Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-22-2021, 11:54 AM   #1
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Carry bag for folding table ideas?

I've got a pair of nice teak folding tables. They work great. But when folded the sides tend to swing a bit when moving them for storage in the engine compartment. I'm going to have some bags made for them. But I'm unsure how to best design the bag.

My plan is to make the bag like an inverted T shape, so it'll conform to the width of the bottom legs. This to avoid a lot of extra corner material to get caught on things. I plan on having some sort of pocket/sleeve/liner to help buffer the legs from smacking various fiberglass bits when lugging them up/down the engine room stairs.

I also plan on enclosing the bag fully, not leaving the wood 'carry handle' part exposed. This to avoid any engine room dirt from making a mess of them.

I'm thinking a duffel bag-like design, where the webbing would go under the table leaves, just outside the legs. And have a zipper running up from the half-way point down the side of leaves.

Anyone done something similar or have better design ideas?
Attached Thumbnails
20210422_101833.jpg   20210422_101840-001.jpg  
__________________
Advertisement

__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2021, 04:07 PM   #2
Guru
 
ScottC's Avatar
 
City: Malmö
Vessel Name: ABsolutely FABulous
Vessel Model: Greenline 33 Hybrid (2010)
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 793
Check various folding bicycle bags??
__________________

__________________
Scott
2010 Greenline 33' Hybrid
Home port: Malmö, SWEDEN
Currently in: Gruissan, FRANCE
ScottC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2021, 04:43 PM   #3
TF Site Team
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 11,496
If they are just for storage then I would make simple flat bags and slide them in. Some velcro and you are done. It would take about an hour in my garage on the sewing machine.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 08:05 AM   #4
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
The bags are for protection and carrying. Both to the table itself and to any fiberglass or teak on the boat.

It's an awkward process stowing them in the engine room as the stairs are steep, with a raised lip around the hatch area. Carrying them level is easy enough, but when you tilt them the hinging part of the handle tends to let the halves hinge open. This risks hitting the adjacent fiberglass and pinching the hands trying to carry it. If I get them in some sort of bag it'd keep them from flapping open.

They're fairly heavy, thus need for some sort of strap under the leaves when folded to carry the weight. Otherwise it'd likely rip if the handle was just along the top.

Think of a cylindrical duffel/gym bag, where there's webbing straps going round the tube, and being part of the handles. I'm thinking the same idea here, run some webbing down/under the leaves of the table and bring them up to a carry handle. That and have two grab handles on the ends to aid two-person passing up/down the steps.

This is sort of a rough idea. I'd likely add a velcro wrap of some sort on the handle, the help keep them together for carrying.

Doing fabric mock-ups in Sketchup isn't exactly ideal, but is helpful to have a visual representation.
Attached Thumbnails
sketchup idea.1.png  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 08:23 AM   #5
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Just modeling this and looking at it makes me think adding some webbing from the ends would help keep that from ripping handles off the ends.

I plan on it being lined at the pressure points to help keep them from wearing through the bag or the table.

The convenient thing is another boating friend has a Sailrite machine and we also have the same woman doing house cleaning work for us. She's got a little side business now making various covers using the machine. Some pillows, Sunbrella cushion and paddleboard covers, and various tailored bedding materials.

Probably takes a little longer than sending it out to a shop but less hassle than taking the tables to a shop and hoping they don't get lost/damaged there.
Attached Thumbnails
sketchup idea.2.png  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 08:25 AM   #6
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Might not need to go with ballistic nylon as Sunbrella or regular canvas would probably serve just as effectively. These are not 'lug them all over the place' bags. They're to/from the engine room and sometimes off-boat for winter storage. Sunbrella and cloth webbing might be a little softer too.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 09:21 AM   #7
Guru
 
Pete Meisinger's Avatar
 
City: Oconto, WI
Vessel Name: Best Alternative
Vessel Model: 36 Albin Aft Cabin
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,026
Folding tables, folding stools and ladders and anything that folds just plain drives me NUTS.

pete
Pete Meisinger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 09:22 AM   #8
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Meisinger View Post
Folding tables, folding stools and ladders and anything that folds just plain drives me NUTS.
No argument there! Such are the compromises we suffer to find the right solutions.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 11:32 AM   #9
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,048
Bill
I like your concept sketches. IMO part of getting these sort of DIY sewing project right is the ability to visualize the end product.
Re: material... check out RochfordSupply.com
I have bought a fair amount of stuff from them and they frequently have good deals on clise-out and 2nds which are more than adequate for projects like this.
I have used their Cordura 2nds for several covers and it works well.
Good luck and be sure to post some pics of the finished product.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 07:00 PM   #10
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacchus View Post
Bill
I like your concept sketches. IMO part of getting these sort of DIY sewing project right is the ability to visualize the end product.
Re: material... check out RochfordSupply.com
I have bought a fair amount of stuff from them and they frequently have good deals on close-out and 2nds which are more than adequate for projects like this.
I have used their Cordura 2nds for several covers and it works well.
Good luck and be sure to post some pics of the finished product.
As long as it hides dirt I'm not particular about the the colors for a storage bag.

I'm more concerned about protection of the item in the bag (including against abrasions from the bag itself) and ability to avoid damaging surfaces if the bag is dragged across it. Sunbrella might be too lightweight, but heavyweight nylon might be too rough. I'm thinking the material won't really affect the design much, mainly because we've already got access to a decent sewing machine that'll punch through just about anything.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 08:21 PM   #11
Guru
 
IRENE's Avatar
 
City: Sequim, WA, USA
Vessel Name: Irene
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 40II
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,040
Solar Panel Bag

We just had a similar bag made for a similar purpose, but for solar panels. It is a 4 compartment bag with handles and a velcro tab to hold it closed. Material is Sunbrella. Just mentioning in case it provides ideas you do or don’t like.
Attached Thumbnails
03B2EEC2-C42F-4F97-9A7B-194841BAF7E2.jpg  
__________________
Jeff
MV IRENE
IRENE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 08:55 PM   #12
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,048
Any benefit to flipping the table & cover upside down?
It seems like when you had the table folded it stands with the "pivot" " handles" up. Any advantage to bagging it that way?
I'm thinking if a folding bike bag I made for a bike... instead of adding web strap handles I simply left the 2 way zipper slightly open at the top and reached in to grab the bike at its balance point. Closed the zip when it was in position & was strapping it in place. I carried the bagged bike on & off the boat that way.
I'm wondering if grabbing the sort of built in handle and sitting on its normal base has any advantage? Balance? Larger mass down vs up?
If so you could flip the whole thing upside down and have the zip enclose the pivot point/ handle.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2021, 09:50 PM   #13
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacchus View Post
Any benefit to flipping the table & cover upside down?
It seems like when you had the table folded it stands with the "pivot" " handles" up. Any advantage to bagging it that way?
I'm thinking if a folding bike bag I made for a bike... instead of adding web strap handles I simply left the 2 way zipper slightly open at the top and reached in to grab the bike at its balance point. Closed the zip when it was in position & was strapping it in place. I carried the bagged bike on & off the boat that way.
I'm wondering if grabbing the sort of built in handle and sitting on its normal base has any advantage? Balance? Larger mass down vs up?
If so you could flip the whole thing upside down and have the zip enclose the pivot point/ handle.
As in, put the bag over it like a hood while it's upright and then turn it upside down (legs up) for the bag?

I've never carried it upside down, so I don't know if that would change the portability dynamic. Interesting question.

But if I did slide the bag on from the top, the act of turning it over to close the zipper would be... challenging to any nearby toes, fiberglass or teak.

The tables aren't heavy enough that I was worried about there being any difficulty lifting them enough to put into an unzipped bag. The bottom of the bag sort of "has to be" in that tee shape in order to allow for the straps to come under the leaf sections and up to handles. I wouldn't think having the straps go all the way to the bottom would be ideal as that'd end up putting all the lifting forces on the points of the table legs, not the longer/wider edges of the tables. That or require a more complex sort of bottom to the bag to handle the weight.

I have a secondary reason for the handles being wider, as I'm entertaining the idea of having some hanging pegs for them in the engine room. If the straps were too close to the center it wouldn't have as much hanging stability.

My main concern of carrying it "handle/hinge down" would be the carrying action leading to impact on the hinging part and the table face. Legs-down, as you see it in the pictures has the legs getting any bumping/dragging action against them. The way the hinge comes together is really stout and would have a 'mallet-like' kind of force if it was banged against fiberglass. The legs are thinner and have more flexibility (not much, but a lot less than the hinge). I'd rather have the legs down at the bottom hitting things as it's carried rather than the top.

I should take some other pictures to clarify the way it works. The legs are always down. You slide the leaves of the table apart and the leg tops have tops that come together as a 'handle'. In this 'closed' position the leaves are down on the side.

I have two of these tables, one larger for the cockpit and the other smaller one usually as "the kids table" up on the flybridge. Though they're both the same height, so I can use them to make a larger table surface.
Attached Thumbnails
table collage.jpg  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 06:18 AM   #14
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,048
Bill
Not exactly what I had in mind but will try... terminology is awkward.
My thinking was to size / shape the bag similar to what you sketched except move the zipper to the opposite end. Instead of coming up each side and across it would open the pivot / top of the table as you show it standing. The zips would have 4 - 90° bends (2 inside corners and 2 - outside) to close the bag around the pivot / handle part of the folded table. Smaller size coil zips go around bends fairly smoothly and your original design had 2 - 90° bends... this would add 2 more is all.

I'm assuming the table as it stands on its legs is fairly stable and the pivot makes a decent "handle" to lift it. Open the bag, grab the "handle" and insert it into the open bag legs down / "handle" up. Close the bag partially but if you left half? Of the handle are open you could just reach in and carry from the pivot point which looks like it would be a good stable carry point fairly well balanced with the center of gravity towards the bottom half. Im thinking the bagged table would stand on its feet as you pictured but with the cover over it.

If you want web carry / hanging straps easy to add those but in the orientation described... loops at / near / above the pivot points continuous down, under the legs and up the other side of the pivots.

In affect the bag would be similar design with zips on the opposite side and straps turned 180°
If you are concerned about the zips binding on the inside corners they could easily be eliminated by making a smooth radius from the side of the folded table to to the outside corner of the pivot point. This are would be " extra" material and allowed to just flop over once closed vs trying to make the cover "fitted" exactly to the shape.
If it makes any sense and you are interested in the above ideas I can sketch and scan as I have no idea how to "draw" on my tablet or laptop. And this is definitely a case where a puc is worth 1,000 words!

This approach just turns your very well done idea upside down and, I think, takes advantage of the normal / natural orientation of the folded tables.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 07:46 AM   #15
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
I've overlaid a clipped picture of one of the tables. I clearly doesn't match the proportions of the model, but does perhaps illustrate the placement a little better.

I did not make the 3D model to scale, as we'd be making a pattern 'by hand' anyway. I was just spit-balling an idea with a vague proportion in mind.

Obviously I'd shape the bag to better meet the proportions of the tables. But I didn't start the 3D model with re-sizing in mind. It's really just a 'fake' series of boxes. I can't just 'shrink' the side wing parts without a lot of manual moving of the fake zipper and handle straps.

As I was presenting the idea to my seamstress her point was making the bag shaped to fit closer to the handle was going to be more trouble than it was likely worth. So having extra, empty square sections at the top corners would make the stitching simpler.

By full enclosing the folded table I help prevent it from being dinged by anything else, like a boat hook pole or other tables/chairs, and from engine room dust. I lose use of the hinge as a handle but that's where the straps acting as a sling come into play.
Attached Thumbnails
2021-04-24 08_13_41-Window.png  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 08:00 AM   #16
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
I had to clean up the shape a bit. Brought the top corners in, added a second velcro wrap-around closure to the handle straps and lowered the side zipper.

Don't know if it'll be a single or dual-pull zipper. Being able to open from just the center would probably be convenient in a few situations.

Don't know of two handle closures will be useful or not. But the straps being drawn square like this lets me possibly use them to 'hang' the bag for storage with the table in it. That and provides some added length for use as a pass-along handle when coming up/down from the engine room. I'd still likely just use a single continuous length of webbing, I wouldn't make a stitched squared corner like that, as that would be uncomfortable to handle and likely weaken the strap. But my drawing skills, and choice of drawing tool, doesn't lend itself to making a curved looking fabric strap.
Attached Thumbnails
sketchup idea.6.jpg  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 08:12 AM   #17
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
These are a couple of bags that demonstrate some of what I'm after. Strap around the bottom to carry the load, end handles for grabbing, long enough straps to help hanging/handling, top-loading, gathered handle wrapped around the straps, etc.

I'm specifically not looking to put D-rings on the ends for a should strap. I feel like these are too heavy for a useful shoulder strap. That and just about EVERY duffel bag I've ever owned has the should strap removed almost immediately. I've got a spare bag of straps, almost as bad as my storage tub of extra USB cables. They'd likely have to be metal to handle the load, and if I didn't use them then they'd be one more bit of metal to smack on the gelcoat to crack it.
Attached Thumbnails
bora centipede table bag loading.jpg  
Attached Images
  
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 01:40 PM   #18
TF Site Team
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,048
Oh! Now I get it the overlay pic was VERY helpful.
I previously thought the fitted bottom shape was to house the pivot point.

Now that I see it we were thinking very similar thought all along. Any / all of the fine tuned options should work fine.
I would highly recommend 2 way zips... you can decide later whether closing towards one end or middle works best for you but with 2 pulls you have choices.
The only difference is one more pull. You don't need to buy separating, specific length zips. You can use the coil zips sold by the yd or ft and buy pulls you insert.
A #8 coil zip is plenty strong for your use and still pretty pliable... A size smaller could work but I wouldn't recommend any larger.

I'm sure the seamstress knows how she wants to assemble this but will offer what I have learned ( and believe it is how the pros would do it)
The top edge that includes the zip is made ahead as a separate assy and then sewn to the other large side panels.
Its a whole lot easier sewing zips to smaller pieces to make up that edge piece that opens separately. You can even make it slightly oversize (length) and either tuck it inside the solid edges especially or assemble it to the other pieces and cut to final length and finish one cut end.
If you think padding / reinforcing would help just plan where ahead and add it to the I side where you think it will help... one obvious area would be on bottom where the legs would put concentrated load/ wear point? If sitting on the legs in the bag.

IMO you've got this! I like you design / plan
As I said having a vision of what you want it especially helpful.
__________________
Don
2008 MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2021, 01:45 PM   #19
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,537
Plan may be on hold, my seamstress was just admitted to the hospital for severe intestinal distress! Now word yet on the cause/condition.

She's such a nice person, I'm worried for her. Please keep her in your thoughts.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2021, 01:34 PM   #20
Newbie
 
City: Vancouver
Vessel Name: Tonda
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1
Thumbs up Table bag

Like a lot of trawler owners I used to have a sail boat. I found that my leftover sail bags were well built and tough. I have used them for many years for this purpose and they are standing up well.
Ps the price was right as well.
__________________

Bob Jack is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
bag, duffel, storage, table, teak

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012
×