anyone familiar with these ? (next gen)

[TugYacht_33]

im really interested in this gen set, does anyone have experience with them, any pros or cons to consider ?
they seem fairly new to the market, my biggest concern would be how they hold up in the long run
Beta Marine dealers are carrying them so the customer support should be good to go
NEXT-GEN - Marine Power Units

 

[kwestby]

im really interested in this gen set, does anyone have experience with them, any pros or cons to consider ?

they seem fairly new to the market, my biggest concern would be how they hold up in the long run

Beta Marine dealers are carrying them so the customer support should be good to go

NEXT-GEN - Marine Power Units

I have had the 5.5 KW for the last 12 years in our 44’ Puget Trawler. It has been a great genset. Small, quiet (with sound shield) and no major issues. I had a raw water pump seal leak last year and threw some salt water in the enclosure that was a pain but easy enough to replace and clean. I have it mounted in my ER forward on port side. They have been easy to get parts and maintenance supplies from quickly. Thumbs up from me.

Kennet
Nostradamus Casa
44’ Puget Trawler
Seattle, WA

 

[TugYacht_33]

wow, 12 years...... i thought they were new in town, thanks for the reply, looks like i may have found a winner

 

[boomerang]

I had one on my last boat. It was fine but loud because it didn't have a hush cover and it is a 3600 RPM unit as the brochure says. Thats how they get the kW from a smaller package. If you listen to an 1800 RPM unit next to a 3600 you'd probably like the slower turning one. They're way less obnoxious.

 

[TugYacht_33]

It was fine but loud because it didn't have a hush cover and it is a 3600 RPM unit as the brochure says.

no, these units are only 2800 rpm...... still not the sweet spot of an 1800 rpm unit, but way less then a 3600 rpm unit...... i would love to find an old 1800 rpm unit but they are just too big im afraid for the space im going to have

from what little ive found on them so far they did some gearing or something between the engine and head to get the rpms down to 2800

 

[boomerang]

Oops! You're right! My bad! I think mine was 3600. Whatever it was, it was kind of noisy.

 

[kwestby]

I had one on my last boat. It was fine but loud because it didn't have a hush cover and it is a 3600 RPM unit as the brochure says. Thats how they get the kW from a smaller package. If you listen to an 1800 RPM unit next to a 3600 you'd probably like the slower turning one. They're way less obnoxious.

I agree the 1800 rpm engines have a much better sound but at a cost of space per kw. I replaced a slow turner in the lazerette to open up space and tuck in the ER. The sound enclosure of next gen is really great. It turns into into a quiet hush when ER is closed up. The enclosure is Fiberglass with lots of shielded insulation and a high capacity fan feeding fresh air, all mounted on a rubber vibration pads attached to metal base. If you have room for a 1800 then I would say go for that but this is an awesome unit for space/power/sound/reliability in the high rpm gens

 

[DavidM]

I have a NextGen 3.5KW unit on my Mainship Pilot 34. It is a single cylinder Kubota engine with a Markon generator end. Both core components are first class.

NextGen's packaging and marinization is pretty good. It uses a simple, capacitor excited generator and easy to work on- change fluids and impeller, no real repair done to mine.

It is not particularly noisy but the putt-putt sound of the exhaust is annoying. As noted above it runs at 2,800 rpm which lets the small single cylinder engine drive the generator through a cogged belt.

I consider it a nice, light duty genset. We put maybe twenty hours on ours each year mostly running for an hour at night to charge batteries and heat water and a half hour in the morning to top off the batteries and make coffee. It will run any two of the following simultaneously: A/C, water heater, microwave, stove, coffee maker.

If you really use yours a lot, then get a 3 cylinder, 1,800 rpm unit such as a Northern Lights.

David

 

[TugYacht_33]

well, i do plan on using it a lot....
my plan is to "retire" and become a full time live aboard/cruiser. marina stays will be minimal, maybe every other week or so at tops.
i bought an 18 foot travel trailer a year ago, parked it in the back yard and have been living in it while i do some remodeling in the house
i went this route so i could see if i would be truly happy in cramped quarters, i think i have passed that test easily
i limited myself to a single 20 amp circuit about 6 months ago to see just how little i could be happy with so the idea of having a full 30 amps again gets me a little giddy, lol
all lighting, furnace blower, and exhaust fans are run from 12 volts
hot water, fridge,stove are propane
a/c, microwave,computer, electric grill, and a small space heater are the only 120v items im using
i still have a lot of figuring to do on what loads and expectations will be on the boat but i think the 3.5 unit will come close, if not the 5.5 will definitely fill the bill

my biggest concern is i dont want to burn fuel on a bigger unit if a smaller unit will cover my needs

and of course, the size considerations will be the biggest factor..... being happy in limited space is not equal to i want to be a human pretzel when its time for pms

 

[High Wire]

We are installing an 8 Kw Phasor next week. I will report out how that turns out.

 

[hjorgan]

Have the 3.5 nextgen on a fishing boat, twin outboard fast mover. We did not opt for the sound enclosure as we don't run the generator much as primary power. So it is a bit noisy where mounted, but I kind of like it for sleeping. The enclosure would make it much quieter, as would better insulation in the compartment it lives in now.

Only 120 hrs or so but no complaints. Service and support has been outstanding.

 

[Delfin]

well, i do plan on using it a lot....
my plan is to "retire" and become a full time live aboard/cruiser. marina stays will be minimal, maybe every other week or so at tops.
i bought an 18 foot travel trailer a year ago, parked it in the back yard and have been living in it while i do some remodeling in the house
i went this route so i could see if i would be truly happy in cramped quarters, i think i have passed that test easily
i limited myself to a single 20 amp circuit about 6 months ago to see just how little i could be happy with so the idea of having a full 30 amps again gets me a little giddy, lol
all lighting, furnace blower, and exhaust fans are run from 12 volts
hot water, fridge,stove are propane
a/c, microwave,computer, electric grill, and a small space heater are the only 120v items im using
i still have a lot of figuring to do on what loads and expectations will be on the boat but i think the 3.5 unit will come close, if not the 5.5 will definitely fill the bill

my biggest concern is i dont want to burn fuel on a bigger unit if a smaller unit will cover my needs

and of course, the size considerations will be the biggest factor..... being happy in limited space is not equal to i want to be a human pretzel when its time for pms

For what it's worth....I spoke at some length with the manufacturer about the 5.5 kw unit. He said, and I think I believe him, that they have installations with 10,000 hours on them with the key being routine maintenance. There was also a question about whether the output was clean enough for our Trace inverter to work correctly. He "thought" it would based on the specs of the inverter but seemed to leave the door open that I might have some issues under some load scenarios. I suggest you give the Florida manufacturer a call. I found them very responsive and helpful.

 

[DavidM]

OK, well using it a lot, ie every day for an hour or so, is different from running it 24/7 for air conditioning which can't be accomplished any other way. If that is what you plan to do then I would focus on a 3 cylinder, 1,800 rpm unit. It will be smoother, quieter and will last probably twice as long as the single cylinder, 2,800 rpm NextGen.

The NextGen is a good unit, but if you are planning to run one for thousands of hours a year, then it is not the genset for you.

David

 

[hjorgan]

Oh forgot to mention the 3.5 sips fuel. .2 gal per hour I believe. I get worried the fuel will get stale! Nice problem to have.

 

[Ski in NC]

Running one of these through an inverter might be a problem. Not due to the waveform as I am pretty sure the are dang close to sinusoidal, but Hz. The governors are mechanical and thus a little sloppy. No load about 62-63Hz, heavy load could be 58Hz. Still within the +/- 5% spec, but some inverters freak out if not real close to 60Hz. Some inverters also freak out when source power takes a momentary dip which is normal when a big load comes on. Depends more on the inverter, not the gennie. All the little gennies have the above characteristics to some degree.

 

[Delfin]

Running one of these through an inverter might be a problem. Not due to the waveform as I am pretty sure the are dang close to sinusoidal, but Hz. The governors are mechanical and thus a little sloppy. No load about 62-63Hz, heavy load could be 58Hz. Still within the +/- 5% spec, but some inverters freak out if not real close to 60Hz. Some inverters also freak out when source power takes a momentary dip which is normal when a big load comes on. Depends more on the inverter, not the gennie. All the little gennies have the above characteristics to some degree.

You're right Ski, now I remember it was the cycle accuracy that the NextGen engineer said could be a problem. I think I experience occasionally even with a Northern Lights genset with our microwave. Sometimes, based on load and I think battery condition, the display panel clicks on and off when the genset is running. After 15 minutes or so, the issue goes away but I think it may be the same issue.

 

[TugYacht_33]

hhmmm....... some interesting points

ok, a/c is going to be a staple during the hot months, and im not going to lie, at least where im at now (NC) that will be 24/7 from jun-sept

of course part of the master plan is to grow old and die somewhere on the loop so honestly i dont know what to expect from the "up north summers" "down south winters" aspect of the weather

the 5.5 unit is just a tad bigger in size, in fact i think they both use the same power head so maybe we will see.......

12 volt source is planned so far to be a rather beefy house bank (think 4-6 8d or equivalent)

i plan on using an isolation transformer for several different reasons but now i have a question, does anyone know if running through an isolation transformer will remedy the issues brought up about the hertz, or is it even possible to do so ?

the gen set, whatever it ends up being would feed in to the transformer same as shore power correct ? if so, that should remove any problems with hertz fluctuation, i think anyway....... more reading to do now

 

[Ski in NC]

Isolation xfmr will not change the Hz. 58Hz in, 58Hz out.

 

[Mule]

Take a look at Phasor. They use Kobota as does NexGen. big plus..... tractor parts w/o the extortion of “Marine” ah la Westerbeke. The small Phasor is quite, small and is an 1800 unit.
I had a one lung NexGen, nothing bad to say about it except noisy. Responsive company but so is Phasor. 1800 RPM Northern Lights great but the$$$$$ is a killer

 

[DavidM]

Isolation xfmr will not change the Hz. 58Hz in, 58Hz out.

And since an isolation transformer is installed to isolate shore power and its grounds from the ship's power, you usually introduce the genset power to the circuit after the isolation transformer and through a transfer switch or locked out breakers.

And forgive me, but I don't follow the Hz concerns of a genset in conjunction with an inverter. An inverter produces AC power from DC and is almost never run with a genset (or shore power) connected at the same time as the inverter's internal transfer switch disconnects the inverter output when shore or genset power is available.

Some, but very few inverters synchronize their output with shore or genset power to boost amperage supply. Mastervolt, Magnum and maybe a few others supply these inverters, but they are not commonly used.

So, are you talking about synchronizing inverters? Or what am I missing?

David

 

[Ski in NC]

Dave, it must be synchronizing inverter to have that input Hz sensitivity. Details beyond that are above my paygrade and should be sorted with the inverter mfr.

Can be a nice feature as inverter can act as a boost to a smallish gennie, but then system design can get complicated.

 

[DavidM]

OK, I understand that you were talking about synchronizing inverters. Way above my pay grade as well. I have read about them, but never seen one.

David

 

[Sharpseadog]

I have a Next-Gen 3.5KW installed on my Helmsman 38 Trawler. I have it installed at the aft end of the main salon lazarette, and did not opt for the enclosure because I wanted better access for maintenance and better cooling. My entire engine room is contiguous with the lazarette, and is well insulated. The sound level is quite tolerable, and the gen-set sits where an 8D battery was installed and weighs the same. I have had the unit for 3 seasons, and typically run it about 30 to 60 minutes total per day. Fuel consumption is negligible. The only problem I had was a failed condenser, which was probably my fault because I failed to start and stop with no load (now know better). I am extremely pleased with this unit and can highly recommend it. It amuses me that the manual states it takes 500 hours for full break unit in. I have also heard that these units are extremely durable, many running 7/24 for days/weeks on end.

 

[Delfin]

OK, I understand that you were talking about synchronizing inverters. Way above my pay grade as well. I have read about them, but never seen one.

David

In my case, when the genset is fired up, the genset output is switched to bypass the inverter, and the batteries are depleted, the frequency wobbles enough to make the microwave flutter on and off. I have no clue why, but it only happens when the charger is putting out full power through the Trace 4000.

When I spoke with NextGen, they said that their output may be more likely to cause that type of problem than a pure sine wave genset like the NL, but when I provided them some data off the spec label on the Trace, they thought I would be fine. Like you, above my pay grade to figure out.