Blister Boat Brian's Survey

[Ducatihottie]

"Partial Survey" I wanted to get a head start on estimates that NEED to be fixed. And Cale sent this to me. He spent 10 hours on the boat with me and some wanted to see this. 1987 CHB PONDEROSA



" The major deficiencies are:


Shaft seal needs adjustment or repack.

Engine exhaust hose is cracked and leaking. Needs to be replaced.

Bilge pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or replaced.

Shower sump pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or replaced.

I recommend waiting until you get the finished Marine Survey Report. The report will include pictures and better detail that will assist the service person when trying to come up with an estimate. I will be working on your report on Sunday, and should have the finished version delivered to you by Monday evening.

Thanks,

Cale Mathers
Marine Surveyor - SAMS® AMS® #1156
Mathers Marine Survey LLC
360.202.7700 "

 

[ranger58sb]

None of those are a big deal.

The blisters you mention in the other thread would be a showstopper, for me. Especially after seeing PSN's threads on his similar issues...

-Chris

 

[Ducatihottie]

Agree. But I did pay for my first survey and I'm a little proud that I picked someone as knowledgeable as Cale, (with this boards help).

The exhaust hose sounds tricky to replace as it's difficult to get to and thread it to the back of the boat, (so I was told). Maybe costly?

Shaft seal re packing sounded like it could be repacked and a few screws tightened, (so I was told by both Kevin Ambrose my Mechanical Inspector and "Cale").

An I to assume that the two "floats" that are NOT working are like the floats in my toilet? What happens if the floats work BUT the wiring needs fixed. Or the electrical connections are broke? Everything electrical is expensive, NO?

What would be the most costly repair above? Any estimates on any of these repairs?

 

[ranger58sb]

Not exactly. The float switches are (usually DC) electrical devices that turn on a bilge pump (or a bilge pump in a shower sump) to get some water off the boat.

Cheap ones cost $35 or whatever, good ones (Ultra Senior) cost $175 or whatever. (Just guessing.)

Many of the cheap ones tend to be a pivoting arm; when the arm lifts high enough, on comes the pump. When they used to contain mercury, they were pretty good, lasted a decent length of time... but the new ones don't use mercury and get crap reviews.

-Chris

 

[O C Diver]

Exhaust hose may not be to bad if you have good access at both ends. You can usually disconnect the ends and make sure it's not fastened anywhere in between. Then it's a matter of joining a new hose to the old and pulling the new in as you pull the old out.

Ted

 

[Gmarr]

If the float switches are Rule, it may be as easy as unclicking the current one from its mount, and taking the new one and clicking on the existing mount- then copy how the wires are connected and properly connect and seal them (I did my own and it was easy breezy).

 

[smitty477]

"Partial Survey" I wanted to get a head start on estimates that NEED to be fixed. And Cale sent this to me. He spent 10 hours on the boat with me and some wanted to see this. 1987 CHB PONDEROSA



" The major deficiencies are:


Shaft seal needs adjustment or repack.

Engine exhaust hose is cracked and leaking. Needs to be replaced.

Bilge pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or replaced.

Shower sump pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or replaced.

I recommend waiting until you get the finished Marine Survey Report. The report will include pictures and better detail that will assist the service person when trying to come up with an estimate. I will be working on your report on Sunday, and should have the finished version delivered to you by Monday evening.

Thanks,

Cale Mathers
Marine Surveyor - SAMS® AMS® #1156
Mathers Marine Survey LLC
360.202.7700 "

Sight unseen best guess FWIW -
Shaft seal needs adjustment or repack.
Adjust parts $0 / time 10 minutes
Repack parts $20 / time 1 hr

Engine exhaust hose is cracked and leaking. Needs to be replaced.
Depends where it is and how long of a hose , measure hose diameter and length (not if wire). Price hose and maybe 1 hr.

Bilge pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or replaced.
typical part $40 / time 1/2 hour

Shower sump pump float switch is inoperable. Needs to be repaired or
replaced.
Same as bilge pump.

None of these are consequential, this is a very short list for a boat such as this one - if this is the entire survey list this boat is all about the blisters.

 

[Comodave]

Agree that none of these are a big deal. I replaced the exhaust hose on my port engine this year. It was a bit of a struggle to horse the new piece in but it was doable. I just cut the old one into 2 pieces and it came off pretty easily. The new hose cost $35 per foot and I only needed a foot. The float switches are simple to replace if you can get to them. Repacking the shaft log is also pretty easy if you can get to it. Good luck.

 

[psneeld]

You just think that surveyor is knowledgeable.

Based on those recommendations that he considers "major" shows he either kn iui was he has a new fish or he us BSing you.

Those are TOTALY minor issues....hardly even worth mentioning.

Even the exhaust hose with cracks in it is BS depending on whether it is leaking from the cracks or where clamped. Did he say? If not, he is a hack. If you buy cheap hose and bend it severely...the outer layer will form cracks rather quickly and still have 20 years life left in a hose that has very little pressure or water in it.

I am wary of his survey already.

 

[Ducatihottie]

Thanks for your wariness Psneeld.

The Surveyor comes from a long maritime family here in the PNW, well known, well respected. He's done surveys for two people I know as well and several on this forum. Hence I picked him from the recommendations here and private messages.

The "major" is what I asked that needed to be repaired. I feel he put it in layman's term for me. It will be labeled on the survey how every SAMs surveyor labels items like these.

Exhaust hose was minor like you said, cracked leaking water. But he worries about the exhaust fumes. Is a working bilge pump important, maybe not.

These were the only concerns we discussed as the overall condition of the boat is "above average". With the blisters it's below average.

He wasn't worried about any of the fixes, but they should be fixed wouldn't you agree?

Thanks again for your input.

 

[psneeld]

Me thinks you misunderstand.....depending on where the leaks are on the exhaust hose, they do make the safety list and need to be addressed before operating...but comical to call major when my surveyors have just listed them as safety related.

I hope you are not calling me grumpy butt.

 

[SoWhat]

Based on those recommendations that he considers "major" shows he either kn iui was he has a new fish or he us BSing you.
Those are TOTALY minor issues....hardly even worth mentioning.
Even the exhaust hose with cracks in it is BS depending on whether it is leaking from the cracks or where clamped. Did he say? If not, he is a hack.

Anyone with a clear mind would consider a cracked and leaking exhaust hose to be a major safety issue, make that critical, and would not operate the boat prior to repairs.

You have been sniffing the fumes for too long.

 

[Ducatihottie]

Hey, I corrected it psbeeld.

I asked him to list the items that needed to be fixed so I can get a jump on estimates. So he emailed them to me. Not certain I need to discuss one's reputation here as I'm ecstatically happy by his performance. And I'm grateful for his recommendations from everyone here.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. ps. I remember you mentioning this person. Grumpy Butt...Hahahaha

 

[Comodave]

All of the issues called out are IMO minor repairs. I would not even address them other to tell the owner that you will take care of them if he will do something on the blisters. That list and a good work day you could have them fixed.

 

[psneeld]

Yes, they are important.

But I like surveyors reports that I have that describe them as safety features...they need correcting before use....I agree....

I just have an issue with calling them major....it can mislead inexperienced boat owners.

Most boat owners always think the surveyor is godlike because of their knowledge.

Mine came highly recommended and described as godlike and you saw the pictures of my bottom repairs. No real substantive comments in the survey.

My last surveyor thought my broken inverter stored in the master stateroom clothes shelves was my working inverter, even though it had no wires hooked to it and it was as far from the batteries as you could get. Pretty bad.

 

[Ducatihottie]

Thanks Comodave great advice. He didn't seem worried about a thing except the blisters. I though thought the bilge pump not working could be a problem if I'm not there to manually turn it on once in awhile?

I'm quite lucky that these were the only things that need to be fixed, huh?

 

[tiltrider1]

I doubt Cale used the word major. More likely he used words like safety, items preventing sea worthy, items not functioning. Surveyors don’t function in the terms of expensive versus quick and easy. They function in the concept of working, not working or right and not right.

 

[Comodave]

They are certainly worth fixing, especially the bilge pumps. But they are not major work to repair. The bilge pump letting the boat sink would end up being major but fixing them isn’t too tough.

 

[GH41]

Thanks Comodave great advice. He didn't seem worried about a thing except the blisters. I though thought the bilge pump not working could be a problem if I'm not there to manually turn it on once in awhile?

I'm quite lucky that these were the only things that need to be fixed, huh?

Did he give tell you what he thought the boat is worth. I doubt it. Sounds to me like he gave you just enough rope to hang yourself. Sounds to me like you are trying to hang yourself. Good luck hanging yourself.

 

[BruceK]

I see no reason to dismiss the Survey as incompetent or suspicious for highlighting those issues. It`s a rare survey which nails every defect but those are all safety items(except the shower switch) easily resolved. The hose replacement is usually nasty due to access and handling uncooperative large diameter wire reinforced hose. If the defective switches are "flipper" type I would replace them with Ultras or similar no external moving parts switches.

The blisters remain front and center imo in your decision once you get the whole survey.

 

[DrissZougari]

A surveyor should definitely consider an exhaust hose with crack as a major issue however, all 3 item are easy and simple to fix. The same goes for the blisters depending on their size and quantity. the new buyer should not be distracted by this easy to fix items and concentrate on the real stuff such as soft spots that are not accessible an structural issues, Engine and Generator health...........

 

[slowgoesit]

Seems like people are getting all wrapped up in semantics of how flaws found were reported in an e-mail to the potential buyer, and then by the potential buyer to the forum. Perhaps before we begin character assassination of the surveyor it might be appropriate to see what the actual SURVEY says, and how the surveyor describes the severity of the issues being discussed? JMHO

 

[Ducatihottie]

⁸Slowgoesit. I think people like to rant at people now a days. I can't imagine this site was vicious years ago. I simply thank the angry miserable people and move on.

I'm not boo hooing here but It all started when someone called my surveyor incompetent, then called me stupid. Then instead of ignoring the ignorant comment, people attacked him and so on it went.

Someone went so far and invited me to hang myself. I'm getting the rope now just so he'll feel guilty, (watch Seattle's news tomorrow).

 

[RonR]

This is how I see it, I could be right or way off, but it's still how I think.


If I was in this boat knowing what I do now, I would probably ask for a deep discount if I planned on keeping the boat for 10-15 years and I just loved the layout/style and it felt right. I would know that its going to be a very hard sell, and I would just plan on giving it away knowing I got my $$ worth in time used and hope for the best.
I would probably not fix the blisters and just run the boat, your going to pull it out every few years for bottom paint, keep an eye on them.

No disrespect as we all start someplace.. an older CHB may not be the boat for you. Old boats need a lot of love, especially if your going to use them a lot. So if you don't plan on learning how to do the repairs yourself, its going to get very frustrating and expensive quick.
If its just a dock queen/flotel it might be another story.

I am by no means an expert, I have relied heavily on the wisdom from friendly people on this board to get me where I am at now. But I also go at all this as a hobby, I enjoy working on the boat.

 

[Ducatihottie]

⁸Thanks Ron R. It will be a flotel as you noted. I didn't get my waterfront home and this is my next best option. I made a boatload of money working in NYNY during this covid mess. My wife said I could buy whatever I wanted as a reward. I said I'm buying a new Ducatti Superlegerra V4. She promptly said, "no your not". So I'm buying a boat. My life's always been this easy, (no kids).

I also find it funny that I might be buying a 20,000 pound floating hotel for the same price I paid for a 3000 pound SLK 350. Now that's a killer deal pound for pound. If I hate or become bored with boating, i just move on. I once got bored and ended up in Cartagena Columbia 24 hours later.

I dissect things into the amount of hours I have to work to get something. Monthly moorage, 12 hours one day of work and so on. This boat? Only 6 weeks of 60 plus hours in NYNY. Plus a small loan, (8 to 10 hours of work monthly). Boat breaks, I work a few extra days to fix it. Boat breaks down completely? I simply sell it or use it as a flotel as you mentioned. Let's say I have a heart attack in a year? I got to play on a boat for a year, how cool is that? Besides, I set my wife up well for the future if I die. Who wouldn't want to date a woman that owns a few Ducati's, Mercedes, huge boat, nice house, my retirement, and killer life insurance policy. I recon she'll have a 24 year old pool boy? Every day she'll think of me

Sorry to keep reminding everyone that I'm new to boating. But what knot should I use and how do I tie it?

 

[Airstream345]

The items listed are all simple R&R (Remove and Replace) that use commonly found parts and supplies (Fisheries Supply in Fremont has everything you need), they can be done in the water and would likely take a half to full day of labor (depending on that exhaust hose) to rectify.

That resolves the “safe operation” list and makes insurers happier.

From there it’s what requires restoration (like the blisters) and do you care to resolve them now, later, never?

 

[Ducatihottie]

Thanks airstream.

 

[Ducatihottie]

As you know I get my survey results tomorrow. The boat is expected to pass with flying colors minus the horrid bowel.

Questions:

1. Is it mine or will the seller and sellers broker get a copy?

2. If the seller or sellers broker asks, "how was the survey"? How should I respond?

 

[Comodave]

The survey is yours. Who you choose to share it with is up to you. But if you want the seller to negotiate on the price you will likely have to let them see it.