Advice on heading down the NJ coast

[bobbyp]

I was planning on taking a run from NYC down the NJ coast and up to the Chesapeake in the next few days but it looks like it is going to get pretty nasty on Friday.
Plan was to stop in AC and in Cape May.

Never having done this before, can somebody help me out with the weather window? It looks like it cools off but calms down on Sunday?

Boat is a pretty run of the mill 40 ft flybridge cruiser luckily with twin steering stations. Experience level - novice.

 

[Cigatoo]

Winds on the NJ Coast
Friday East 20-25 is a no go
Saturday West 20-25 is a no go
Sunday looks good.

 

[psneeld]

Not so quick on the west winds.

Once along the Jersey coast, you can hug the beach in a gale and have a nice ride to Cape May.

2 things though....you have to get to the leeway of the coast and you don't want too much swell that may be leftover from the easterlies.

Looks like tomorrow afternoon as things calm down, a run as far as you can get....even Manasquan. Then the rest can be done Thurs, up the bay on Friday.....tides willing and depending on your speed.

This Fall has been bad for cruising with a steady diet of winds greater than 10 knots...so getting a better weather window than tomorrow through Friday is going to be tough.

It's NOT going to be a fun run...but not dangerous either for a well found boat.

If truly a novice, best to find a pretty savy captain and hire him/her for the 2 days to Cape May.... Ask around if there would be any buddy boats or at least sit down with somebody that knows the waters and weather. Most cruisers don't "get" the New Jersey run and give prettty single minded advice.

If you REALLY need to move the boat and can get a weather window to Manasquan, the inside run can be done with an experienced skipper.

 

[Wxx3]

This the forecast discussion from Mt Holly.
When cruising in the USA, while I use Windy for planning, I always read the forecast discussion becuase it talks of the certainty of the forecast. In this case, there is a lot of stuff happening, which will make the seas pretty unsettled.

000

FXUS61 KPHI 061011
AFDPHI

Area Forecast Discussion
National Weather Service Mount Holly NJ
511 AM EST Tue Nov 6 2018

.LONG TERM /WEDNESDAY THROUGH MONDAY/...
Wednesday through Thursday...a relatively quiet period weatherwise
as high pressure builds in from the west. The high will start to
shift to the east and cross to the north of our area late Thursday.
This will continue to keep more of a west to northwesterly flow
across the region for the midweek period. The northwest flow really
starts to develop more by Thursday so expect some cooler air to drop
down from the north as the high starts to move eastward.

Friday through early Saturday...A double barreled low develops and
impact the northeast late in the week. One low develops across the
Ohio Valley Friday and moves up into the Great Lakes while the
second low develops along the southeast coast on Friday and then
moves up the coast through Friday night, before moving into New
England on Saturday. The secondary low along the coast looks to be
the main driver of weather across our area for the end of the week.
As the lows both push to the north, an area of rain will move into
the Mid-Atlantic, with some showers possible starting as early late
Thursday night into Friday morning. Majority of the rain is expected
to fall during the day on Friday and then tapering off Friday night
into early Saturday. Models show that a good deal of moisture will
be available so expect that the rain could be moderate at times.
Temperatures at the onset of precipitation may be cold enough across
the higher elevations for some snow to mix in on Friday.
Additionally, on the backside of the low there may be enough cold
air that mixes down to allow for some snow showers to occur.

Saturday through Sunday...high pressure will build across the region
through the weekend, moving across our forecast area on Sunday and
then offshore Sunday night. Dry but cool weather across the region
for the weekend with highs mainly staying in the 40s, with some
upper 30s across the north and some temperatures around 50 along the
coast and across southern Delaware.

Monday...A low pressure system will cross the Great Lakes region and
its attendant cold front will drop down into our area on Monday.

.MARINE...
Seas remain above small Craft Advisory levels, and winds will
increase to 25-30 knots today. Occasional gale force gusts may be
possible for southern waters and Delaware Bay, but an inversion
above the surface may keep the strong winds aloft from mixing down
to the surface, so we have not issued a Gale Warning. Showers will
increase today and there is a chance of thunderstorms during the
afternoon which have a greater chance of mixing down the strong
winds.

Small Craft Advisory conditions likely to continue into the
overnight hours with gusty winds around 25 knots and seas around 5
feet.

Outlook...

Wednesday...Small Craft Advisory conditions may continue into early
Wednesday morning with a few gusts around 25 knots, mainly across
the northern waters. Seas will subside through Wednesday falling to
2 to 4 feet early.

Thursday...Sub-advisory conditions are expected on the area waters.
Seas around 2 to 4 feet with north to northwest winds around 10 to
15 knots.

Friday...East winds around 15 to 20 knots with gusts up to 30 knots
possible from mid morning through the afternoon. Seas will build to
5 to 8 feet. A Small Craft Advisory will likely be needed.

Saturday...Small Craft Advisory conditions will continue. West to
northwest winds 15 to 25 knots with gusts up to 30 knots. Gale force
gusts are possible. Seas will gradually subside through Saturday,
falling below 5 feet Saturday night.​

 

[bobbyp]

Thanks folks.

Unfortunately my start time is being dictated by plumber that started a few weeks later than planned.

Assuming I can leave on Thursday, would you suggest I make a straight 120-130 mile run to Cape May at 20 knots +/- ? And then what - wait in Cape May until Sunday? What do I need to watch out for regarding conditions travelling up the Delaware Bay?

Assuming the plumber can't finish and our first available time to go is Friday, should wee wait it out until Sunday and then just go with my original plan with stops in AC and Cape May?

Just to repeat from my original post, novice boaters, novice crew. I'm sure the boat can handle it though keeping myself, my wife and (adult) son safe and reasonably comfortable is a priority.

Our overall plan is to get the boat to Maryland, head back to NY for a couple weeks while the boat gets some general maintenance done. We'll return to the boat in a few weeks to head south towards Florida.

 

[angus99]

Why the push? With respect, allowing a plumber’s schedule to influence a go/no-go decision strikes me as one of the worst ways to plan a run down the coast or up Delaware Bay. Is this boat new to you? Do you know how to change fuel filters if yours get clogged by sediment in your tanks that might get churned up in snotty weather?

Your boat, your call, but I would never recommend a novice captain and crew running offshore when when the best conditions in the forecast are 2-4 ft. And SCAs are predicted or possible.

 

[bobbyp]

Thanks Angus.
Maybe my writing didn't exactly translate as to my intentions.

There is no rush. If best advice is to wait for a weather window after Thanksgiving, that is perfectly fine with me. Since Thursday is supposed to be very nice, I was wondering about traveling that day.

We just changed out the racor filters and haven't used the boat since. I am capable of changing them if necessary but of course would not like to do it in a rolling sea.
We've had the boat for 5 years but have used it pitifully little and this is going to be our first trip over a few hours.
I genuinely appreciate everybody's help in keeping us safe and reasonably comfortable.

 

[JohnP]

Boat is a pretty run of the mill 40 ft flybridge cruiser luckily with twin steering stations. Experience level - novice.

Forget it this week the Ocean is pretty churned up--20knots speed down to Cape May. I doubt it. Look for better weather when the plumber is done. My 2 cents

 

[Cigatoo]

Agree with holding off. The weather pattern that we have experienced is just the opposite of what fall should be in the North East. A string of nice quite days and then a good storm is normal. We are getting 1 nice day and then 3 days of sh**. Not good boating weather.
Sunday and Monday look good now but that is a ways off. Let’s see if we can actually get 2 good days back to back.

Wait for the right window. No need to scare / torture yourself and especially your crew.

 

[garmstro55]

My two cents, having done a similar run twice and also running down the Delaware Bay from the C&D to Lewes once...

On my two trips up to the Chesapeake, the worst leg was the DB. One trip we had 6 footers in a fog/mist with about 1/4 mile or less visibility. Not fun dodging the big ships in the fog.

My recommendation is to study the current tables and try to time your trip up the bay on an outgoing tidal current so the tidal flow and the river flow are in the same direction. If the tidal current is in opposition to the flow, i.e. upstream, it can give you a rough ride.

Others here who ply the coast are giving good advice regarding that leg of the trip.

 

[psneeld]

Having run Delbay and worked it commercially for 14 years as an assistance tower/commercial captain..

I have to disagree with the tidal flow, river flow theory. I have been out there when it has been glassy on an incoming tide. Winds above 10 knots are what make it snotty when the current flow is up around 2 knots.

Because the tidal flow can be 2 knots or slightly more some days, unless you are running a bove 10 knots, that 4 knot Delta can have a significant impact on your days run.

Pick the weather window based on winds and
an incoming tide if your boat speed is sorely effected...best with a southerly or southeasterly winds...but any less than 10 is good, more than 15 out of the Northwest can be miserable...but I have made it safely with a 2 knot incoming and a 20G30 NW wind...burying the anchor much o a the time but that 2 knot current pushes you upriver pretty fast.

 

[caltexflanc]

Having run Delbay and worked it commercially for 14 years as an assistance tower/commercial captain..

I have to disagree with the tidal flow, river flow theory. I have been out there when it has been glassy on an incoming tide. Winds above 10 knots are what make it snotty when the current flow is up around 2 knots.

Because the tidal flow can be 2 knots or slightly more some days, unless you are running a bove 10 knots, that 4 knot Delta can have a significant impact on your days run.

Pick the weather window based on winds and
an incoming tide if your boat speed is sorely effected...best with a southerly or southeasterly winds...but any less than 10 is good, more than 15 out of the Northwest can be miserable...but I have made it safely with a 2 knot incoming and a 20G30 NW wind...burying the anchor much o a the time but that 2 knot current pushes you upriver pretty fast.

If you are going to listen to one guy here on this subject, this guy is the one. Me, I'd lay low.

 

[SOJOURN4]

My 3 cents -

Ocean is pretty crappy this week -
I have ran from Great Egg to NYC and back more than a few times..... Can be a PIA if you have a head sea. Whatever day - leave early and once in Cape May check the wind and tides and move accordingly. DB can be worse that the ocean.
Barnegat is also not too bad - but follow the buoys.
As a side note, stay off shore of Little Egg Inlet (south of Long Beach Island) shoaling is way off shore and the USCG removed the LE buoy a few years ago.
AC Inlet a safe bet if you have to tuck in. South of AC, GE Inlet is doable and most likely an on the hook night since no commercial marinas and nothing else until Cape May
Good Luck

 

[bobbyp]

Great advice everybody.
Laying low, looking at leaving on Sunday at the earliest right now.

 

[PMF1984]

SwellInfo is a nice app as it tells you the expected swells close to shore. Winds from the west to northwest as stated are your friend here. Delaware bay is best when the wind and tide are the same direction. The tolerable wind speed really depends as a following sea at 20 knts. is quite different than 20 knts. on the nose.

 

[Marlinmike]

I run from Long Island (Jones) to Cape May straight shot all the time, at 20 knots its like 7 hours. AC is also a good stop over location.

 

[bobbyp]

We were thinking last night that if conditions are good we might head straight to Cape May too. Waiting until better Sunday/Monday forecasts are available on Saturday.

Thanks for the heads up on SwellInfo, now loaded on my phone. Every bit of additional information is going to help the decision process.

 

[SOJOURN4]

Watch the coast for a Tuesday/Weds Nor'easter

 

[bobbyp]

OK. It looks like tomorrow (Sunday) is the day.

Our plan is to make a dawn start from NYC to Atlantic City and spend the night there.

Monday we plan to go to Delaware City and spend the night. Weather for Tues and Wed don't look very good so we'll probably stay in Delaware City for those nights too.

Thursday, we'll head down to the Annapolis area to park the boat for 2 weeks or so while some general maintenance is performed.

We plan to take it easy but boat can do 25+ knots loaded if necessary.

Decent plan?
Can someone help with the timing of the run up Delaware Bay?

 

[Cruzer]

Decent plan?
Can someone help with the timing of the run up Delaware Bay?

Monday is definitely looking like the best day ahead and should be good for your run up Delaware Bay - but obviously continue to watch for changes in the forecast.

It is approximately 90 nm from the Absecon Inlet entrance to Delaware City with a negligible penalty for going around Cape May rather than through it. But if the calm forecast holds for Monday, going around makes sense as you can maintain speed and not deal with negotiating an unfamiliar harbor. Cape May is a wonderful place to be "stuck" if the forecast shifts or you're in need of services. Take the time to familiarize yourself with the inlet and local chart while you're stationary so it's not entirely unfamiliar to you should you need to make it your Plan 'B' (always a good idea IMO for any route new to you - I will often pre-plot multiple options for the just-in-case scenarios).

Safe travels!

 

[psneeld]

To get the best "push" up the river from tidal current, leave the Caoe May area about 3 hours after low tide in Cape May harbor.

But if you run more than about 6 knots normally (which would be 7-8 with the current push), you outrun the assist and wont get as much for the whole distance.

If you are running at 10 knots or better, I wouldnt really worry about the tide unless as I posted before, you are running into a 15 knot or better NW wind with an incoming tide and thdn its the chop I wouldnt want to punch into fast.

 

[bobbyp]

After a couple of pre boarding issues that caused us to leave around 730 instead of 630 we made it to Atlantic City with calm seas and no issues. Some ice on our dock in the morning and fairly cold but navigated from the toasty inside helm.

Heading for Delaware City tomorrow still deciding between the canal and outside. Hoping for a non event trip.

 

[psneeld]

The harbor/canal is easy, just stay close to the ferry docks, as farther than a length of a ferry is where it gets very shallow.

 

[High Wire]

The harbor/canal is easy, just stay close to the ferry docks, as farther than a length of a ferry is where it gets very shallow.

Yes it is. Just remember that the Reds/Greens reverse after the bridge at Canyon Club. When you get to the 2 red nun buoys westbound near the west end, keep them on your port side.

 

[Joe Pica]

Davidson Laboratory: Urban Ocean Observatory

link to the Steven Institute Davidson labs wave and currents forecasting for NJ coast and De. Bay. I've used it for all of my transits of the coast and the bay. it has proven very reliable for me.

 

[Avalon36]

East Coast Run

I was planning on taking a run from NYC down the NJ coast and up to the Chesapeake in the next few days but it looks like it is going to get pretty nasty on Friday.
Plan was to stop in AC and in Cape May.

Never having done this before, can somebody help me out with the weather window? It looks like it cools off but calms down on Sunday?

Boat is a pretty run of the mill 40 ft flybridge cruiser luckily with twin steering stations. Experience level - novice.

Have done this run many times. Where in the Chesapeake are you headed? If you are thinking North/Mid-Bay (Baltimore, Annapolis, Solomon's Island, Potomac), think about coming up the Delaware Bay, through the C&D Canal and down the Chesapeake. Check the tides when heading out of Cape May. You want to be heading up the DB on the flood. Bucking tide and wind can beat you silly on the Delaware. I prefer staying close to but just outside the shipping channel. There is a lot of big traffic in the DB. Make sure your radio works and monitor 16. The C&D canal is easy and pretty as is the Northern Bay. Use paper charts as well as your chart plotter. They will give you more perspective as to where you are and where you are going. Hope you have a safe and fun passage!

 

[bobbyp]

Thanks for all of the valuable advice.
We had smooth seas EVERYWHERE. With the forum's help and a little luck we had a great trip. We just missed out on the bad weather and got to Herrington Harbour North in Traceys Landing MD yesterday afternoon with only light breezes and 1 to 2 feet on the Chesapeake.

Only hiccup was our generator fuel pump giving up mid Delaware Bay which we had taken care of at the Delaware City Marina.

We are staying at HHN for some basic maintenance and returning to the boat after Thanksgiving to continue south.

Of course we woke up to snow on the dock this morning:

 

[Cruzer]

Of course we woke up to snow on the dock this morning

It never feels right to see snow on the dock when you're still boating! Well-done and congratulations. Curious if you ended up going through or around Cape May.

 

[bobbyp]

With our beginner cruiser credentials we all felt safer being able to see land on both sides of the boat.
Canal views were kind of brown but must be pretty nice in season.

 

[Maerin]

Congrats on getting that trip under your belt. That it was a smooth one for the 1st time is a great confidence builder and encourages you to do more. Sometimes it can be really difficult to get past a crappy ride on a run like that, especially a 1st time experience. So now you know it can be pleasant and you've got a good foundation on which to build cruising experience.