Curmudgeon ????? - Being prepared before leaving the dock

[syjos]

So you all are sort of confirming what set off my original semi-rant post. Why a YouTube poster would expect sympathy for flying objects is beyond me. A newbie video? Empathy. But these “experienced” YouTubers who are surprised and amazed and seemingly starting a pity party? No empathy, no sympathy, just curmudgeonly amazement. Entertaining stories being shared here! Thanks!

I could never understand peoples need to publish stories and videos of stupid mistakes, mishaps and other embarrassing situations.

If I do something stupid and there are no witnesses or evidence of my stupidity - it never happened.

 

[Maryboo]

Not worth the risk not to

As former live aboard sailors, then trawler people, we always, I repeat always, secure whatever can fly about the cabin. The former owners of one of our boats lost the microwave, the vitrofrigo refrig/freezer, and a set of crystal wine glasses with wakes in an inlet. The dents in the cabin wall have spoken.At least they weren’t injured or killed, which would have added much drama to an already dicey situation.
The risk of being hit with a flying object, the distraction of stuff fLying about in rough seas and the potential to trip on whatever is on the floor is not compatible with good seamanship. As the sailors would say, take a picture of your cabin, or imagine it, and turn it upside down. Anything that moves needs to be screwed down. Just my two cents.

 

[kthoennes]

All our cabinets and drawers click closed too, but our first run out of a stormy Narragansett Bay into the Sound we learned some quick lessons. Even if the fridge door latches closed, don't leave an opened carton of milk (or anything else spill-able) standing up in the fridge; put the three flatscreen TV's facedown on the berths; don't leave an opened bottle of dish soap on the counter, put it in the sink; those two clunking noises were the bars of soap falling out of the little tray/shelves in the showers; and like the airline speech, exercise caution opening the overhead bins because items may have shifted in flight (like Monopoly games with all the loose money, cards, and game pieces spilling everywhere).


(This discussion also reminds me of our honeymoon cruise to Alaska very late in the season. Holland America, the old Veendam. The ship was pitching badly that night so the metal coat hangers in the closets were sliding on the poles and jangling against each other every 42 seconds. Drove us nuts. I couldn't take the hangers off the poles either because they were trapped for anti-theft. Had to re-hang all our clothes at 3:00 am on alternating hangers to stop the slide-jangle, slide-jangle noise.)

 

[Montenido]

We bought our boat with plates and utensils already onboard, so I assumed they were in a safe storage place. I replaced the dinnerware with Corian, which is almost unbreakable - ALMOST! We were on our way to Agua Verde in the Sea of Cortez, with a stiff breeze on our nose. The last several miles of the trip require making a left turn and cruising broadside to the swells. Well, our Corian plates came flying out of our upper galley cabinets (they now live in bottom drawers) and exploded on our granite counter tops. Once our anchor was down it took us about an hour to clean up all the pieces of Corian. In fact, two years later, I still find small pieces in the weirdest places.

Underway, we secure everything in its place, and put loose stuff in the sink or microwave.

Cheers, Bill

 

[Kit_L]

do you secure loose stuff and doors/drawers before or as you are undocking more or less without exception?

Yes.

 

[ghost]

I could never understand peoples need to publish stories and videos of stupid mistakes, mishaps and other embarrassing situations.



If I do something stupid and there are no witnesses or evidence of my stupidity - it never happened.

I’ve always been open about stupid, especially complacent mistakes. At least tried to be. Debrief, honest ones, are what keep us alive. I’m sometimes amazed at the situations I’ve said I would never put myself into. Then find out that many others have too, but choose not to talk about it. Yeah, sometimes people use that as some sort of political capital when you are honest. You can be sure I remember every single one of them! No joke. Some of them have otherwise impressive backgrounds, but I’d never trust them again for anything whatsoever as it tells you everything you need to know about how they work with others and you usually find out that they were ‘misunderstood’ in their professional lives. By misunderstood, I mean to say they eventually nearly killed someone and never took personal responsibility. It’s amazing what a little digging reveals.

As for putting things away, I always make sure the Waterford Old Fashioned are stowed correctly. Everything else is on a sliding scale.

This one time out in San Juan channel, not far from Jones I had over half of my drawers out onto the floor and they are the kind you have to lift to open them. Turns out they don’t work much in a zero g environment. In 15 years with this boat only time I’ve had it happen and it was from one end of the boat to other fwd facing or side facing didn’t matter. Think that was the time the dingy on the sun deck got washed into the rear cockpit. Fairly complete Charlie Foxtrot all the way round. February North wind storm was not terribly forgiving.

 

[Leatherneck]

Just curious. What do you actually use to secure the cabinet doors? Most of mine have two doors with loop type handles near the opening side and are close together. I was thinking about small bungees or the childproofing locks that slide inside the handles and hold them together. Any other ideas? I'd rather not affix something permanent.

 

[BrianSmith]

The FORMAL checklist (i.e., not just mental) includes securing everything inside. One wake from a stupid sportfish on the FL ICW one day nearly destroyed our 4 brand new solar panels that were leaning against the sofa, unsecured.

I'm just as amazed by the people coming to a dock with the "Wait - we're DOCKING!?!?!?" - level of preparedness.

 

[mvweebles]

Just curious. What do you actually use to secure the cabinet doors? Most of mine have two doors with loop type handles near the opening side and are close together. I was thinking about small bungees or the childproofing locks that slide inside the handles and hold them together. Any other ideas? I'd rather not affix something permanent.

I use two different types, both of which have permanent affictures. I use ABI twist-locks on the outside of the door. A 1-1/2" bar that is twisted into place with a strike-plate on the door.

Or for corner cabinet doors, I use a short piece of 1/2" webbing with snaps in place to secure the cabinet door.

Both are old-school, which looks fine on my old boat with a distinct utility appearance. In my refit, I am having the cabinets rebuilt so may do the Sugasume push button locks.

Peter.

 

[Leatherneck]

Thanks Peter

 

[BandB]

We maintain a 15 minute rule- we keep the boat ready to leave the dock within 15 minutes of an impromptu decision to leave port. So, this means that we keep things stowed/put away and the boat remains uncluttered of gear adrift.

Decorative items are secured using museum putty or "Joe's Sticky Stuff"

https://www.amazon.com/Set-Shop-Joes-Sticky-Stuff/dp/B00EECHMC4

Works for us!

Wifey B: We basically do the same. Quick walk through to check things, but we don't basically have lose items on the boat. Very few things that must be secured before going out. Either museum putty or leave it off the boat. Some things just don't make sense having on a boat.

 

[BruceK]

(This discussion also reminds me of our honeymoon cruise to Alaska very late in the season. Holland America, the old Veendam. The ship was pitching badly that night so the metal coat hangers in the closets were sliding on the poles and jangling against each other every 42 seconds. Drove us nuts. I couldn't take the hangers off the poles either because they were trapped for anti-theft. Had to re-hang all our clothes at 3:00 am on alternating hangers to stop the slide-jangle, slide-jangle noise.)

And that reminds me of our first HAL cruise, on the much newer Oosterdam. Heading into a SW gale, late at night, the entire contents of the fridge were hurled right across the cabin. Not sure if the extreme motion or the noise woke us, but we were certainly woken, and a tad apprehensive.

 

[Kiwi.]

Just curious. What do you actually use to secure the cabinet doors? Most of mine have two doors with loop type handles near the opening side and are close together. I was thinking about small bungees or the childproofing locks that slide inside the handles and hold them together. Any other ideas? I'd rather not affix something permanent.

When we bought our dream retirement trawler an important feature was the open plan and modern galley that my wife (the Admiral) fell in love with; and it is fantastic. (See

that's our boat.) Unfortunately the apartment-like drawers and cupboards are "soft-close" with only minimal resistance against opening. On our first decent coastal trip over the Wide Bay Bar we rolled heavily on the turn into the "Mad Mile" and every drawer smashed open, throwing out plates and glasses and tearing apart the drawer runners which deposited a million ball bearings on the deck. Such is boating! The Admiral didn't want me to drill holes for catches through every drawer or to use anything external (spoil the look) so I discovered what they call "Grandparent Kiddy locks" See https://www.permachildsafety.com/product/concealed-magnetic-locks-with-key-4-locks-1-key/ These sit concealed inside the drawers and are only activated when we leave the dock. Once activated they are locked and can be opened with the magnetic key, but 90% of the time the drawers and cupboards open and close normally. Cheap and effective and no holes.

 

[Cartouche]

Is it me or are there too many people who get “surprised” once away from the dock and end up with stuff thrown all over their salons and galleys because of . . .

I’ve recently seen far too many videos of people, some apparently experienced with a decent on line following, who suddenly find themselves With lamps, canned goods, dishes, and other bits and bobs all over the place when “surprised” by weather, wakes, rip tides, etc.

Do most of you try to secure loose items before or right after shoving off? How can anyone not expect to have stuff thrown around while cruising even on calm sunny days?

So tell me, does your formal or informal check list include securing loose items, furniture, etc and checking to see that all locking cabinets and drawers are secured? In the past 3-4 days I’ve been amazed at what I’ve seen so called experienced boaters experience. Yes, we miss the occasional item, etc....

Rant off, but the question still stands - do you secure loose stuff and doors/drawers before or as you are undocking more or less without exception?

We came from the sailboat world yes everything gets stowed, Lake Ontario is not smooth sailing

 

[OldDan1943]

We came from the sailboat world yes everything gets stowed, Lake Ontario is not smooth sailing

Many an ocean going crew have gotten sea sick in the Great Lakes.
LOL

 

[Leatherneck]

Kiwi, that's a nice boat! Thanks for your suggestion. How do you activate the locks only when going to sea?
Thanks,

 

[MOJO]

Worst "disaster" we ever had was while anchored in Great Salt Pond Block Island. A major squall came through in the afternoon, winds in excess of 60 kts, boats dragging everywhere. We're being blown sideways and healing over 25+ degrees, back and forth as we see-sawed at anchor. I was at the helm ready to start the engine in case the anchor let go (it never did). All of a sudden, thud. I looked back and there was a bottle of Sailor Jerry rum that had been sitting on the bar and was now on the floor with the bottom of it broken out and rum everywhere. We still call it "The Day that Sailor Jerry Died".

 

[OldDan1943]

Worst "disaster" we ever had was while anchored in Great Salt Pond Block Island. A major squall came through in the afternoon, winds in excess of 60 kts, boats dragging everywhere. We're being blown sideways and healing over 25+ degrees, back and forth as we see-sawed at anchor. I was at the helm ready to start the engine in case the anchor let go (it never did). All of a sudden, thud. I looked back and there was a bottle of Sailor Jerry rum that had been sitting on the bar and was now on the floor with the bottom of it broken out and rum everywhere. We still call it "The Day that Sailor Jerry Died".

Major storm damage!!!

 

[menzies]

Read about half way down this blog post regarding Rusty Wilson and our TV while in the Exumas a few years ago!
Rusty has been banished from Sonas and now sits outside the front door at our house.

Wind and more wind! | AtAnchor.com

 

[foreverunderway]

I really can't understand those who do not prepare for the worst that could happen when they drop their dock lines or pick up their anchor.
I've seen folks in the AICW or out on the ocean on a calm day with hatches open. companionways unsecured and lines and fenders thrown hither and yon about the decks when some sport fisherman goes flying past them at 35 knots, throwing a humongous wake. And they get mad at the SF because they left the dock unprepared, knowing full well situations like this happen, perhaps more frequently than they should, but none the less they do happen!
I have little sympathy for these folks. A couple of minutes preparations before casting off the lines is all it takes to avoid any ill effects from the most inconsiderate boaters. Nobody should be off the dock with their on deck hatches open, period.
It is called taking responsibility for your own actions, and blaming others for your un-seamanship like actions is just not right.

 

[rslifkin]

Personally, if I'm running slow and it's a calm day, I'm fine with leaving the forward hatch open to keep some airflow through the cabin. With a fairly high bow and a good bit of flare, even a 3+ foot wake is a long way from getting the foredeck wet at 7 kts. Up on plane, the hatch is closed under any conditions.

Cabin side windows are always closed other than low speed in protected water. Companionway hatch is typically open, as by the time I get water there, either I've developed a massive windshield / bimini leak or I'm in a possibly unsurvivable situation.

 

[firehoser75]

Forever,
While I agree that everyone should prepare their boat before getting underway, I cannot support the premise we need to take responsibility or blame when an irresponsible (unseamanship like) boater causes damage or worse yet injury. You did not address the injury part at all.

"A couple of minutes preparations before casting off the lines is all it takes to avoid any ill effects from the most inconsiderate boaters." I feel that is at best an oversimplification and at worst just not true. I do agree that we should prepare our boats for worst anticipated conditions (and probably beyond).

I have seen situations where the actions of someone else caused unavoidable injury on another boat. So, while being prepared is important, irresponsible (which is actually illegal) boaters need to "man up" (meant to be gender neutral) and care more about the impact of THEIR actions and operate in a responsible manner! Can you say courtesy? Thinking, (I know for some that actually hurts) about others, even for just a few seconds and adjusting accordingly is all it takes. Most boaters do know how big a wake they throw, and unless complete idiots, what that wake can do under the wrong conditions. If not, they should not be boating, and blame should not be placed on the innocent party but on the party perpetrating the wrongdoing.
As an analogy, what you stated is somewhat like: you wouldn't have much if any sympathy for someone who suffered a violent home break in because they did not have the correct (best) locks. "They need to take responsibility for their own actions and not blame others (the burglers). It is just not right"

Again, while I support that we need to "ready" our own boat, blaming those who "miss something" or forget, for the outcome of the reckless action of someone else is just not right! JMHO.

 

[foreverunderway]

Forever,
While I agree that everyone should prepare their boat before getting underway, I cannot support the premise we need to take responsibility or blame when an irresponsible (unseamanship like) boater causes damage or worse yet injury. You did not address the injury part at all.

"A couple of minutes preparations before casting off the lines is all it takes to avoid any ill effects from the most inconsiderate boaters." I feel that is at best an oversimplification and at worst just not true. I do agree that we should prepare our boats for worst anticipated conditions (and probably beyond).

I have seen situations where the actions of someone else caused unavoidable injury on another boat. So, while being prepared is important, irresponsible (which is actually illegal) boaters need to "man up" (meant to be gender neutral) and care more about the impact of THEIR actions and operate in a responsible manner! Can you say courtesy? Thinking, (I know for some that actually hurts) about others, even for just a few seconds and adjusting accordingly is all it takes. Most boaters do know how big a wake they throw, and unless complete idiots, what that wake can do under the wrong conditions. If not, they should not be boating, and blame should not be placed on the innocent party but on the party perpetrating the wrongdoing.
As an analogy, what you stated is somewhat like: you wouldn't have much if any sympathy for someone who suffered a violent home break in because they did not have the correct (best) locks. "They need to take responsibility for their own actions and not blame others (the burglers). It is just not right"

Again, while I support that we need to "ready" our own boat, blaming those who "miss something" or forget, for the outcome of the reckless action of someone else is just not right! JMHO.

While I can't disagree with your statements regarding injuries from less than courteous boaters, I do not believe that was the direction this thread was headed. Therefore, my response was only in regards to preparation of one's boat for a day out on the water.

 

[psneeld]

No hatches open underway on the ICW ever?

Not even close for many boats....maybe kayaks.

Secure and battened down are 2 different things.

Most boaters I know, recognize the difference in just a few years of boating.

 

[mvweebles]

This is an interesting thread. Somewhere in it I have to wonder if there's a clue to land/house based people who move aboard vs folks who are sailors/boaters at heart. We were forced into the latter due to small boats and plenty of chop in SF Bay. But simplicity is now part of our boating DNA, so much so that it's become part of the charm. Anything more is a distraction to us. The boat should be a boat, not a house that needs to be converted into seaworthiness. We do it by choice, not necessity. I suppose few who could afford to do otherwise would chose the austere path. Works for us.

 

[Bigsalmonfish]

Almost 30 years ago we were heading South from the Broughtons. This was early in our marriage and my wife's first cruise. She put a pizza in the oven and didn't latch the door. We hit Gillard pass on a pretty good run and what a mess...

 

[Art]

Is it me or are there too many people who get “surprised” once away from the dock and end up with stuff thrown all over their salons and galleys because of . . .

I’ve recently seen far too many videos of people, some apparently experienced with a decent on line following, who suddenly find themselves With lamps, canned goods, dishes, and other bits and bobs all over the place when “surprised” by weather, wakes, rip tides, etc.

Do most of you try to secure loose items before or right after shoving off? How can anyone not expect to have stuff thrown around while cruising even on calm sunny days?

So tell me, does your formal or informal check list include securing loose items, furniture, etc and checking to see that all locking cabinets and drawers are secured? In the past 3-4 days I’ve been amazed at what I’ve seen so called experienced boaters experience. Yes, we miss the occasional item, etc....

Rant off, but the question still stands - do you secure loose stuff and doors/drawers before or as you are undocking more or less without exception?

To be "ship shape" enough to withstand any boat's motion, everything should be always be re-confined immediately after each usage.

Boating 101... "There's a place for everything and everything should be in its place"!

 

[Beaverlake]

Wow! I certainly didn’t expect so many responses but it has been both informative and entertaining. Deep sinks should certainly be a part of every boat’s specs! It is nice to know that the occasional bit of “oops” forgetfulness puts me in good company. And I suspect I haven’t witnessed the last example of YouTube stars engaging in marginal behavior. Keep the stories coming - the visuals will help reinforce proper behavior on board Knot Home.

 

[syjos]

Here is a picture of the toggles I installed on Sandpiper to keep cabinet doors from swinging open. All the cabinets have them and closet doors too.

The drawers require lifting before pulling open.

 

[caltexflanc]

Hadn't looked at this thread lately. "Forever": there is a reason it is sometimes called a "shakedown cruise" (or two). I'd only be judgemental if someone was a chronic offender having learned the consequences of various sea states.