Canada extends cruise ship ban until Feb 2022

[soin2la]

The media version:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-cruise-ship-ban-effects-1.5901198

The official version:
https://www.canada.ca/en/transport-...an-for-pleasure-craft-and-cruise-vessels.html

My friends in AK are torn. They rue the tourist revenue losses but are " also relieved we will not have huge floating ships, filled with so many elderly, possibly compromised folks, that could get sick, and need the same limited medical resources us Alaskans rely on."

With international travel becoming more and more of crap shoot; with Canadian borders becoming more restrictive, it begs the question; if US pleasure boats manage to head north to AK in the spring, will they be able to come back through Canada, in September?

 

[Nomad Willy]

It seems Canada sees the gulf Islands as “arctic”.

 

[rsn48]

if US pleasure boats manage to head north to AK in the spring, will they be able to come back through Canada, in September?

There were procedures in place last summer that addressed this, Americans did come through BC to Alaska. Basically the rule is come into BC, report to immigrations. Go the direct route to Alaska and back. No stopping for tourism. You can stop for fuel and supplies. I am guessing the same will be true this summer.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

Different issue/order than border entry requirements. Arctic waters are closed to all pleasure craft use, even by Canadians, unless you reside in a local community. Presumably the government is concerned about spreading the virus to remote communities up there.

So don't use ArriveCan to tell them you are transiting for a NW Passage attempt.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

Also, the smaller, American-flagged cruises like Linblad will presumably operate, it may be a windfall for them, though they are usually booked up most years anyhow.

 

[Toki]

It seems Canada sees the gulf Islands as “arctic”.

Where are you seeing this?

As I read this new proclamation, it seems the border is now being opened to pleasure craft, as long as they don't venture into "Canadian artic waters" (above ~60th parallel). Am I reading this wrong?

 

[soin2la]

Where are you seeing this?

As I read this new proclamation, it seems the border is now being opened to pleasure craft, as long as they don't venture into "Canadian artic waters" (above ~60th parallel). Am I reading this wrong?

This is the same Order implemented on March 13 2020 and extended several times, this being the longest, at one year.

My concerns with recreational transits, is getting caught in a sudden change, such as Canadian returnees, in recent weeks. These folks will need to quarantine in hotels at their own expense, as was done in Australia.

I think any travel to or through another jusisdiction, especially of months long duration, is risky business.

Who wants to leave their boat in AK come fall, if the rules change? Who knows what AK might announce in the coming months?

 

[Lou_tribal]

My concerns with recreational transits, is getting caught in a sudden change, such as Canadian returnees, in recent weeks. These folks will need to quarantine in hotels at their own expense, as was done in Australia.

I would say that this is not a sudden change. People are asked to avoid travels if not absolutely required for almost a year. But as expected people do not respect any of these request if not forced either by law or by cost. So this is what has been put in place. Ones traveling abroad for leisure purpose should have expected this.

L

 

[EyeOnAlaska]

I guess we're barging our boat to Alaska.

Well, Canada made the decision easier today. We're going to barge our recently purchased boat from Seattle to Seward rather than doing the Inside Passage and across the Gulf of Alaska. Hate to give up that epic adventure, but feeling like this is the best decision for us.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

...
Who knows what AK might announce in the coming months?

Lol (sorry). I doubt any restrictions will be announced by the state of Alaska, if anything what few are in place will be relaxed.

 

[Ken E.]

I wonder if the AK-bound cruise ships will go up the outside to Ketchikan. A shame to miss the great inside trip through BC, but if the ocean run is the only way to get there, that will probably be their solution rather than scratching the trips altogether.

 

[koliver]

As I read this new proclamation, it seems the border is now being opened to pleasure craft, as long as they don't venture into "Canadian artic waters" (above ~60th parallel). Am I reading this wrong?

Where are you seeing anything about our borders being opened? I have read the TC orders. They: 1. extend the ban on cruise ships with more than 100 people on board for another year, to Feb 28, 2022 and 2. Ban pleasure boating in arctic waters, other than for locals.
That is all they do.
I presume the border closure, begun March 21, 2020 and extended monthly, will continue to be monitored and extended monthly until it is deemed no longer needed. Should we all get vaccinated, that will likely end. Whether that happens within 2021 remains to be known.

 

[slowgoesit]

I wonder if the AK-bound cruise ships will go up the outside to Ketchikan. A shame to miss the great inside trip through BC, but if the ocean run is the only way to get there, that will probably be their solution rather than scratching the trips altogether.

Won't this run foreign flagged vessels foul of the Jones Act if they don't put ashore at least once in Canada? Not sure what the mix of foreign vs US flagged ships is . . . that is if there even ARE any US Flagged ships . . .

 

[jungpeter]

if US pleasure boats manage to head north to AK in the spring, will they be able to come back through Canada, in September?

There were procedures in place last summer that addressed this, Americans did come through BC to Alaska. Basically the rule is come into BC, report to immigrations. Go the direct route to Alaska and back. No stopping for tourism. You can stop for fuel and supplies. I am guessing the same will be true this summer.

OK, so what's the definition of "tourism"? Is anchoring up overnight in Miles Inlet and dropping a crab trap "tourism"? Is taking the dog ashore to do it's business "tourism"? Is taking a month to transit BC from Washington State to Alaska a "direct route"?

I've been unsuccessful at obtaining guidance to such questions from either the Transport Canada or the Provincial BC websites. And I'd hate to plan to transit to AK from WA this spring, only to show up in Bedwell or Nanaimo Customs and be turned away.

Any ideas on guidance for us non-cruise ship recreational tourists? Or whatever us boat-guys are called that might like to transit BC by water? Maybe a phone number that connects to an actual KNOWLEDGEABLE individual?

Regards,

Pete

 

[Alaskaflyer]

I wonder if the AK-bound cruise ships will go up the outside to Ketchikan. A shame to miss the great inside trip through BC, but if the ocean run is the only way to get there, that will probably be their solution rather than scratching the trips altogether.

Won't this run foreign flagged vessels foul of the Jones Act if they don't put ashore at least once in Canada? Not sure what the mix of foreign vs US flagged ships is . . . that is if there even ARE any US Flagged ships . . .

Similar to the Jones Act - crossposted from another thread:

The Passenger Vessel Services Act of 1886 prohibits foreign flagged vessels from taking American passengers from a US port to another US port; or from a US port back to the same US port without a stop in a foreign port first.

Since no typical large cruise ship is US flagged any more, as a practical matter these large cruise ships cannot do their Alaska cruises from Seattle, Portland etc. without a stop at a Canadian port without cost prohibitive fines. So if Canada prohibits them in their waters...they are done.

Even if they steamed them empty up to Juneau or Anchorage and tried to depart and return from/to there, they would still run afoul of US law, unless they touched base in Canada somewhere...or Russia or Japan

US flagged vessels doing smaller niche cruises such as those offered by Linblad and others could sail outside Canadian territorial waters or stay under the 100-passenger cap in the order and probably be good. But most of those sailings depart from Alaskan ports like Juneau or Ketchikan anyhow.

Congress or an E.O. or regulation might put in place some waiver process similar to what you can obtain for the Jones Act (which is a somewhat similar protectionism law), I don't know about that, but I'm guessing if there was one, the big companies would have pursued it already.

As a side note of interest, these cruise companies like Princess, Holland America, etc. with foreign-flagged vessels sailing from Seattle or other US ports must ensure that all passengers return with them or they pay a per-passenger fine of around $750 under the law. If you've ever been on one of these cruises, when you ticketed you were given a notice that if you choose to depart the cruise early e.g. cruise to Anchorage, leave and fly home to Wichita, you will pay this amount as a "fee" which is really passing the fine through to the customer.

 

[Alaskaflyer]

OK, so what's the definition of "tourism"? Is anchoring up overnight in Miles Inlet and dropping a crab trap "tourism"? Is taking the dog ashore to do it's business "tourism"? Is taking a month to transit BC from Washington State to Alaska a "direct route"?

I've been unsuccessful at obtaining guidance to such questions from either the Transport Canada or the Provincial BC websites. And I'd hate to plan to transit to AK from WA this spring, only to show up in Bedwell or Nanaimo Customs and be turned away.

Any ideas on guidance for us non-cruise ship recreational tourists? Or whatever us boat-guys are called that might like to transit BC by water? Maybe a phone number that connects to an actual KNOWLEDGEABLE individual?

Regards,

Pete

From Transport Canada:

Mandatory masks and physical distancing during transit
Transiting travellers may only make essential stops along the way, including to use facilities, refuel or for essential supplies.

You must follow physical distancing practices and wear a non-medical mask or face covering during these stops.

Anchoring and quarantine requirements
You may stop and anchor out of ordinary navigation, particularly if it becomes dangerous to navigate at night or if the crew must rest before safely continuing your trip.

If you anchor to spend the night, you must quarantine on your vessel or boat. If this is not possible, you may quarantine at a hotel until you are ready to resume your trip.

Mandatory quarantine

Reporting requirement if you land on Canadian soil
If at any point a transiting vessel lands on Canadian soil, anchors, moors or comes alongside another vessel in Canadian waters, or if anyone onboard disembarks in Canada, the operator must report to the CBSA.

You may not land for an optional reason.

The CBSA and its law enforcement partners are actively monitoring Canadian waterways. If you fail to report to the CBSA, even if your purpose is non-discretionary (non-optional) such as to refuel, you may face severe penalties. Failure to report may also affect your immigration admissibility and ability to re-enter Canada in the future.

 

[soin2la]

I wonder if the AK-bound cruise ships will go up the outside to Ketchikan. A shame to miss the great inside trip through BC, but if the ocean run is the only way to get there, that will probably be their solution rather than scratching the trips altogether.

How many can do that without stopping in a foreign port?
Hah!
AKflyer beat me to it.

 

[soin2la]

I would say that this is not a sudden change. So this is what has been put in place. Ones traveling abroad for leisure purpose should have expected this.

The orders for mandatory quarantine came pretty suddenly but I agree with your last sentence. Many Canadians knew the risks in a volatile period and chose to go anyway. Now they are whining about the unfairness of forced hotel stays.

 

[soin2la]

I've been unsuccessful at obtaining guidance to such questions from either the Transport Canada or the Provincial BC websites. And I'd hate to plan to transit to AK from WA this spring, only to show up in Bedwell or Nanaimo Customs and be turned away.

CBSA is the agency you need and I believe Bedwell is not operational.

 

[soin2la]

Lol (sorry). I doubt any restrictions will be announced by the state of Alaska, if anything what few are in place will be relaxed.

Careful, covid is far from over and that may or may not be the last LOL.
If Canada doesn't get 'er shite together, we may become the pariah to AK. They could easily put a chain across the BC AK border.

 

[jungpeter]

From Transport Canada:

Mandatory masks and physical distancing during transit
Transiting travellers may only make essential stops along the way, including to use facilities, refuel or for essential supplies.

You must follow physical distancing practices and wear a non-medical mask or face covering during these stops.

Anchoring and quarantine requirements
You may stop and anchor out of ordinary navigation, particularly if it becomes dangerous to navigate at night or if the crew must rest before safely continuing your trip.

If you anchor to spend the night, you must quarantine on your vessel or boat. If this is not possible, you may quarantine at a hotel until you are ready to resume your trip.

Mandatory quarantine

Reporting requirement if you land on Canadian soil
If at any point a transiting vessel lands on Canadian soil, anchors, moors or comes alongside another vessel in Canadian waters, or if anyone onboard disembarks in Canada, the operator must report to the CBSA.

You may not land for an optional reason.

The CBSA and its law enforcement partners are actively monitoring Canadian waterways. If you fail to report to the CBSA, even if your purpose is non-discretionary (non-optional) such as to refuel, you may face severe penalties. Failure to report may also affect your immigration admissibility and ability to re-enter Canada in the future.

Hi Alaskaflyer,

OK, WHERE in Transport Canada did you excerpt this guidance? Can you provide a URL, or some hint that sends me in this direction? I've mined the Transport Canada URL (including the Marine Transportation subsection, and many others) until I'm blue in the face. And I can't locate your provided verbiage.

Ditto with CBSA. Your verbiage states "...If at any point a transiting vessel lands on Canadian soil, anchors, moors or comes alongside another vessel in Canadian waters, or if anyone onboard disembarks in Canada, the operator must report to the CBSA."

OK again. But report to whom in CBSA? Are you saying that CBSA will want to know Fido went ashore at the terminus of Allison Sound to take a leak? And how am I supposed to make this report? Carrier pigeon? I'm not trying to be argumentative here, merely trying to figure out the mechanics of this goat-rope.

Regards,

Pete

 

[soin2la]

Are you saying that CBSA will want to know Fido went ashore at the terminus of Allison Sound to take a leak? And how am I supposed to make this report? Carrier pigeon?

Over thinking Peter.
You report once, usually when you enter or on your first stop.
Have you not entered Canada by boat before?

 

[soin2la]

Wasn't Boatpoker denied transit through the US to the Bahamas?

 

[Jay N]

Hi Pete.


https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/services/covid/non-canadians-canadiens-eng.html#s5

 

[markpierce]

I wonder if the AK-bound cruise ships will go up the outside to Ketchikan. A shame to miss the great inside trip through BC, but if the ocean run is the only way to get there, that will probably be their solution rather than scratching the trips altogether.

Not unusual for cruise ships to take the ocean route to/from Ketchikan.

What has been the effect on US ferries serving Alaska?

 

[soin2la]

Not unusual for cruise ships to take the ocean route to Ketchikan.

It is usual for them to call at Victoria or Vancouver, which is not allowed now.

What has been the effect of US ferries serving Alaska?

They transit nonstop.
Man, this has been chewed over so many times of late.

 

[jungpeter]

Over thinking Peter.
You report once, usually when you enter or on your first stop.
Have you not entered Canada by boat before?

Over thinking? No, but still decidedly confused. I fully understand entry requirements of US citizens into Canada by recreational vessels from both Washington State and Alaska, having done so for several decades. My issue isn't how, where, or when to report my entry into Canada. But it's a given, that after entry (either afloat via NEXUS or ashore at a Port of Entry, such as Nanaimo) and before I reach the northern border of BC, I will anchor up somewhere in the boonies during a transit to SEAK. And Fido (and I) WILL go ashore to pee!.

CBSA specifically states

"...If at any point a transiting vessel lands on Canadian soil, anchors, moors or comes alongside another vessel in Canadian waters, or if anyone onboard disembarks in Canada, the operator must report to the CBSA.

So, what are the mechanics of making this notification? CBSA does not make such anchorage, moorage, rafting, etc. illegal, but does require notification thereof. OK, fine. They acknowledge Fido's gotta pee. But do I make this notification immediately upon anchoring? I can (usually) reach CBSA via cell phone, but what if cellular coverage is absent? If I anchor multiple times, do I report multiple times?

Obviously, all this is moot, should I be able to enter, then proceed non-stop to the northern border, and cross back into CONUS. Which isn't going to happen. But unless and until I can talk person-to-person with someone in CBSA responsible for the Province of BC, I'm still baffled. The written instructions simply don't make practical sense, particularly in those areas outside of routine cellular coverage, or not close to a Port of Entry (where CBSA personnel hang out).

Equally obvious is I'm grasping at straws to justify further planning for yet another transit through BC to SEAK this spring. The Canadian Government at the highest level, and many Canadian citizens as well, holler loud and clear-JUST DON'T COME! I get that, and I'm sympathetic to that narrative, and I'm not trying to engage in that narrative. BUT, then why does CBSA post such contradictory and confusing instructions on just how to do so????

As I said, still decidedly confused.

Regards,

Pete

 

[soin2la]

But unless and until I can talk person-to-person with someone in CBSA responsible for the Province of BC, I'm still baffled.

Have you tried either of these numbers?

Nanaimo CBSA
1-250-754-7174

Telephone reporting centre
1-888-226-7277

 

[Okydowky]

For some reason some people do not understand there is a pandemic that has been lingering on way to long because of ignorance. Let it be in Canada or any other Country!
Do any of you watch world news and see how things have been handled, dealt with?
There are countries that are back to normal, in every way including economy. They treat any one entering there county as if they have the plague, including there own residence. It obviously works, or tell me I’m wrong?

Everyone’s waters are closed for one reason, to stop the risk of spreading this crap. But for some reason all I hear it’s my right to boat, and it’s unfair. We have no problems with US boats in our waters, but right now HELLO! Pandemic. So for now keep doing circles around your islands down south as we will do up here.

Alaskan’s please chime in here! I’m sure Alaska does not want any extra traffic in there waters or drain on there medical system even if your American.

No matter how well equipped your super boat is, you still have to rely on the dirt world.

Be thankful you can still boat.

 

[MurrayM]

For some reason some people do not understand there is a pandemic...

This sort of topic has popped up on a regular basis over the last year, and I've noticed a significant decline in the number of people who bristle over their lack of freedom to boat across our borders.

This means they are understanding things, or at least have reached a level of shoulder shrugging acceptance.