Boat for general cruising and great loop

[High Wire]

The East Bay or Back Cove style yachts are popular for those that want to loop above displacement speeds. There are plenty of wide open stretches suitable for higher speeds. Just as there are narrow or heavy traffic area that you need to slow down and not wake the snot out of others.

 

[GH41]

Outboards are faster and easier to replace if necessary.
Remember, they now have diesel outboards too.

Have you looked at what outboards cost. Another downside for a cruiser is nobody that had a choice would want a gas generator in his bilge. Most outboard boats have diesel gen sets. Now your carrying 2 kinds of fuel.

 

[Frosty]

Have you looked at what outboards cost. Another downside for a cruiser is nobody that had a choice would want a gas generator in his bilge. Most outboard boats have diesel gen sets. Now your carrying 2 kinds of fuel.

Although with diesel engine, to stick with one kind of fuel you'd have to power dinghy with oars (which I enjoy) or electric (charge while running diesel main). Also no cooking with propane.

I'd guess most people still carry gas for a dinghy outboard at this point.

Not saying which way one should choose; just that the "only carry one fuel" may or may not work out anyway.

 

[jbinbi]

Lots of powerboats will do that and run slow too (see avatar) , so limiting your search to powercats and "swift" trawlers... may overly restrict your search for the right boat.

-Chris

Thank you. Can you recommend some manufacturers and lines? I know sailboats well. I know the few powercats, and I know the trawlers. But not other types.

The American Tug is a good suggestion as it will do what the Bene swift does. For range and economy, doing 8kts is fine. But I would like to do at least 12 and hopefully 16. 12 gets you there 50% faster, it is significant. Maybe not for great loop, but in the NE I am 55 mi from port to Martha Vineyard, at 12 kts that is 4 hours, which means I get in by lunch, not dinner. I find a mooring ball, not worry about not getting one.

 

[ssobol]

... In planning the trip I felt I would prefer to run at roughly 10 miles per hour for 10 hour days. ...

You need to find a boat where running at 10 MPH is actually an economical speed. For most boats that are capable of 24 mph or more, 10 MPH is probably not really a usable speed.

 

[smitty477]

You need to find a boat where running at 10 MPH is actually an economical speed. For most boats that are capable of 24 mph or more, 10 MPH is probably not really a usable speed.

I would really like to hear about example boats that fit into this description.
We have had a few boats that could cruise at higher than hull speeds and also got reasonable economy at 10 mph.
Of course 9 and 8 mph were also more economical than 10mph but that appears to be the fact with any boat that we know of.

 

[JLD]

While I agree that running 10 mph likely is not an economical speed (if hull speed is 8 mph), it does become more economical if running an average of 10 mph.

If I were doing the loop (or even a half-loop), I would likely do it with an average speed above 8 mph. This doesn't mean above 8 mph, every day though. I would plan on travel every other day with a day off to see the sites or wait out the weather. There are several cities that I would hang out for a week or so. If I got to a place like the Georgian Bay, I also would chill for a couple of weeks!

Jim

 

[ranger58sb]

Thank you. Can you recommend some manufacturers and lines? I know sailboats well. I know the few powercats, and I know the trawlers. But not other types.

Cruisers, Carver, Meridian, Bayliner, Silverton, Navigator, Sea Ray, Tiara, Ocean Alexander, Tollycraft, Hatteras, Californian, Hinckley, Eastbay, Sabre, Back Cove, etc...

But maybe easier if you go to yachtworld.com and just search on boats between 42-52' or so (for example) that are in your neck of the woods... see what appeals.

Almost anything that calls itself a motor yacht, aft cabin motor yacht, cockpit motor yacht, convertible, sedan, sedan bridge, etc. may have features you want.

-Chris

 

[Rufus]

A wide beam powercat will limit available slips in many marinas.

 

[mvweebles]

Thank you. Can you recommend some manufacturers and lines? I know sailboats well. I know the few powercats, and I know the trawlers. But not other types.

The American Tug is a good suggestion as it will do what the Bene swift does. For range and economy, doing 8kts is fine. But I would like to do at least 12 and hopefully 16. 12 gets you there 50% faster, it is significant. Maybe not for great loop, but in the NE I am 55 mi from port to Martha Vineyard, at 12 kts that is 4 hours, which means I get in by lunch, not dinner. I find a mooring ball, not worry about not getting one.

As Ranger42c states, a large percentage of 40-ish foot boats were equipped with twin 300-350 hp diesels, all of which will cruise at 15-20 kts as long as you have adequate reserve on your credit card. Forums like this seem to focus on economy so we often shift focus there, but if your focus is need-for-speed, the world really opens-up for you.

Here's what 5-mins of googling/yachtworld found (no endorsements, just a query).

I haven't seen PDQ PowerCat mentioned in this thread, though understand the OP has researched all PCs. For others who may be interested, here's a PDQ 34 on Yachtworld . https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2005/pdq-passage-maker-3652800/

A GB42 with twin 350's that will probably do 20-kts top speed.
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2000/grand-banks-42-europa-3646492/

A Mainship 400 with a single 480hp that states 16kts cruise
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2004/mainship-400-trawler-3684784/

Tollycraft 44 where owner states he cruises at 16.5 kts at 22 gph
https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s9/sale-1990-44ft-tollycraft-florida-47751.html

Navigator 52 with twin 370hp Volvos with claimed speed of 18-20 kts.
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1995/navigator-53-classic-motoryacht-3577821/

List goes on and on. Look for a boat with twin >300hp diesels and it should get you 15+ kts at cruise, yet throttled back to 8-kts will get you economical cruising of around 5-6 gph, maybe less. Beyond that, it's a personal style and affordability thing. If I can suggest, OP may want to narrow his choice a bit and querry the forum for feedback. For example, the Navigator 52 with Volvo's above would likely get plenty of "parts are expensive and sometimes hard to find" responses.

 

[rslifkin]

A large percentage of 40-ish foot boats built after 2000 were equipped with twin 300-350 hp diesels, all of which will cruise at 15-18 kts as long as you have adequate reserve on your credit card.

I haven't seen PDQ PowerCat mentioned though understand the OP has researched all PCs. For others who may be interested, here's a PDQ 34 on Yachtworld . https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2005/pdq-passage-maker-3652800/

A GB42 with twin 350's that will probably do 20-kts top speed.
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2000/grand-banks-42-europa-3646492/

A Mainship 400 with a single 480hp that states 16kts cruise
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2004/mainship-400-trawler-3684784/

Tollycraft 44 where owner states he cruises at 16.5 kts at 22 gph
https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s9/sale-1990-44ft-tollycraft-florida-47751.html

Navigator 52 with twin 370hp Volvos with claimed speed of 18-20 kts.
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1995/navigator-53-classic-motoryacht-3577821/

List goes on and on. Look for a boat with twin >300hp diesels and it should get you 15+ kts at cruise, yet throttled back to 8-kts will get you economical cruising of around 5-6 gph, maybe less. Beyond that, it's a personal style and affordability thing.

Of those types listed, I'd put the Navigator and Tolly above the GB and Mainship if there's a desire to go fast. The GB and Mainship can plane, but they're not really built to go fast all the time. It's more of a "go slow and if you shove enough power in there it can sprint a bit". While the Navigator and Tolly are meant to plane and will likely happier about running fast for hours at a time. Looking at the hulls will show some significant differences between them.

 

[psneeld]

I believe some Downeasters have cruise at around 12-15 and run 20+. I think that ability comes from being able to run when light(er) but still have a high cruise (well above displacement) if heavily loaded.


The old keel drive 26' Shamrocks were almost on plane at 10 knots...butthey were real flat for a long way from the transom.

 

[mvweebles]

Of those types listed, I'd put the Navigator and Tolly above the GB and Mainship if there's a desire to go fast. The GB and Mainship can plane, but they're not really built to go fast all the time. It's more of a "go slow and if you shove enough power in there it can sprint a bit". While the Navigator and Tolly are meant to plane and will likely happier about running fast for hours at a time. Looking at the hulls will show some significant differences between them.

Best advice I can give the OP is to narrow down their preferences and budget. Flybridge? Dedicated pilothouse? Aft cabin for separated staterooms vs sedan with aft deck? Galley up or down? Budget? Sleek euro-style or traditional/trawler style? etc.

Problem is that, with exception of air-draft due to wanting to do the loop, the only classification of boat's the OP has ruled out is arguably one of the narrowest in terms of brands: full displacement boats such as Nordhavn, KK, DD, some Defevers, and of course my beloved Willard. Virtually everything else is in-play for the Exam Question.

Peter

 

[OldDan1943]

A wide beam powercat will limit available slips in many marinas.

 

[ecruise]

When traveling the Great Loop, speed capability isnt worth much. The old argument about needing speed to outrun a storm is pretty antiquated these days. If you only pay partial attention to weather forecasts, there's very little chance of being "surprised" by a storm. For most people, the loop is all about taking your time, enjoying the scenery, seeing new things and meeting new people. Trying to go fast just adds to frustration and stress, and deprives you of a great experience.
Personally, I've always loved speed and have owned boats that went 80 mph plus...but the most pleasurable boating I've ever done was the 1000 miles we traveled last summer , at 7kts.
As for boat reccommendations, our Monk 36 trawler is perfect for us and burning 1.2 - 1.3 gal per hour, is an economical way to do the loop.

 

[PNK]

Boat for General Cruising and Great Loop

Someone probably already included this in one of the replies, but don't forget air height; if you want to do the Great Loop ,that can't be more than 19', which still includes a lot of boats, but not all. Also from personal experience make sure you have a good-fitting set of screens, or good A/C; there are some beautiful areas where you will want to anchor, but which have unbelievable numbers of flies and mosquitoes at certain times of the year. A friend and I stupidly forgot to check our screens before setting out a few years ago, and the night they became an emergency need, found one had a big tear. We learned our lesson, but had a miserable couple of hours!
Peter

 

[PaulB.]

Sorry if this is a duplicate. Definitely join the ALCGA for info on the route. If cats are high on your list you might consider the PDQ 41. Under 3 feet draft, 14 foot air draft with folding radar arch down, 18 foot beam is wide but manageable at most marinas. 30 knots. Queen berth with full walk around. BUT if you have bad knees how agile is your partner? There is a lot to be said for trawlers with full safe dock level walk arounds for locking (150 on the loop) and docking. You will need twins to get your higher speed.

 

[swimmer]

You might look at Great Harbour TT35
Queen bed
Separate shower
10 gph at 15 knots
5 gph at 10 knots

 

[jbinbi]

A wide beam powercat will limit available slips in many marinas.

Very familiar with this issue as I am coming from a sailing cat.

However, in looking at specs, I see many 40' boats are 13.9' wide. Standard slips are usually 14'. Or is that not an issue. You are not going to fit in by just a few inches...

 

[Joe Pica]

Consider a Great Harbour although few are available. Their beam is 15'11" with a full peninsula normal queen berth hard chined unsinkable 48,000lb boat in an USCG LOA of 37'drafting 3' in fresh water making them behave similar to a cat albeit a monohull displacement boat with unbelievable room. It is heavy and slow (8knts) as it is an efficient displacement speed only boat. Remember that to go fast in a big boat you will need big engines crammed into a small engine space. The N-37 Great Harbour has a walk in stand up (for me) engine room with two small Yanmars and great easy access to all systems. Huge all fiberglass tanks lot's of capacity. It is a well behaved boat in sea state that I cruised for 44,000 miles 3 great loops and most of the entire western rivers.

 

[jeffnick]

Boat for the Loop?


As for stability - here we get waked while rafted to a Parker -

 

[Benthic2]

The OP asked for boats with very few parameters...and instead of being helpful.....everyone told him is parameters were wrong. He knows boating and is sick of being restricted to 50 miles/day.

OP: The best boat for cruising may not be the best for looping, and I think everyone is focusing more on looping than the FL, NE cruising you also mentioned.

A big factor is going to be budget and handyman ability/willingness.....Do you want something that still has that "new car" smell, or something that has some miles under her keel, and again, that's going to come down to budget. $100k brand new boat is very different than a $100k 25 year old boat. Same thing with size: $100k 25 footer is a much different boat than a $100k 40 footer.........

You might want to look at some boats on Yachtworld and rephrase your question as "I found a 2000 Bayliner 3388 for sale that looks interesting, can you guys suggest more boats like this ?" and you will get a ton of feedback.

Here's a link to that boat:

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2000/bayliner-3388-command-bridge-motoryacht-3587405/

You mentioned the Northeast and Florida. If you thinking of trailering it between those spots, you may want to look at Ranger Tugs or Cutwater boats. They are trailerable, but give up some beam to be that way.

Here's a Ranger R-31
https://www.rangertugs.com/models.aspx?itemid=2634&prodid=12354&pagetitle=Ranger-Tugs-R-31-S

If you don't mind going down to 27 feet you can get outboard power.

Cutwater ( same company as Ranger but without the "tug look" ) has a 35 footer with outboard power that I don't know much about but have always been intrigued by it. Its got 2 300hp outboards and looks like it moves right along.

https://www.cutwaterboats.com/models.aspx?itemid=2710&prodid=94496&pagetitle=C-32-CB#specs

If you take a look a those and say you want something newer, longer, cheaper, whatever......then we'll have a starting point.

Enjoy the search !

 

[rsn48]

Here's a good article about what type of boat for the loop. I've read a few articles on recommendations for what type/size boat for trips from Tacoma/Seattle up to Alaska. The one suggestion was to figure out what size you think is necessary to make the intended trip, then go smaller. The article I'm linking to also makes this suggestion:

https://captainjohn.org/GL-Boat1.html

 

[OldDan1943]

Here's a good article about what type of boat for the loop. I've read a few articles on recommendations for what type/size boat for trips from Tacoma/Seattle up to Alaska. The one suggestion was to figure out what size you think is necessary to make the intended trip, then go smaller. The article I'm linking to also makes this suggestion:

https://captainjohn.org/GL-Boat1.html

Good article. He did point out one important point, when buying a boat.
1. RSN made this point. Decide on the boat size then, buy one smaller.
2. Buy the boat you want. In other words, consider the points others tell you then, buy the boat you want.

 

[markpierce]

Check out the American Tugs, semi-displacement hull.
Can go slow..... hull speed about 7.5 knots......
Factory Sea Trial results, for my boat
Hull speed about 7.3 knots....1.4gph, 1200rpm
8knts. 2.1gph, 1400rpm
all the way up to 3000 rpm, 17knt, 18.1gph.
To be honest, 1/2 fuel, 1/2 water, 12vt fridge running
Now, tell me who will not add stuff such as food and clothing and tools and spare parts. So take the above with a grain or two of salt.

Would have purchased one except they are "railing-challenged."

 

[OldDan1943]

Would have purchased one except they are "railing-challenged."

I agree the lack of railings outside the pilot house doors is a bit concerning.
I have been thinking about a 'cure' for that and have come up with a theoretical plan but have not gone forward with it. The new ATs have sliding pilot house doors so if one wishes, one can put railings outside the pilot doors.

I do not understand why the ATs and other manufactures slant the hand rail supports forward.

 

[rsn48]

You can modify the railing for the American Tug or any boat for that matter. I'm having a guy come over to my almost finished refitted boat. I've gotten rid of the mahogany railing replacing it with stainless steel tubing.

Just go to your local chandlery for a name of a guy who will modify your railing.

 

[markpierce]

My boat's one-inch-diameter railings don't wiggle, are located both along gunwale and cabin, along a 360-degree deck.

 

[OldDan1943]

You can modify the railing for the American Tug or any boat for that matter. I'm having a guy come over to my almost finished refitted boat. I've gotten rid of the mahogany railing replacing it with stainless steel tubing.

Just go to your local chandlery for a name of a guy who will modify your railing.

Anything can be had or constructed for a price. I know the company that will modify the railing and construct a basic removable cage over my engine so I can mount a vice (SMILE)

 

[Mischief Managed]

You need to find a boat where running at 10 MPH is actually an economical speed. For most boats that are capable of 24 mph or more, 10 MPH is probably not really a usable speed.

My Tollycraft 44 does 24+ MPH and cruises very economically at 10 MPH.