drop down options.... Takes MAYBE 10 mins start-to-finish. You can download the app and play with it without having anything connected. That would definitely give you a real understanding of it's simplicity.
The last pic I posted is of the Off Grid software you can also use. That ones really get's into the device and also allows you to see real-time what's happening in your charging system (amps/temps/power curves/volts/etc.)

 

[DDW]

WS500's can literally be programmed on your kitchen table with an Andriod cell phone and a USB cable...

FIFY. With an iPhone, you're going to need a laptop too.

Also, only a very limited amount of the programmability in the Wakespeed is accessible with the Android cell phone app, just the basic settings. The OffGrid app OTOH provides access to nearly everything.

If you are looking for a simple solution almost anything is simpler than the Wakespeed. It is simple to use for simple setups, is technically a far superior solution, and can also be programmed for very complex setups.

 

[Scottwb96]

DDW-
I don't have an iphone so can't speak to that... BUT, the android app has some pretty granular settings. Not sure what else you would NEED that's not on the app? Can you clarify? Pretty much everything (I can think of) can be customized in the app. When was the last time you got into the app and played with it?

 

[twistedtree]

OK, Android only. So the status is still pretty much the same. Buy the optional third party app, or buy an Android phone, or set up a terminal emulator and learn the command-line commands. I prefer to buy a whole product, not half a product. And BTW, I already own one and have not touched it because of past command-line PTSD. I dread the thought of going back down the rabbit hole, and may well buy a Balmar "because it's easier to program". Now who thought they would EVER say those words? Certainly not me, but here we are....

 

[kthoennes]

This forum has reinforced to me what I already long suspected. There are Electricity Guys, and Not-Electricity-Guys. Vive la difference, to each his own. But the screen grabs in post #22 make me burst out laughing too. But some of you love it I know, so more power to you (more power, get it? I'm hilarious!).

 

[DDW]

Scott, I have the iPhone version of the app, up to date, and it doesn't have many of the pages you show, very basic programming only. Even so, I don't know if you have looked at the full Wakespeed documentation, but there are many things that you can program beyond what's in your screen shots. Does a mere mortal need to tweak all those? No... but if you want full access the phone app doesn't provide it.

TT - I agree the command line interface is a throwback to mid last century, and a guy really shouldn't have to buy the stuff to fix that from a 3rd party. But there are two 3rd party solutions that look like they work pretty well. One is the Offgrid PC app, the other is the OPE WiFi tether and software. Going back to the Balmar is a big step backward, on AGM batteries because they need a current controlled charge, and on LFP because the regulator can talk to and be integrated in with the BMS. And while I have made peace with the Balmar magnet monkey interface, it isn't exactly cutting edge either?

Why neither of these companies can step into the 21st century of UI is beyond me.

 

[catalinajack]

Yup. Love the Wakespeed regs I installed.



One thing to note- a twin engine install is massively simplified as the Wakespeed regulators connect via a Cat-5 cable vs a centerfielder with all its small wires.

I love the idea of the Wakespeed in spite of its cost. If I were doing a new install I would choose it rather than the Balmar 614 and Centerfielder I have. However, I rather think (opinion) that the more sophisticated regulation provided by the Wakespeed is only marginally better for battery charging. The Balmar products have proven themselves to be quite adept at charging for at least two decades. As far as the installation of the Centerfielder goes, it really is more annoying than difficult. Still, I have been tempted to convert, looking, as many boaters do, for that "perfect" setup. Remember, perfection is the enemy of good and is also often elusive.

 

[catalinajack]

As some other mentioned, depends on what you're doing. If you always run a gen or on shorepower or have a small house-bank, then maybe not needed as much. But with the growing power needs aboard boats now-a-days, bigger house banks and not wanting to run gen's all the time, having a solid ER set up correctly for your battery chemistry and size is a MUST HAVE!!!



I have 2 Wakespeed WS500's networked together charging my house bank (800ah). I went with them because of the "next-gen" abilities over the Balmar's. I also HATED that stupid magnetic tip screwdriver needed to program them and the horrible UI menu. WS500's can literally be programmed on your kitchen table with a cell phone and a USB cable...

I also like the N2K output they now have as well. I can see my alt info on all my MFD's across the N2K network.

Balmar's newest MC-618 can be programmed with an app.

 

[catalinajack]

OK, Android only. So the status is still pretty much the same. Buy the optional third party app, or buy an Android phone, or set up a terminal emulator and learn the command-line commands. I prefer to buy a whole product, not half a product. And BTW, I already own one and have not touched it because of past command-line PTSD. I dread the thought of going back down the rabbit hole, and may well buy a Balmar "because it's easier to program". Now who thought they would EVER say those words? Certainly not me, but here we are....

And with the new Balmar MC-618, programmable through an app and able to monitor amp output, it certainly is an attractive alternative to the Wakespeed and never mind the marginally better charging that comes with the WS.

 

[Pau Hana]

Seems like Balmar is playing catch-up, as Wakespeed was created by former Balmar engineers who struck out on their own…

 

[catalinajack]

Seems like Balmar is playing catch-up, as Wakespeed was created by former Balmar engineers who struck out on their own…

Yup, that's how competition works.