Bermuda Crossing on a GB42

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Few questions to the OP:

1. Who is your crew? How much experience do he/she/they have? What does the crew think about the risk? How will you/the crew potentially deal with sea sickness? Health?

2. What are your navigation skills if you lose your chartplotters?

3. How clean are your fuel tanks? (assume your GB 42 is 30 something years old) How low have you previously taken the fuel tanks?

4. What will your water consumption rate be? Will 265 gals handle you and the crew for 5 days or so? Do you have a watermaker?

5. Do you have AIS?

6. 600 gals sounds like a lot for FL 120s but how much fuel reserves are you calculating? Do you know the impact of ocean currents on your fuel consumption? Should you consider adding a bladder with 100-150 gals?

7. Stabilization? Steadying sail?

8. EPIRB? Sat phone? Survival raft? Ditch bag?

9. Spares inventory?
 
What "blue water" design characteristics are missing from the GB42 that cannot be mitigated with prudent seasonal travel? Windows? Are you really expecting breaking waves over the bow?

I spent 5-years as a full time delivery skipper moving boats along the pacific coast, 80%of the time northbound into weather. 6-foot wind chop is normal most afternoons and can get bigger. As long as the windows don't leak, it's workable. GB42 wouldn't be my first choice for this run, but if that's what I had and had a hankering to go to Bermuda, it's workable. In something resembling 1000 days at sea delivering along a challenging coast, I had plenty of spray over the bridge, and plenty of water on the decks, but never breaking seas that would blow out windows.

By far, the most common recreational vessel to make trips like these are not sailboats nor Nordhavn-esque tanks. Most common? Sport fishers. Those guys will spend the money and brave big seas if there's a fish to be had.

Agree that stabilization is highly desirable.

Sailors almost always look beat up after an overnight run. It's why so many Sailors turn to trawlers and so few powerboaters turn to sail.

Not questioning your experience; just recalling my own. Certainly, windows are a weak point on the GB but so are ballast and the point of vanishing stability vs a well-found sailboat. On a run from Norfolk to the BVIs in the Alden, we were slammed by a wave that damaged a port light. I can only imagine what that would have done to wider, unprotected expanses of glass.

Certainly, time of year can mitigate risk, as you say, but I’ve seen a flat calm day turn to absolute $hit in less than an hour. Sport fishers need a shorter weather window and can sometimes outrun deteriorating conditions so I’m not sure that comparison would factor into my go/no go decision for a GB. And, for the record, we never felt beat up after a passage in the Alden—one as long as seven days (cannot say the same about the J110 we sailed :D).

People have crossed oceans on rafts because that’s all they had. I guess if I were looking for prudence it would mean not using my GB42 in blue water where I needed a four-to-five-day weather window.
 
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I agree with this below, my marina plumbed in a bunch of bladder tanks on a big Grady White to deliver it to Bermuda. All about that weather, weather, weather....

For some people, it's the journey, not the destination. The OP wants to head offshore. Bermuda is achievable. A GB42 with some prep and careful choice of seasons is more than adequate to get the job done. She carries 600 gallons of diesel which is plenty to venture 650 nms.

Jeez, PAE has done an amazing job conditioning the market that the only suitable boat to venture offshore with is a Nordhavn. This isn't difficult. The OP wants to go to Bermuda. He owns a GB42. The answer is "yes, it's possible." it may not be the trip others would undertake but that's not the question.
 
I agree with this below, my marina plumbed in a bunch of bladder tanks on a big Grady White to deliver it to Bermuda. All about that weather, weather, weather....

The many sport fishers that travel to Bermuda every pelagic season utilize one very important feature, boat speed. Thus the weather window and current course modifications become quite manageable.
 
Should probably keep my mouth shut... but here goes: I have made that trip in sailboats 8 times. Always in the summer. And had plenty of weather surprises.
I think it is irresponsible to make a blue water trip in a boat not designed for it. If it was just you taking the risk, then I would say, "have at it"
But if you get in trouble then it is the rest of us out there that are duty bound to render assistance. Or our USCG will get called out to recover you from the stunt.
Countless examples of cruisers, mostly sailors because thats who is out there, who get in trouble because either they, or their boats were not properly prepared. And then comes the rescue that never should have happened.
The issue is not your personal risk tolerance, it is the overall risk of the passage, and everything that entails. I dont think there is any way that you can prepare a GB of that size to handle the full range of possible mechanical and weather outcomes and not endanger others when things go wrong.
Sorry to be so negative.

Greg
 
Not questioning your experience; just recalling my own. Certainly, windows are a weak point on the GB but so are ballast and the point of vanishing stability vs a well-found sailboat. On a run from Norfolk to the BVIs in the Alden, we were slammed by a wave that damaged a port light. I can only imagine what that would have done to wider, unprotected expanses of glass.

Angus - would you consider your Defever 44 capable of a trip to Bermuda (I certainly would)? BTW - I simply love the Defever 44, but I am partial to west coast designers like Art Defever (my Willard is a Wm Garden design).

Straying away from Angus's comments and back to the thread in general, I lament that threads like these devolve into gotta-have-a-tank-just-in-case (often, implicitly, a Nordhavn) discussions. I realize Nordhavn sells a lot of boats to people who want to (and can afford to) mitigate the last smidgen of risk, but that last 1% or 2% of risk is damn expensive.

EXAMPLE: Let's pretend May is historically the calmest month because a High Pressure sets in. When the HP arrives, you depart. What are the chances that, over the next 4-days, a freak hurricane forms?
  • Impact: Severe.
  • Probability. Zero.
  • Mitigation:

    Wait until you own a Nordhavn; or
    IridiumGO + PredictWind + Professional Wx Router (if desired).

With proper precautions and prep, the GB42 can make the trip. It wouldn't be my first choice, and there are boats that would be more comfortable, but it's doable. Whether the OP is up to the task or whether it's a worthy destination? No idea.

The FL 120's will burn 4gph (combined) running at around 7-kts. At least 1000nms range until dry, a bit more if slowed a tad.
 
You could theoretically do it in a center console, with several extra fuel drums aboard, but that doesn't mean its a good idea.
 
Countless examples of cruisers, mostly sailors because thats who is out there, who get in trouble because either they, or their boats were not properly prepared. And then comes the rescue that never should have happened.
The issue is not your personal risk tolerance, it is the overall risk of the passage, and everything that entails. I dont think there is any way that you can prepare a GB of that size to handle the full range of possible mechanical and weather outcomes and not endanger others when things go wrong.
Sorry to be so negative.
Greg

This is one of the main reasons Delivery Skippers exist. On the Pacific Coast, there is so much fear about Pt Conception or what lies outside the Golden Gate or the "Graveyard of the Pacific" Columbia River bar, few recreational boaters ventured out. Once I got a reputation, I easily averaged over 250-days/year delivering between Alaska and Mexico.

That said, your points are certainly valid - there are concerns outside your own boat that should not be taken lightly.
 
Go to San Salvador instead. Diving is arguably better, although fewer wrecks.
Bermuda is overpriced, like Turks & Cacaos.
 
Thanks for all the comments and noted risks. No, my current Progressive insurance will not cover such a trip. My fuel capacity is 500 gallons. Running at 8-8.5 knts with generator running for AC I get 1.6 nm/gallon. I'd run with prudent use of generator. Understand concern on forecasting. I have Sirius XM sat for weather. Yes on EPIRB I have already but I hadn't yet considered the bolstering the large windows or adding ballast. The "why" - Bermuda has been a sort of home away from home for me in my earlier years. Lived there fora year in 1971 and my parents had a summer cottage in Southampton from about 1967 to 1992. Know the island and the reefs like the back of my hand. Made hundreds of scuba dives there and even c-authored a Bermuda Dive Guide in the 1990s. My wife and I honeymooned in Bermuda and will be flying there in September for 40th anniversary. I'm an adventurer at heart and have thought about the crossing for some time now but until recently did not think I had enough experience to do it safety. BTW - my wife would not go on such a crossing. She prefers inland waterways. I'd need at least 2 additional crew and preferably 3 for easier helm shifts. I'm still mulling this over and do appreciate the feedback and raised points of concern guys!
 
Based on 1.6 nmpg and 500 gallons of fuel, you're cutting it very tight on fuel range. I'd consider a 25 - 30% reserve to be a requirement for a trip like that. And you're just barely at that 25% mark, assuming you can truly run the tanks to bone dry.
 
Based on 1.6 nmpg and 500 gallons of fuel, you're cutting it very tight on fuel range. I'd consider a 25 - 30% reserve to be a requirement for a trip like that. And you're just barely at that 25% mark, assuming you can truly run the tanks to bone dry.

1.6 nmpg is at 8-8.5 kts. Throttle back to 7-7.5 and he's fine.

So, when is a good time of year to make this passage? Jimmy Cornell always talks in terms of sailing where consistent wind is desired. What about for a powerboat?
 
I hadn't yet considered the bolstering the large windows or adding ballast.


For ocean passages I prepared storm covers that were precut and painted plywood, then carried wood screws and a charged screw gun. But my deckhouse was wood. You might carry a drill bit to predrill into your fiberglass deckhouse. Remember these are for extreme cases.

Or go through the trouble to preinstall studs.

Ref: ballast. Head over to boatdesign.net and chat with them about adding a half ton of lead at your chines.
 
Jesse
Is it doable in a well prepped GB 42. Yes, if range is dead certain in lumpy seas. Is it doable in your GB 42 with your skills and experience, I've no idea.

Regarding range, a large open ocean sea state can decrease fuel efficiency by 10-20%. How have you in past measured fuel burn? How low can you pull your tanks before pick up tubes suck air? It would seem that range is the issue to plan for, the other issues can be dealt with. Bladders may be required.

BTW, some folks I know cross the Gulf of AK in their GB 42. Commercial fishermen so not too much deters them. A close to 1/4 distance fuel stop is Hoonah to Yakutat at about 135NM and Yakutat to Whittier at about 300NM. They do not carry fuel bladders.
 
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That boat will beat you to death in bad weather. Your body will fare worse than the boat, unless/until it founders.


I'd go, but you gotta really trust your luck and judgement with weather.


Hard/soft chines, stabilizers, ballast, windows, it's a different world when the sea comes up and there's nowhere to hide.


Check out Rio whatever (dulce?) in Guatemala, go there instead. Read about the First Mexican Empire and the Hapsburgs.


https://www.mexicoboating.com/cruising-ports-the-central-american-route/
 
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Don't forget, a GH 37 made it to Hawaii as described a while ago on TF. It is amazing what our boats can do if well prepped and in good hands.
 
For ocean passages I prepared storm covers that were precut and painted plywood, then carried wood screws and a charged screw gun. But my deckhouse was wood. You might carry a drill bit to predrill into your fiberglass deckhouse. Remember these are for extreme cases.

Or go through the trouble to preinstall studs.

Ref: ballast. Head over to boatdesign.net and chat with them about adding a half ton of lead at your chines.

It takes more than covers. Look at the following pic of a downeaster that got caught coming in at Oregon Inlet, NC. Two of the windows made it (the third probably broke due to twisting of the frame) but the frame and underlying structure didn't.

David
 

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I guess a Portuguese Bridge would help!
 
What this all boils down to is how ignorant the OP is. Please don't compare ignorance to stupidity. Sometimes being either results in the same outcome but often not. Often being uninformed is an advantage. Example... The toilet won't flush and turds are floating over the rim... The boat isn't sinking but it smells pretty bad. That's easy.. use a bucket. The opposite is... One engine died and we are over propped on the one that is still running. Say goodby to your fuel calculations.
 
What this all boils down to is how ignorant the OP is. Please don't compare ignorance to stupidity. Sometimes being either results in the same outcome but often not. Often being uninformed is an advantage. Example... The toilet won't flush and turds are floating over the rim... The boat isn't sinking but it smells pretty bad. That's easy.. use a bucket. The opposite is... One engine died and we are over propped on the one that is still running. Say goodby to your fuel calculations.

Wow!

Bar keep, can I please have a pint of what he is drinking?
 
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Yep, and we really needed a newbie to tell us all how it really is.
 
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Angus - would you consider your Defever 44 capable of a trip to Bermuda (I certainly would)? BTW - I simply love the Defever 44, but I am partial to west coast designers like Art Defever (my Willard is a Wm Garden design).

Straying away from Angus's comments and back to the thread in general, I lament that threads like these devolve into gotta-have-a-tank-just-in-case (often, implicitly, a Nordhavn) discussions. I realize Nordhavn sells a lot of boats to people who want to (and can afford to) mitigate the last smidgen of risk, but that last 1% or 2% of risk is damn expensive.

Thanks for the thoughts on the 44 (I also like Willards.) :thumb:

Look, I’ll just leave it like this. There’s no question the Defever (or the GB or the Willard) could make it IF prepped properly, helmed competently and the weather cooperates. Those are three variables that, in the OP’s case—and with no disrespect meant—I’m not sure would align. As for me, having seen what conditions can turn into—even with a good forecast—I wouldn’t run that far offshore in any of those boats. Just personal preference.
 
The nickname for the Newport to Bermuda sail boat race is the "Thrash." No matter what the weather it goes off as scheduled. The race safety standards are tough and realistic. Several large power boats shadow the fleet. Suggest the owner of the GB42 pull up the CCA race prep requirements which would provide some spot on guidance.
 
I made the crossing yesterday. But vessel was an A320, and required weather window 90 minutes. Kind of different.
 
Thanks for all the comments and noted risks. No, my current Progressive insurance will not cover such a trip. My fuel capacity is 500 gallons. Running at 8-8.5 knts with generator running for AC I get 1.6 nm/gallon. I'd run with prudent use of generator. Understand concern on forecasting. I have Sirius XM sat for weather. Yes on EPIRB I have already but I hadn't yet considered the bolstering the large windows or adding ballast. The "why" - Bermuda has been a sort of home away from home for me in my earlier years. Lived there fora year in 1971 and my parents had a summer cottage in Southampton from about 1967 to 1992. Know the island and the reefs like the back of my hand. Made hundreds of scuba dives there and even c-authored a Bermuda Dive Guide in the 1990s. My wife and I honeymooned in Bermuda and will be flying there in September for 40th anniversary. I'm an adventurer at heart and have thought about the crossing for some time now but until recently did not think I had enough experience to do it safety. BTW - my wife would not go on such a crossing. She prefers inland waterways. I'd need at least 2 additional crew and preferably 3 for easier helm shifts. I'm still mulling this over and do appreciate the feedback and raised points of concern guys!

Donsan, in post #31, posted some questions that you seem to have adeptly dodged. Adventurer at heart isn't relevant. Diver who knows Bermuda well isn't relevant. What is your boating/captaining experience and level of expertise. You say until recently you didn't think you had the experience. What changed other than convincing yourself, I assume not your experience.

The biggest issue isn't the boat, but the crew. Can one do it in a GB 42? Yes. Should one or would one or should you? Haven't convinced me. We delayed from one year to the next due to conditions (hurricane) and then made the trip with no problem but in a much larger boat. I'm not comfortable with your fuel safety factor. As to weather windows and forecasts, if you're talking 4 to 5 days, then you're never more than 2 to 2.5 days from the nearest shore. That gives you a good ability to react to any change in conditions and weather and sea forecasts are quite good for 72 hours and typically for longer. However, the boat in the discussion definitely says you want ideal conditions. Between waiting for an adequate window to cross and one to return you could turn your three hour tour into months. When we returned, we took a wide path toward the Bahamas to have good seas but then we had for more fuel capacity than required and more range than you would. I would say the average wait for a weather window adequate to make the crossing in the GB 42 would be 2 weeks to 2 months and you'd face the same returning.

Here's just a typical example. Today at 9:00 AM 5' at 7 seconds. Only problem is even if that was adequate you have 8' between Bermuda and NC and 12' by tomorrow. Just south of Bermuda is a very nice 3' at 6 seconds but you don't have the range to take advantage. By Sunday night you're talking 17'. Tuesday clears to 6' but by Thursday back to 12'. Now, obviously this isn't the ideal season but such patterns are not unusual at other times. You wouldn't have the luxury of being able to go any but the shortest route and that is very limiting. You can often find a month or even two months in which a crossing would be highly inadvisable. That means preparing the boat but waiting for months for an opening and means the same when returning.

People cross the gulf stream daily to the Bahamas. To Bimini you'd need less than 10 hours in your boat, to Nassau, you'd need up to 36 hours. That makes Nassau about 15 times as challenging on finding the opening. Now, multiply that another 10 times for the Bermuda distance, then double it for the open ocean location.

Have you ever crossed an ocean expanse with you as the captain? Would you have someone who has? Crossing the gulf stream and with the time involved, I'd want 30% fuel safety factor. Yes, greater than normal due to the impact conditions can have. Your 6 knots can quickly become 4 knots or require 50% more fuel.

As to what is in Bermuda, we loved it. Highlight was a local artist whose home we visited and she regaled us with decades of history and beautiful artwork. There's a mix of old and new. It's definitely not a rustic nature tour into the wilderness but a very sophisticated banking center.
 
Don't forget, a GH 37 made it to Hawaii as described a while ago on TF. It is amazing what our boats can do if well prepped and in good hands.

With the right planning, preparation and execution, great things can happen. If the winds, currents, waves, and seasons are with you, life on the ocean can be great. World Cruising Routes are part of an age-old body of knowledge. Fighting these forces is a losing battle. The ocean is full of rivers and the atmosphere is full of rivers. Go with the flow.

This looks like a good read:

Passage Planning
 
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