I believe sound signals work fine as it's pretty simple one only needs to reference the navigation rules for understanding. When overtaking in international rules the signals are only required if some action is necessary by the overtaken vessel. I like sound signals for their simplicity and clarity however few understand them well enough for confident use.
Channel 13 for Passing
- Thread starter Roger Long
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
There's absolutely nothing to be confused about. The whistle signal can mean only one thing in an overtaking situation. Forget the words for a moment and think about the big picture.
Picture vessel "A" directly behind, but planning to overtake, vessel "B".
Looking down on the two vessels, in a one-whistle pass, Vessel "A" moves to starboard, while in a two-whistle pass she moves to port. One always means (again disregarding the actual verbiage) "I'm staying or moving right", while two always means "I'm staying or moving left."
All you need to know is whether you're overtaking, or being overtaken.
To summarize all of the whistle signals, think of a two-lane road. My "normal" thing (one whistle) is to stay to the right. But it's OK to move (or pass) to the left, as long as I do a two-whistle signal. It's really that simple.
Counting syllables will only make it more confusing.
menzies
Guru
The problem is - you need two people to know that at the same time, and each know that they both know it. That's four different scenarios.
psneeld
Guru
not everyone is that clear... but it is too wordy.
Whats confusing about... on Ch 13 "Sonas, two whistles." ?
Answer...." roger, two whistles"..... and no Ch16 use as USCG wants.
No answer on Ch 13....CH 16 ""Sonas, two whistles."
More concise, says the same, doesn't piss off USCG and others who know the Ch16 problem.
Unfortunately a LOT of boats call for a port pass and then use either theirs or yours. And I have had that dozens of times every trip up and down. The confusion clogs CH16...
So back to the OP's thoughts.....let's try and make things easier and better...because it makes sense.
Whats confusing about... on Ch 13 "Sonas, two whistles." ?
Answer...." roger, two whistles"..... and no Ch16 use as USCG wants.
No answer on Ch 13....CH 16 ""Sonas, two whistles."
More concise, says the same, doesn't piss off USCG and others who know the Ch16 problem.
Unfortunately a LOT of boats call for a port pass and then use either theirs or yours. And I have had that dozens of times every trip up and down. The confusion clogs CH16...
So back to the OP's thoughts.....let's try and make things easier and better...because it makes sense.
Last edited:
OP
OP
Roger Long
Senior Member
This discussion, which has been carried on here and on three Facebook groups, has been very interesting. I’ve learned some things and my radio procedure will be even better than if I hadn’t posted it. What I primarily learned, however, is how much ignorance there is combined an inability to read and then think things through. I’ve been gratified to note that the most positive responses have generally been from current or former professional mariners and experienced ICW travelers.
So, if you see this boat ahead of you (Please note that the nameboard was moved to the flybridge railing right after the picture was taken when the dinghy was first loaded), here is what the sign, that will go just below the nameboard, where both can be clearly seen, means:
1) I am NOT advocating a general change of the hailing channel from 16 to 13 nor am I trying to promote changing established rules. Those comments had me slapping myself on the forehead.
2) If there is plenty of room, you see me look back at you from the flybridge, and you can slide slowly by just above my speed without creating hazardous wake, feel free to just go on by. You are the overtaking vessel so the onus is on you. My duty is to maintain a constant course so that you can avoid me.
3) If you see me back off my speed, same situation as number 2). Even if I’m inside, you know that I’ve seen you.
4) If you don’t see me on the flybridge, I don’t back off, you want to be sure I know you are there, and/or want to dot every “t” and cross every “i” in the rules, feel free to use your horn appropriately and stay off the radio.
5) If I haven’t backed off my speed, you don’t think you can pass without creating annoying wake, are in such an all fired hurry that you want to be alongside me for the minimum time, or have any other reason for needing to talk to me about the passing arrangements, please hail me directly on 13. We are already clearly in a navigational situation, the reason for the call is pretty obvious, Channel 13 is the appropriate channel to hail on. My sign just lets you know that I’m following the established rule and precedent on Cape Cod and C & D canals, and in busy harbors. This avoids delay and pointless traffic on 16 which will often be on high power.
6) If you want to hail me in order to discuss where I’m headed, how nice my boat is, why my dinghy is stored like that, etc., then you should hail me on 16 low power. Calls to switch to another channel for non-navigational exchanges do not belong on 13 and 16 is appropriate.
7) If you hail me on 16 for passing discussion, I will answer although there may be a bit of confusion if you fail to say which channel you are hailing on. That is poor radio procedure and it’s on you. You should say, “Gypsy Star, Gypsy Star, this is _____________ behind you on 16”. If you start asking me what kind of boat we are, etc., I’ll ask you to got to 68 or other working channel. If you start to talk about passing, I’ll ask you to go to 13 and we’ll talk there.
I’m under no illusion that any of this will eliminate all the radio idiocy out there but I think the sign and this discussion, even before the sign has been put on the boat, have helped a tiny bit. The discussion has certainly helped clarify some things for me.
(I don't know why the forum software refuses to display the photo right side up.)
So, if you see this boat ahead of you (Please note that the nameboard was moved to the flybridge railing right after the picture was taken when the dinghy was first loaded), here is what the sign, that will go just below the nameboard, where both can be clearly seen, means:
1) I am NOT advocating a general change of the hailing channel from 16 to 13 nor am I trying to promote changing established rules. Those comments had me slapping myself on the forehead.
2) If there is plenty of room, you see me look back at you from the flybridge, and you can slide slowly by just above my speed without creating hazardous wake, feel free to just go on by. You are the overtaking vessel so the onus is on you. My duty is to maintain a constant course so that you can avoid me.
3) If you see me back off my speed, same situation as number 2). Even if I’m inside, you know that I’ve seen you.
4) If you don’t see me on the flybridge, I don’t back off, you want to be sure I know you are there, and/or want to dot every “t” and cross every “i” in the rules, feel free to use your horn appropriately and stay off the radio.
5) If I haven’t backed off my speed, you don’t think you can pass without creating annoying wake, are in such an all fired hurry that you want to be alongside me for the minimum time, or have any other reason for needing to talk to me about the passing arrangements, please hail me directly on 13. We are already clearly in a navigational situation, the reason for the call is pretty obvious, Channel 13 is the appropriate channel to hail on. My sign just lets you know that I’m following the established rule and precedent on Cape Cod and C & D canals, and in busy harbors. This avoids delay and pointless traffic on 16 which will often be on high power.
6) If you want to hail me in order to discuss where I’m headed, how nice my boat is, why my dinghy is stored like that, etc., then you should hail me on 16 low power. Calls to switch to another channel for non-navigational exchanges do not belong on 13 and 16 is appropriate.
7) If you hail me on 16 for passing discussion, I will answer although there may be a bit of confusion if you fail to say which channel you are hailing on. That is poor radio procedure and it’s on you. You should say, “Gypsy Star, Gypsy Star, this is _____________ behind you on 16”. If you start asking me what kind of boat we are, etc., I’ll ask you to got to 68 or other working channel. If you start to talk about passing, I’ll ask you to go to 13 and we’ll talk there.
I’m under no illusion that any of this will eliminate all the radio idiocy out there but I think the sign and this discussion, even before the sign has been put on the boat, have helped a tiny bit. The discussion has certainly helped clarify some things for me.
(I don't know why the forum software refuses to display the photo right side up.)
Attachments
Last edited:
psneeld
Guru
I wonder what most people would do if you failed to respond with an agreement radio agreement, whistle signal or signalled with 5 or more short blasts?
I interpret the rules as you may not pass or will be mostly at fault in a collision.
Of course with the bedlam and lack of knowledge out there, virtually few even start agreement exchanges...including LE vessels much of the time.
I interpret the rules as you may not pass or will be mostly at fault in a collision.
Of course with the bedlam and lack of knowledge out there, virtually few even start agreement exchanges...including LE vessels much of the time.
Bigsfish
Guru
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2016
- Messages
- 2,987
- Location
- USA
- Vessel Name
- Gotcha
- Vessel Make
- Grand Banks. Heritage. 54
Scott
In all my years boating I’ve only once had an overtaking vessel communicate with me about passing, I have tugs on the Miami River (vhf 9) talk about which side to pass on in going opposite directions. Perhaps I boat in the wrong places.
In all my years boating I’ve only once had an overtaking vessel communicate with me about passing, I have tugs on the Miami River (vhf 9) talk about which side to pass on in going opposite directions. Perhaps I boat in the wrong places.
