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Old 12-24-2017, 03:59 PM   #41
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I find this whole boater safety card nonsense so pathetic. With no requirement to demonstrate the safe operation of a vessel or too have ever been on one, this is nothing more than a feel good meaningless gesture. In the USA we've had automobile driver education requirements for 40+ years. That includes extensive classroom and behind the wheel time followed by a state driving evaluation. I find it so incredible that a person who has never been on a boat, can purchase and operate one capable of going 40+ knots, and the state feels they've made a difference by requiring an online safety course for an all but meaningless card.

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Old 12-24-2017, 04:18 PM   #42
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Has anyone heard of someone losing their boating card for bad behavior ( similar to the way a drunk driver or habitual speeder can lose their driver's license ) ??

as an analyst, I put a lot of stock in statistics, and one that has stuck out for me is the following from the 2016 USCG accident report.

Only 13% percent of deaths occurred on
vessels where the operator had received a nationally-approved boating safety
education certificate.

Sure...there are reasons that could be skewed, and the USCG might want to skew the results to make training look more valuable.....but, most folks here have a ton of experience and that may also be skewing the reaction to training requirements. For example, everyone here knows that you need a lot more anchor line than depth....but a total landlubber might not. Things that seem like commons sense to an experienced boater might not be so common to a segment of the population....and THAT segment is who will benefit from training....AND are more likely to do something stupid and cause an accident.

Its a hassle for an old salt to have to jump through a few hoops to run his own boat...but it also a hassle for some novice kayaker to get swept out to sea, or a ski boat operator chew up a skier in his prop because he didn't have an observer, or run over a diver because he didn't know what a dive flag meant.

I find I'm getting more liberal as I get older....but I'm willing to inconvenience a few old salts to save a few lives.
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Old 12-24-2017, 04:28 PM   #43
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In NJ, you lose it for either a DUI or BUI. I believe the judge determines the length of time.

We need to get marine LEOs to put some teeth into the program...but my guess is the court system and prosecuters are shying away from enforcement on many levels.

Heck, we had a hard time getting the District Attorney to prosecute fishermen for endangering Coasties doing their job, so you can guess how bad boating behavior of prominent citizens rates on their list of crimes.
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Old 12-24-2017, 05:12 PM   #44
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NY similar to NJ... boating & driving are reciprocal. .. lose one lose both.

Lot of room to argue requirements aren't perfect...won't help etc.
Anything better than nothing IMHO
Recently took NY road test for driving motorhome > 26,000#
NY has no book no online info to help educate drivers.
This is not CDL and 80%? of that doesn't apply...and the real hooker is legally you are on a learner permit and need a properly licensed driver along even when practicing.
At least in the boatong world there is educational material being provided.

Ideally boating shoild be closer to driving... different class licenses...2HP on a dingy very different that a 50' Trawler or a 30' go fast boat but no difference in card reqmts? ??
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Old 12-24-2017, 06:45 PM   #45
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I've been a boater for over 55 years, graduating in that time from a 9' rowboat to what I now have. Also, over those same years I've taken a boating course 5 times. I started with a USPS course in 1967 and the most recent was a USCGA course in about 2010. I've taken courses online and also in the classroom.


I think a person tends to gain more actual knowledge from taking it in a classroom setting. The reason for this is the exchange of information and ideas between the people in the classroom. Especially when it comes to local knowledge about the waters one is going to be boating on. Those are bits of information that you don't get from a computer.
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Old 12-24-2017, 07:01 PM   #46
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Bac. Iím a new yorker and have a canada TC card. Am i covered for NY? I read NY website and dont understand their reciprocity rules. Also have USCG aux card but dont see that listed.
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Old 12-25-2017, 10:47 AM   #47
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Bac. Iím a new yorker and have a canada TC card. Am i covered for NY? I read NY website and dont understand their reciprocity rules. Also have USCG aux card but dont see that listed.
dd

Hi "neighbor" we live in the Corning area and keep our boat on Seneca Lk
I'm not sure about Canada but first guess doubt it.
NY is sticky about NASBLA certified courses and I see it also requires any card be state issued to be reciprocal.
I looked up info to confirm my understanding that USCG & USPS courses satisfied the NY reqm'ts and was surprised to find this in their FAQs...

I have a US Coast Guard Auxiliary boating safety certificate. Can I exchange it for a New York boating safety certificate?
No. The same is true for US Power Squadron boating safety certificate. New York State can only issue a boating safety certificate to persons that have successfully completed a NYS classroom course.


Applicable sites / docs I found

Boating Education Reciprocity

NY Boater Education FAQ

I have successfully used my USPS Certified Instructor Card in other states that require boater cards but it looks like that wouldn't hold in NY. I was under the impression that USPS & USCG courses were acceptable in NY but the info states otherwise...I need to do more checking w/ our Squadron Education officer.
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Old 12-25-2017, 02:36 PM   #48
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dd

Hi "neighbor" we live in the Corning area and keep our boat on Seneca Lk
I'm not sure about Canada but first guess doubt it.
NY is sticky about NASBLA certified courses and I see it also requires any card be state issued to be reciprocal.
I looked up info to confirm my understanding that USCG & USPS courses satisfied the NY reqm'ts and was surprised to find this in their FAQs...

I have a US Coast Guard Auxiliary boating safety certificate. Can I exchange it for a New York boating safety certificate?
No. The same is true for US Power Squadron boating safety certificate. New York State can only issue a boating safety certificate to persons that have successfully completed a NYS classroom course.


Applicable sites / docs I found

Boating Education Reciprocity

NY Boater Education FAQ

I have successfully used my USPS Certified Instructor Card in other states that require boater cards but it looks like that wouldn't hold in NY. I was under the impression that USPS & USCG courses were acceptable in NY but the info states otherwise...I need to do more checking w/ our Squadron Education officer.
Most jurisdictions try to use language similar to that used in the Canadian regs:

"for a visitor to Canada, an operator card or other document that meets the requirements of his or her home state or country."

Check your State's language to be sure.
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Old 12-25-2017, 03:23 PM   #49
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"Who needs the NYS Boater Education Course?

All boaters born on or after May 1st, 1996 are required to successfully complete an approved boater education course in order to operate a motorboat."

Looks like no education is rqrd. for most of us.
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Old 12-25-2017, 03:25 PM   #50
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you do if you drop down to NJ....

and also in CT waters I think.
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Old 12-25-2017, 03:35 PM   #51
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I see now that NJ needs a license for all ages. So, their web indicates my USCGA course in 1992 works for the education end of things, but you still need to get the $24 four year license. IF you operate for over 90 days.
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Old 12-25-2017, 05:11 PM   #52
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Bac. Iím a new yorker and have a canada TC card. Am i covered for NY? I read NY website and dont understand their reciprocity rules. Also have USCG aux card but dont see that listed.
dd
after digging further here is my current understanding...

USCG / USPS certificates are accepted proof of education to satisfy the NYS reqm'ts (note they must be carried on person / aboard)

From the NYS Parks website re:Boater Safety Courses


Motorboats
New Law Effective May 1st 2014
All individuals born on or after 5/1/96 are now required to successfully complete an approved course in boater education in order to operate a motorboat. Approved courses include those offered by NYS Parks, the U.S. Coast Guard Auxiliary or the U.S. Power Squadrons. Individuals less than 10 years of age may not take this course of instruction. Certain allowances to this law have been made for visitors to New York, persons renting a boat from a livery and persons purchasing a new boat for the first time. Please refer to Frequently Asked Questions for more information. Find a Boating Safety Course near you.


I think the source of some of the confusion may be the website I linked in my previous reply. The way I interpret that now is the following:
  1. USCG / USPS course certificates will satisfy NYS boater education reqm'ts (must be carried aboard)
  2. USCG / USPS course certificates will allow application for the NY Adventure License Boating Endorsement (must be carried aboard)
  3. USCG / USPS course certificates can not be exchanged for a NYS Boater Safety Certificate
  4. USPS online course does satisfy NY Boating Safety Certificate course requirements (accepted for NY Boater Safety Cert and for the Adventure License)

This page has info on applying for the endorsement on your driver license
NY Boater Education & Adventure License

it states :
If you have a U.S. Coast Guard Auxiliary or U.S. Power Squadron Boating Safety Certificate, you must bring your original certificate directly to any DMV office.
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Old 12-25-2017, 07:46 PM   #53
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"Who needs the NYS Boater Education Course?

All boaters born on or after May 1st, 1996 are required to successfully complete an approved boater education course in order to operate a motorboat."

Looks like no education is rqrd. for most of us.
True for most of us older boaters.
The only exception is for operating a PWC - everyone in NY now needs a certificate.
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Old 12-25-2017, 07:50 PM   #54
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you do if you drop down to NJ....

and also in CT waters I think.
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I believe that applies to NJ & CT residents. I won't think any of the states impose those reqmts for transient boaters. Same for driving motorhomes & 5th wheel trailers... if you are legal in home state of your DL you are legal in other states.
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:04 PM   #55
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I believe that applies to NJ & CT residents. I won't think any of the states impose those reqmts for transient boaters. Same for driving motorhomes & 5th wheel trailers... if you are legal in home state of your DL you are legal in other states.
I know NJ requires some form of certification.....not to their level but some form of boating safety course.....

If not, they will ask you to leave NJ waters....even if your home state doesnt require you to have a safety card.

Taught their course for 13 years.

Straight from tge NJ manual......

1) There are NO EXEMPTIONS to New Jersey age re-
quirements.
2) Out-of-state residents in New Jersey for less than 90
days with a certifi cate issued by their state or country;
OR written proof of completion of a substantially similar
course to the NJ-approved course will satisfy the educa-
tion requirements.
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:12 PM   #56
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It's my impression that most of these cards are good for life? The states that I have looked at will all take my USCG current masters (captain's license ) license in place of their card. It seems that if I let my license lapse, it's no longer a valid substitute. Are others reading it that way also?

Ted
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:24 PM   #57
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I know NJ requires some form of certification.....not to their level but some form of boating safety course.....

If not, they will ask you to leave NJ waters....even if your home state doesnt require you to have a safety card.

Taught their course for 13 years.

Straight from tge NJ manual......

1) There are NO EXEMPTIONS to New Jersey age re-
quirements.
2) Out-of-state residents in New Jersey for less than 90
days with a certifi cate issued by their state or country;
OR written proof of completion of a substantially similar
course to the NJ-approved course will satisfy the educa-
tion requirements.
I stand corrected - that's tougher than my understanding of driver license reqmts for motorhomes >26,000#.

Thanks
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Old 12-25-2017, 08:25 PM   #58
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It's my impression that most of these cards are good for life? The states that I have looked at will all take my USCG current masters (captain's license ) license in place of their card. It seems that if I let my license lapse, it's no longer a valid substitute. Are others reading it that way also?

Ted
That is typically what I've seen. Captain's license good but only if it's valid. Makes sense that it can't substitute when it's no longer in effect.
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Old 12-25-2017, 09:03 PM   #59
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That is typically what I've seen. Captain's license good but only if it's valid. Makes sense that it can't substitute when it's no longer in effect.
This isn't a license (state safe boating card), this is a non expiring certificate of knowledge card. Seems kind of ludicrous to say you have the knowledge when you have a USCG license, but the knowledge magically goes away if you let you license expire.

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Old 12-25-2017, 09:24 PM   #60
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This isn't a license (state safe boating card), this is a non expiring certificate of knowledge card. Seems kind of ludicrous to say you have the knowledge when you have a USCG license, but the knowledge magically goes away if you let you license expire.

Ted
Cant say I agree with NJ theory totally, but it is about currency.

I think they could have made it if you were a current licensed captain until say 10 years ago, maybe even 5.....as things do change.....

However, the same can be said with the boating card 10 years from now, how "current" are the recent graduates going to be then?

I think I posted earlier, the beauracratic wheels just get close, they never seem to hit the nail squarely on the head as there are always loopholes and the line gets drawn arbitrarily someplace.
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