Anchoring in a creek

[sdowney717]

I anchored in a creek, was in the channel on the far edge of the channel.
Creek there is a good 400 feet wide. Plenty of passing room for other boats.
Sat there had a cookout, enjoyed ourselves for a few hours. Must have had a hundred boats go past everyone was waving and friendly.

Wife thought it was too busy to be pleasant, but I liked it, people watching and the scenery.

So we go to head out, around 6 pm. And there is no more boat traffic. Wife is up front pulling the anchor, I see this guy coming up and I see he is cutting very close to my bow, he is really getting close, I am thinking is he going to run over my anchor line?? He is that close to us.

So he stops his boat, stares at us intently, and yells at us we are in a bad spot! ??

I wonder what is this guy thinking. Maybe he works or lives there and does not like us 'anchored in his way', maybe he has this GPS set path to rigorously follow. I stare back, he continues to stare at us with his engine idling about 30 foot away from us. I say nothing to him, they guy is like mad.

So I go up front, assist in puling the anchor and cleaning it off, then we power away, and the whole time this guy is glowering at us like he owns the river.

What do you think? And that guy was TowBoat US.

 

[sdowney717]

You look at this chart, I put a waypoint triangle where we were anchored, and tell me is this illegal? I had a good 5 to 6 foot of depth there.

 

[GFC]

I don't know what his problem was, but unless there is some local ordinance against anchoring there, I'd say you were OK.


I've encountered AH's like that a couple of times and it helps to diffuse the situation by asking him politely to explain why it's not a good spot to drop the hook.

 

[psneeld]

Hard to say, but after leaving the green and proceeding up creek in the channel (deepest water) towards the western red mark, you are pretty close to the line (deep water) between them.

My thought is.... he was thinking that you might have anchored a bit more to the north....but only a guess.

 

[rwidman]

Everybody is entitled to his/her opinion but to speed up to someone as if he is going to hit them, stop and yell at you is way out of line. I probably would have been blowing my (very loud) horn before he got that close.

Now depending on my mood, I would have either said nothing and ignored him or suggested that he perform an unnatural sex act on himself.

What is unfortunate here is that he was representing a commercial enterprise at the time. My suggestion to you is that you call TowBoatUS, ask for a supervisor and explain in detail what happened, where and when. There's no excuse for that behavior, especially with the company logo on the boat.

 

[psneeld]

Or the guy has real experience there and he was passing along his "well experienced opinion".

As long as he wasn't rude, his supervisor might wholeheartedly agree with him.

Based on the chart, which is just a tiny bit of real info, but all I have, I might agree with the Towboat guy.

Yelling over you are in a bad spot is diffetent than calling you out rudely....I do it all the time to boats anchored in the perceived channel....it is what wise, experienced captains do to let people know. The stare sometimes is to take in a bunch of quick info to guess what kind of skipper the guy is.

Is it 100 percent correct to yell over based on limiter info?... well no, but probably better than what some part time boaters here might be suggesting.

Take it for what it was worth. Another opinion from a guy who makes a living or at least part time on the water. If you felt there was plenty of room, then don't worry about it, just log it for future reference.

 

[sdowney717]

When we dropped anchor yesterday afternoon around 3pm, it was close to low tide, when we left our anchored spot, tide was rising, so never was the depth an issue.

He really did get too close to my bow about 10 foot off the bow. I saw coming in and he did not veer off, it was incredible. I kept thinking he needs to veer off, what is he doing, kept on getting closer, I know my anchor line is out and it is shallow, likely we had 50 foot of line out. I quickly think he probably draws 2 foot. My draft is an honest 3.5 foot.
Yeah, maybe should have blown my horn at him.

I just got the impression he did not like us anchoring there for whatever reason. I just did not want to get into a discussion with him, after he came that close, seemed like he was being intimidating, no one else on the river acted like that. No waving, friendly gestures, just yelling at us.

We had seen him depart the creek couple hours earlier, we were anchored and he said nothing then, just motored past us peacefully.

I have unlimited TowBoatUS towing.

 

[psneeld]

I If a good towboat captain, he could have gotten within 1 inch and not endangered you.... because that is in his job description.

Also, I feel that letting you know that you may be in a bad spot based on his experience is his job too.

Sure ge could have just been a jerk...but this is a classic issue in my experience and we have one side, not of the story, but of the perceived story....so please don't take it wrong.

Not saying anything on the way out is typical, he probably was thinking mission first.

 

[sdowney717]

I If a good towboat captain, he could have gotten within 1 inch and not endangered you.... because that is in his job description.

Also, I feel that letting you know that you may be in a bad spot based on his experience is his job too.

Sure ge could have just been a jerk...but this is a classic issue in my experience and we have one side, not of the story, but of the perceived story....so please don't take it wrong.

Not saying anything on the way out is typical, he probably was thinking mission first.

But what is the point of the interaction, the tide was coming in at that time, there was over 7 foot at that time. He knew we had been there for several hours already.
Why stop to make some comment like that at all. He watched us power away, and I watched him and he stayed there a long time without moving on. Was he watching to see if we got stuck?

Now our boat is 37 foot, and all the boats we saw on the creek were a lot smaller. Maybe he thought our boat too big to anchor there?

The water depth there is deeper than the entrance to our marina, at low tide I churn up muck with the props.

 

[psneeld]

I cant comment on his comments and why he made them.

I can only say ....I experience somewhat similar situations all the time...and yes... they are judgement calls.

If I anchored in the creek, I may have favored the northern side of the creek. But maybe not.... depending on other things such as wind and forecast winds.

A huge amount of the time the average boater tries to explain someting to me why they did something, and I have 10 teasons why it wasnt the best idea.

Cant say in your case, but the average towboat guy is really a pretty good guy snd felt he had a reason to react the way he did.

Dont call his supervisor, a clear act of not understanding leadership, call the captain directly.

Go throgh the franchise and see why he said something. Then if not satisfied, go to supervision and file your dissatisfaction.

 

[rwidman]

Pulling up that close at high speed is intimidating just like someone pretending to punch you and holding back at the last minute. This is the action of a jerk and a bully. I say report him. Let him justify this to his boss.

 

[psneeld]

Someone here often tells me to stay out of electrical things because I am not qualified....

Wonder if that works the same for being a long time, experienced captain?

Either way, ybe yruth is between individuals, not some guy miles away. Start simple is always best and usually gets the best results.

Plus honor is still a way of life for me, give that captain a chance to explain himself.

Did I miss the "high speed" and "intimidating" comments from sdowney someplace?

 

[rwidman]

Well, we have a tow boat operator defending another tow boat operator. There might be a bit of bias here.

Offering advice on where and where not to anchor isn't the issue here, it's the way it was done. This guy came up on the OP as if he was going to collide with him. Intimidation at best.

 

[psneeld]

I may or may not work for the same company...

I may be seeing through the eyes of an experoenced mariner.

I may be pointing out the pitfalls of poor customer service by someone tbat bypasses the honorsble solution.

I may be pointing out one perceptiion of the encounter, not both and pointing out overreacting to it is well, someones mainstay here.

I gave a reason why the location complaint was offered, something the opposition hasnt addressed....

Yep I am biased, more about one thing than another, and it isnt the anchoring location.

And the electrical comment stands as it is personal and IS pertinent.

 

[hfoster]

I would have asked him why? If he did not have a good reason I would told him to bugger off! If he had a good reason you would have learned something.


Looking at the chart, I see no reason why you could not have dropped the hook where you did.




Cheers


H.

 

[sdowney717]

I do not understand how I was anchored in a bad spot.
It turned out to be a very good spot to anchor.

I put out a bow and a stern anchor, we did not drag.
The boat then was presented at an angle to the creek flow.
And let us get a nice breeze thru the side windows.
There was not a lot of current. I have anchored with much more current than that.

No one had any trouble passing us. I was about 40 to 50 foot from one side of the creek at the stern with the bow angled higher up creek. Some wave riders passed between us and the close by shore.

 

[psneeld]

I would have asked him why? If he did not have a good reason I would told him to bugger off! If he had a good reason you would have learned something.


Looking at the chart, I see no reason why you could not have dropped the hook where you did.




Cheers


H.

Yep....

This goes hand in hand with my comments on how some interpret the Colregs.

As they arent an exact science, experience helps a lot.

So ask the guy on scene why his opninion differed.

 

[rwidman]

I would have asked him why? If he did not have a good reason I would told him to bugger off! If he had a good reason you would have learned something.


Looking at the chart, I see no reason why you could not have dropped the hook where you did.




Cheers


H.

As we boat, we should keep in mind that we don't own the water we boat in. Sometimes other boaters inconvenience us with their actions but what they are doing is perfectly legal and normal.

Sometimes I'll pull into an anchorage and find that I'm inconvenienced by one or more boaters who are already there. Well, that's legal, normal and to be expected. I have to anchor further away. I might even have to select an alternate anchorage. That's life and that's boating.

On my last cruise, I got behind two tugs towing dredging equipment and pipes in a narrow cut. I had to slow to about three knots for a half hour. Again, that's life and that's boating.

So this tow boat operator had no cause for acting as he did and his employer needs to know about this incident. It's likely this isn't the only time he has acted in this manner. Having the skills to do his job is important of course, but representing his employer to the public in a positive way is also important.

As for asking him why he thought the OP shouldn't be anchored where he was, the tow boat operator already blew any chance of a reasonable conversation when he approached the OP's boat as he did and yelled at him.

 

[sdowney717]

Yep....

This goes hand in hand with my comments on how some interpret the Colregs.

As they arent an exact science, experience helps a lot.

So ask the guy on scene why his opninion differed.

Do you think he thought we were a hazard to navigation?
I don't see how that could possibly be true.

I was wondering if he has this GPS track he follows all the time, and we were somehow in his way regarding his GPS track, and he did not like that. So we were blocking his regular path. You know the channel there is plenty wide. it is not a narrow path, there is lots of depth.

 

[High Wire]

Maybe he meant you would be waked there. It would have be nice to explain his concern since none of us are mind readers. Just another day on the water.

 

[psneeld]

Maybe he meant you would be waked there. It would have be nice to explain his concern since none of us are mind readers. Just another day on the water.

Exactly, some can read way more into this in both action and interaction than we have info for.

But ....TF is famous for overreaction by some.

 

[rwidman]

If A guy comes at your boat at high speed and stops just short of your boat and yells at you, it's not to give you friendly advice.

Under the wrong circumstances, this guy could have been shot.

 

[psneeld]

What post did you get high speed?

And your definition of high speed and stopping close I bet is way different than good boat handlers.

 

[rwidman]

What post did you get high speed?

And your definition of high speed and stopping close I bet is way different than good boat handlers.

You and I read the same post and came away with entirely different takes on it. The OP felt this guy's actions were inappropriate and threatening or he wouldn't have bothered to post about it.

 

[Shrew]

Wife is up front pulling the anchor, I see this guy coming up and I see he is cutting very close to my bow, he is really getting close, I am thinking is he going to run over my anchor line?? He is that close to us.

So he stops his boat, stares at us intently, and yells at us we are in a bad spot! ??

He really did get too close to my bow about 10 foot off the bow. I saw coming in and he did not veer off, it was incredible. I kept thinking he needs to veer off, what is he doing, kept on getting closer, I know my anchor line is out and it is shallow, likely we had 50 foot of line out.

I don't see anywhere where it was stated buy the OP that the tow operator 'came in at a high rate of speed'. He said he came 'too close', which is subjective. Tow boat operators are used to close quarter maneuvers as well as shallow water maneuvers. I suspect 'close' might be subjective and I doubt the tow operator felt that he was operating to endanger.

The screenshot doesn't really tell us how wide that channel actually is. Is there a chance that when you were anchored the boat sat further from the channel, then as anchor rode was being retrieved it pulled the boat closer to the center? how wide is the navigable channel where you were anchored?

Is there a chance that he raised his voice to be heard over the running engines and distance?

Incidentally, when people anchor in or too close to a tight channel, i smile and wave too. As I do so, I also frequently turn to my wife and say "Look at this F@%$$$ idiot".

50+ ft of line in 5 feet of water is a lot of scope, especially in a tight channel.

 

[sdowney717]

I don't see anywhere where it was stated buy the OP that the tow operator 'came in at a high rate of speed'. He said he came 'too close', which is subjective. Tow boat operators are used to close quarter maneuvers as well as shallow water maneuvers. I suspect 'close' might be subjective and I doubt the tow operator felt that he was operating to endanger.

The screenshot doesn't really tell us how wide that channel actually is. Is there a chance that when you were anchored the boat sat further from the channel, then as anchor rode was being retrieved it pulled the boat closer to the center? how wide is the navigable channel where you were anchored?

Is there a chance that he raised his voice to be heard over the running engines and distance?

Incidentally, when people anchor in or too close to a tight channel, i smile and wave too. As I do so, I also frequently turn to my wife and say "Look at this F@%$$$ idiot".

50+ ft of line in 5 feet of water is a lot of scope, especially in a tight channel.

He was going about twice the speed than most of the other boats that had demurely passed us by. Maybe about 10 to 12 knots, made a beeline right for us. He cut his engines after passing our bow, backed up some and then yelled we were in a bad spot, then he stood there looking at me. about 30 foot off my port side. Yes it did feel intimidating. Did not say another word, just staring.

My engines were running and so were his. We were about ready to go anyway, I felt it best not to interact with the guy, he seemed edgy, and sort of angry. It was as a feeling you get when someone is trying to run you off. It was just not friendly like, do you know what I mean? Maybe he was having a bad day.

 

[BandB]

I do not understand how I was anchored in a bad spot.
.

Wifey B: Then seems like the simple solution would have been to have asked him what he meant by saying you were in a bad spot. Without doing that, then none of the rest is relevant. He had some knowledge you didn't, and you didn't even ask what it was. Maybe he should have explained anyway but perhaps he saw you pulling the anchor up and thought irrelevant at that point.


Perhaps he's observed accidents there. Perhaps he felt based on his experience you should have been closer to shore. I can see that. Daytime, I wouldn't have anchored there.

Oh, and appears your wife agreed with him.

 

[BandB]

He was going about twice the speed than most of the other boats that had demurely passed us by. Maybe about 10 to 12 knots, made a beeline right for us. He cut his engines after passing our bow, backed up some and then yelled we were in a bad spot, then he stood there looking at me. about 30 foot off my port side. Yes it did feel intimidating. Did not say another word, just staring.

Wifey B: 10 to 12 knots? Omg a rocket ship.

 

[sdowney717]

Wifey B: Then seems like the simple solution would have been to have asked him what he meant by saying you were in a bad spot. Without doing that, then none of the rest is relevant. He had some knowledge you didn't, and you didn't even ask what it was. Maybe he should have explained anyway but perhaps he saw you pulling the anchor up and thought irrelevant at that point.


Perhaps he's observed accidents there. Perhaps he felt based on his experience you should have been closer to shore. I can see that. Daytime, I wouldn't have anchored there.

Oh, and appears your wife agreed with him.

Wife is sort of liking her privacy. But there is no privacy, your in a creek and people are in boats and people will see you and you will see them and there was lots of traffic, people coming and going.

Still there was lots and lots of room for boats to pass by.
Big boats would have easily been able to pass 100 feet off our bow.
Chisman creek is not a small creek, it is like a river.

 

[Shrew]

I wonder if this is an issue with scope? Not fault, mind you. Is there a chance that the tow operator didn't anticipate how much scope you had out? Then realized he almost parted your line. Maybe the oversight and potential accident may have been the source of his frustration? Just playing devils advocate. Admittedly too much speculation on my part.