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12-03-2021, 03:54 PM
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#21
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Guru
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,937
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I'd be surprised why anyone would buy gas powered small lawn tools today. Regarding electronic controlled engines, which would you prefer in your car? A modern engine with electronic ignition and fuel injection or an engine from the 70's with a carbuerator and mechanical choke and mechanically controlled timing, points, rotor, etc.
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“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
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12-03-2021, 04:27 PM
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#22
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TF Site Team
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phillippeterson
I bought the Stihl battery weedeater and a Stihl battery leaf blower. The same battery is used for both tools. Have been extremely pleased with both. They are much quieter than a comparable gasoline powered tool.
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Yes... the same could be said for corded vs cordless drills, saws etc but how many old useless tools have you acquired due to dead battys?
I guess I'm just old fashioned or a hold out but I do like the life of the old technology. I'd like to see tool mfg guarantee their battys or at least offer a trade in of dead battys at a reasonable cost (at least less than a new tool, charger + 2 battys!)
In spite of the above I have a Glendining elec control and like it compared to previous mechanical control.
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Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
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12-03-2021, 04:29 PM
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#23
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Guru
City: San Francisco
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,094
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The old dead battery power tool is somewhat a thing of the past, the LiIon batteries last MUCH longer than NiCad.
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12-03-2021, 06:06 PM
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#24
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Guru
City: Vermont
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 10,093
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backinblue
I'd be surprised why anyone would buy gas powered small lawn tools today.
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Me, for one. Try felling and bucking up a hardwood tree with a battery saw, far away from any recharge source. I expect they are great for small homeowner jobs, and would make good pruning saws, but when it comes to cutting anything big, it's hard to beat a 5-8hp saw.
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MVTanglewood.com
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12-03-2021, 06:09 PM
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#25
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Guru
City: Vermont
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 10,093
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacchus
Yes... the same could be said for corded vs cordless drills, saws etc but how many old useless tools have you acquired due to dead battys?
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I've actually had remarkably good luck with them. I still have a pair of Makita drills that are 20 years old. 2 of the 4 original batteries are still working, and I replaced 2 with after market versions just within the last couple of years. And they are NiCads to boot. I have yet to replace any Li tool batteries.
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MVTanglewood.com
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12-03-2021, 06:42 PM
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#26
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Senior Member
City: North NJ
Vessel Name: Bassey
Vessel Model: 17' Bass
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 438
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A mechanical motor is a lot simpler. With that said a motor electronically controlled has a lot more failure points but is a little more efficient and has a built in diagnostic system via the computer. May also need a dealer to exchange parts to program the computer. A mechanical motor could be fixed almost anywhere in the world as long as the parts are available. A electronically controlled motor you may need to access the computer to complete some repairs.
Yes a mechanical diesel will run almost forever as long as it has fuel, air, and compression on top of that with any motor a well serviced lubercation system (oil) after it is started.
With mechanical motors slowly fading I fear when I do buy a boat to live on it will be a newer electronically controlled motor and I will pay to have a dedicated laptop to access and service my motor completely which the software alone starts around 2k plus some come with a yearly subscription to keep active.
Edit: I do see how the conversation shifted to battery operated hand tools. I am for them. I hold a 20-60v dewalt and mac battery system that are interchangeable for my power tools I use every day. Nothing wrong with the old 2cys gas if you take care of them to.
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12-03-2021, 06:54 PM
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#27
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Guru
City: Fort Lauderdale. Florida, USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 21,449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TowLou
A mechanical motor is a lot simpler. .
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I disagree with that as a premise. They may be simpler to you or simpler to some mechanics. But to recently trained professionals I don't think that's the case. Diagnostics of current engines can be facilitated so due to the electronics capabilities. Now it does require special equipment but it sure can streamline things. We have posts constantly about bad mechanics who didn't fix the right things or don't know what they're doing and the vast majority of those are on those "simpler" older mechanical motors. Then a few are mechanics without current diagnostic equipment or training trying to guess on newer. It is very different today and much of mechanical is now electronic and a different skillset but that doesn't mean mechanical motors are all that simple themselves. Not that I intend to learn to service either, but I could learn the electronic versions far quicker than I could the mechanical versions.
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12-03-2021, 07:06 PM
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#28
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Guru
City: Fort Lauderdale. Florida, USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 21,449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twistedtree
Me, for one. Try felling and bucking up a hardwood tree with a battery saw, far away from any recharge source. I expect they are great for small homeowner jobs, and would make good pruning saws, but when it comes to cutting anything big, it's hard to beat a 5-8hp saw.
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Well, you do carry spare batteries. I'm amazed at how many professionals are switching to EGO equipment. Now they obviously carry multiple batteries with them and EGO is 56 Volt. I don't think as a logger I'd tackle a forest with electric but electric has transcended beyond small homeowner jobs today and continues to get more powerful. It's interesting to watch the change in just the last two or three years. Until we got into the hardware business in 2019, I didn't even know there was such a thing as a battery powered chainsaw.
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12-03-2021, 07:19 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
City: North NJ
Vessel Name: Bassey
Vessel Model: 17' Bass
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
I disagree with that as a premise. They may be simpler to you or simpler to some mechanics. But to recently trained professionals I don't think that's the case. Diagnostics of current engines can be facilitated so due to the electronics capabilities. Now it does require special equipment but it sure can streamline things. We have posts constantly about bad mechanics who didn't fix the right things or don't know what they're doing and the vast majority of those are on those "simpler" older mechanical motors. Then a few are mechanics without current diagnostic equipment or training trying to guess on newer. It is very different today and much of mechanical is now electronic and a different skillset but that doesn't mean mechanical motors are all that simple themselves. Not that I intend to learn to service either, but I could learn the electronic versions far quicker than I could the mechanical versions.
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There is a lot more things to go wrong with an electronically controlled motor which not all the time can be diagnosed through a computer by just checking the codes. Many times it gets confusing and then you could be chasing electrical shorts somewhere. Mechanical motors could be cheaper to repair as well as long as you have the part at your hands. A electronically controlled motor many brands you need the program the computer to change serial numbers to allow that motor to run after chainging the part.
If cost is of no option and you have no intention to fix it yourself then electronically controlled all the way. To be able to fix it almost anywhere you are if you have the parts and means without additional software mechanical is the way to go.
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12-03-2021, 08:13 PM
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#30
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor, WA
Vessel Name: MoonShadow
Vessel Model: Wendon Skylounge 72'
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
Oh but you're so Twisted. Don't you know everything invented in the past 50 years is bad and evil. You even have mechanics preach that sermon, those who have never bothered to learn new or who lack the simple diagnostic equipment to quickly determine the problems but instead would prefer to guess.
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BandB is on the right track. My boat is prehistoric (1995) but converted to electronic controls later. A caveman owner, such as myself, can figure out throttle & gear cables and simple solenoids, but at my advanced years I have no interest or perhaps capability to expand my knowledge to encompass fly-by-wire and even the electronic controls on my boat give me the heebie-jeebies.
This is not the fault of the equipment, it is an expression of my limitations. If I had a GOOD electronics mechanic on hand at all times I would not worry at all. But I do worry.
Buried deep in the engine room is a manual gear change/throttle that overrides the electronics. There is a red button, that has a cover over it to prevent accidental activation. It makes me think of something that might launch a terrible weapon. It is a sacred spot. It is perhaps analagous, lthough less scary, to my Dad's old Singer Gazelle (1963?) which came with a crank starter.
I have no beef with any development as long as we are all allowed to step off at the point that it gets too complicated for us.
~Alan
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12-03-2021, 08:23 PM
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#31
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor, WA
Vessel Name: MoonShadow
Vessel Model: Wendon Skylounge 72'
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanT
Buried deep in the engine room is a manual gear change/throttle that overrides the electronics. It is a sacred spot. Analagous perhaps to my Dad's old Singer Gazelle (1963?) which came with a crank starter.
I have no beef with any development as long as we are all allowed to step off at the point that it gets too complicated for us.
~Alan
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Here I am commenting on my own post!
Just wanted to add that the crank handle on the Singer Gazelle was frequently exercised by my father. He swore it had a high compression 'sport' engine. The last OEM hand cranked (back up) starter to my knowledge was as recently as the Hillman Imp of 1976.
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12-03-2021, 09:33 PM
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#32
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Senior Member
City: North NJ
Vessel Name: Bassey
Vessel Model: 17' Bass
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 438
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With knowledge brings less fear.
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12-03-2021, 10:16 PM
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#33
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,191
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacchus
Yes... the same could be said for corded vs cordless drills, saws etc but how many old useless tools have you acquired due to dead battys?
I guess I'm just old fashioned or a hold out but I do like the life of the old technology. I'd like to see tool mfg guarantee their battys or at least offer a trade in of dead battys at a reasonable cost (at least less than a new tool, charger + 2 battys!)
In spite of the above I have a Glendining elec control and like it compared to previous mechanical control.
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I bought all new Ridgid cordless tools that come with a lifetime service contract including batteries if you register them online within 90 days.
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Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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12-04-2021, 06:16 AM
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#34
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Guru
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,937
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Notice I did say "small" tools. I agree that I probably wouldn't try clearing a building lot with a battery powered chainsaw, but for the avg homeowner that has to cut up a felled limb once a year, battery power is probably better than a seldom used gas motor. My chainsaw is one of the hardest things to start that I own. I still own some corded drills but probably haven't used them in 10 years. Battery is so much more convenient and gets the job done. I'm not drilling for hours. I'm not quite ready for a battery lawnmower or snowblower, but maybe in the future. I just replaced my Craftsman 2-stroke weed whacker/hedge trimmer with a DeWalt electric. It's not only easier to start and use, it's lighter AND more powerful than the gas (cuts bigger branches). I wear out before the battery does. Next up is probably a hand-held leaf blower. Most manufacturers are making a whole line of tools that can share the same battery. Cheaper and makes more sense to me than a garage full of devices each with their own small gas engine.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
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12-04-2021, 06:50 AM
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#35
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TF Site Team
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comodave
I bought all new Ridgid cordless tools that come with a lifetime service contract including batteries if you register them online within 90 days.
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Dave
Interesting... I hadn't heard that but glad at least one mfg has stepped up.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
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12-04-2021, 06:50 AM
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#36
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Guru
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116 2008
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 10,595
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I bought all new Milwaukee battery powered tools. With each tool they included an extra battery and each came with a charger.
I had a Mika 90degree drill but the batteries became more expensive than a new drill. Just bought a 90 degree attachment
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Two days out the hospital after a week in the hospital because of a significant heart attack.
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12-04-2021, 06:53 AM
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#37
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Guru
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in the Great Lakes
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,835
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One thing I find in common with electronically controlled diesel engines (below 1,000 HP), cordless drills, and most tools that replaced gas engines with batteries, is the owner's anticipation of the tool's life expectancy. To be fair, some percentage of the population can't visualize owning most new things (car, boat, house, etc.) more than 5 or 10 years. It's the mindset of always looking for what's new. In their mind, "reliable for my ownership, not my problem after that". For the rest of us, the market is driven by those that have to buy new every so many years, and we've learned to accept that. That doesn't make those things long term reliable. Usually the item isn't worn out. A component has failed that is no longer available or isn't economically realistic.
For the record, I've owned several good quality cordless electric drills. When they have inevitably died or lack sufficient battery power, I pull out the 40+ year old Makita corded drill and finish the job.
I happily accept the convenience of a cordless drill. I recognize that if airplanes were as reliable as cordless drills, we would all be dead now.
Ted
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Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
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12-04-2021, 06:58 AM
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#38
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Guru
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldDan1943
I bought all new Milwaukee battery powered tools. With each tool they included an extra battery and each came with a charger.
I had a Mika 90degree drill but the batteries became more expensive than a new drill. Just bought a 90 degree attachment
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I would prefer 1 battery and charger for multiple tools. At least if it made them less expensive.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
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12-04-2021, 07:49 AM
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#39
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Guru
City: Coupeville Wa.
Vessel Name: Pacific Myst
Vessel Model: West Bay 4500
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backinblue
I would prefer 1 battery and charger for multiple tools. At least if it made them less expensive.
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It's relatively easy to find Dewalt tools sold without battery & charger. Just make sure the tools you buy all use compatible batteries. Perhaps other manufacturers offer the same.
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Some things are worth doing simply because they are worth doing.
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12-04-2021, 08:02 AM
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#40
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Guru
City: Stratford, CT
Vessel Name: Blue Moon
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 355
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Portage_Bay
It's relatively easy to find Dewalt tools sold without battery & charger. Just make sure the tools you buy all use compatible batteries. Perhaps other manufacturers offer the same.
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I understand and I agree. I was just commenting on Old Dan's post that every tool he buys comes with a charger and multiple batteries. May be unnecessary.
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“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
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