8D Battery Replacement options

[SCOTTEDAVIS]

Originally Posted by drb1025

Thus, the idea of paralleling two Gp 31s to replace each 8D.

This is what I did and it works fine, as a plus if one battery is wonky in the future you can replace it by itself.

One of the 31's will start your engine with no problem so you could connect them with a 3 way switch for even more options while cruising out away.

I like options, independence and being self-reliant.

[Chuck Gould]

I'm a huge fan of Rolls batteries. They will cost you more up front, but maybe less in the long run. You might replace a Marine Store Special 8D every 4 or 5 years. The Rolls come with a 10 year warranty, and the first 7 years aren't even pro-rated. Full replacement if the battery fails before 7 years. Spend twice as much for a Rolls and get at least twice the life- and avoid the pain and strain of replacement. I know people who claim they are better than 15 years into a set of Rolls. We sold our last boat with Rolls batteries about 12 years old- still performing very well.

Obviously, the strategy doesn't pay off for somebody in the habit of trading boats every few years. You're unlikely to enhance the resale value by enough to cover the difference in cost if you don't keep the boat long enough to wear out a standard battery.

[psneeld]

Originally Posted by Chuck Gould

I'm a huge fan of Rolls batteries. They will cost you more up front, but maybe less in the long run. You might replace a Marine Store Special 8D every 4 or 5 years. The Rolls come with a 10 year warranty, and the first 7 years aren't even pro-rated. Full replacement if the battery fails before 7 years. Spend twice as much for a Rolls and get at least twice the life- and avoid the pain and strain of replacement. I know people who claim they are better than 15 years into a set of Rolls. We sold our last boat with Rolls batteries about 12 years old- still performing very well.

Obviously, the strategy doesn't pay off for somebody in the habit of trading boats every few years. You're unlikely to enhance the resale value by enough to cover the difference in cost if you don't keep the boat long enough to wear out a standard battery.

How much are you paying for an 8D Rolls?

The internet prices I see start around $800....

[Art]

Originally Posted by psneeld

How much are you paying for an 8D Rolls?

The internet prices I see start around $800....

Cost Comparison:

Five years ago I outfitted our Tolly with four group 31 deep cycle marine batt and one Group 27 combo, for under $600; from a “Batteries Plus” store. All five batts are still performing well. I never let them discharge over 50% and check water in a few cells every 6 months (top off w/ distilled water once a year)... inexpensive, great service, easy piesie maintenance!

Happy Boating Daze! - Art

[sunchaser]

My last Interstate 8Ds cost $152 apiece

[psneeld]

I know all that...I wanna know if a Rolls only costs 2X more than my setup...then I can agree with the numbers game....but most of the time wet cells come in at a price that if you take care of them...they are hard to beat.

Just checking other tech or higher priced stuff to see if it has drifted down to be the better deal.

[Chuck Gould]

The two Rolls 8D in Dear Prudence cost me a total of about $1200, but I happened upon a special opportunity. About the time I was throwing out the two junk batteries the previous owners had been using, one of my friends in the business cleaned out a warehouse. Back behind a bunch of stuff that had been there for several years there were two brand new Rolls batteries. They are shipped "dry", so there was nothing in any of the cells but the lead plates. As the batteries had never been sold or activated, the full factory warranty was still available. We poured in the acid, put them on a charger, and they proved to be as good as new (which they were).

You can buy cheaper batteries, and frankly most people do. In my opinion, the Rolls are a push or better with buying cheaper stuff- especially when considering the cost and hassle of swapping out a standard battery once, twice, or maybe even three times during the usual life of a Rolls.

Biggest difference, as far as I can tell, is that the Rolls have larger and heavier plates. They also wrap each lead plate in a type of a sack that is permeable by acid. As the plates eventually degrade, and slough off remains in the sack. A lot of wet cell batteries fail when plates begin to disintegrate and enough debris builds up on the bottom of the cell to create a short.

[Chuck Gould]

Here's another perspective on Rolls pricing. It's pretty competitive with what some people charge for AGM batteries.

Search Results at West Marine

[psneeld]

Originally Posted by Chuck Gould

The two Rolls 8D in Dear Prudence cost me a total of about $1200, but I happened upon a special opportunity. About the time I was throwing out the two junk batteries the previous owners had been using, one of my friends in the business cleaned out a warehouse. Back behind a bunch of stuff that had been there for several years there were two brand new Rolls batteries. They are shipped "dry", so there was nothing in any of the cells but the lead plates. As the batteries had never been sold or activated, the full factory warranty was still available. We poured in the acid, put them on a charger, and they proved to be as good as new (which they were).

You can buy cheaper batteries, and frankly most people do. In my opinion, the Rolls are a push or better with buying cheaper stuff- especially when considering the cost and hassle of swapping out a standard battery once, twice, or maybe even three times during the usual life of a Rolls.

Biggest difference, as far as I can tell, is that the Rolls have larger and heavier plates. They also wrap each lead plate in a type of a sack that is permeable by acid. As the plates eventually degrade, and slough off remains in the sack. A lot of wet cell batteries fail when plates begin to disintegrate and enough debris builds up on the bottom of the cell to create a short.

Cheapest I have seen a Rolls 8D...no shipping, internet price - $800

My heavy duty, top rated American 6V golf cart batt - $112.5x2= $225

Less than 1/3 as much, designed for numerous, deep cycles too. Not sure if the Rolls has independent cells ( I thought they did), but if one goes bad on me...I can replace 1/2 the batt.

They are 1/2 the weight, I can configure the shape better to suit my engine room.

While the Rolls are not a bad deal if you don't have to pay shipping and they truly last 15 years...many of us aren't willing to gamble on the longevity, or don't have a distributer near us, often have to buy one "on the road" do you get what you get, etc...etc...so we just settle into our routine and accept what we have in the bilge

[Chuck Gould]

Yes, the Rolls have independent cells. That actually makes them easy to install in places with difficult access. Put one cell at a time into the battery box and then bolt them together. If a cell eventually goes bad, it's possible to replace a single cell rather than buy an entire battery. It's commonly understood that most of the time when a battery fails the problem can be traced to a single cell. If the cells can't be individually removed, a whole new battery will be required.

[HenryD]

I replaced my 8 8Ds for house and 2 8Ds for start, with L16 6v batteries - I can get three L16's in the space of two 8Ds. They provide more amp hours overall because the total amount of lead is more. The L16s are taller so they do not work for everyone. The individual batteries weigh less (about 125lbs each) so are not as hard to move around. The batteries are designed for industrial use - scrubber/sweepers and Lifeline sells them in AGM. If I did not use these, the Rolls were my next choice.

[Larry M]

The specs for our engine recommended a 4D or equivalent. The local Ford Lehman guru suggested an 8D because of the colder ambient and water temperatures. We got a deal on 3 Optima Red Tops. Since we were rewiring the house bank, we had the wire and lugs so it was an easy job. The bank has it's own 3 stage voltage regulator and alternator so there's no conflict with the T-105's (house bank).

[SCOTTEDAVIS]

Originally Posted by Larry M

The specs for our engine recommended a 4D or equivalent. The local Ford Lehman guru suggested an 8D because of the colder ambient and water temperatures. We got a deal on 3 Optima Red Tops. Since we were rewiring the house bank, we had the wire and lugs so it was an easy job. The bank has it's own 3 stage voltage regulator and alternator so there's no conflict with the T-105's (house bank).

I bet those do the job!

Looks like a nice ship shape install.

[rochepoint]

Originally Posted by ksanders

I'd rather see your windlass and crane running on your house bank though.
From my standpoint there should be zero loads on the start batteries other than starters.

Why do you think this? Our boat did have the windlass powered by the house(4 golf cart) batteries and every time we ran the windlass our GPS would beep and go crazy. Move the windlass power supply to the start battery(8D) and have had no problem with electronics since. We always have the engine running while using the windlass............

[Alemao]

I have two 8D for the motors (2 Cats 3208, 375hp), a house with 6 Troyans 6volts and another 8D for the crane, windlass and generator. Works well

[psneeld]

When I called American Diesel...they basically told me a group 24/27 (depending on specs) for a Lehman 120.

I went up a notch in size.... and even in 20 degree weather it bangs right over with 850 or so CCA....physical size is around a group 27.

When I read the specs on Lehman starters...really a good group 24 should really handle it...but only in a perfect world.

Many of the big production guys like Sea Ray got away from 4Ds and 8Ds and went with group 31s in parallel to start and another as Batt 2 for backup...even to start their entire Cummins line in Rays up to 45 feet or so.

[BruceK]

I`m not against 8Ds at all, but installing/disposing @ 53 kg is a challenge.
My genset start batt has 150ah dimensions, (would you call that a 6D), puts out 1150CCA, I bet its predecessors 30 years back did half that, so a 4D would probably suffice. But it is back up, just in case, for the mains.

[ksanders]

Originally Posted by rochepoint

Why do you think this? Our boat did have the windlass powered by the house(4 golf cart) batteries and every time we ran the windlass our GPS would beep and go crazy. Move the windlass power supply to the start battery(8D) and have had no problem with electronics since. We always have the engine running while using the windlass............

Simply because I want nothing attached to the start batteries that could drain them.

I have both a crane and a large windlass. These are tied to the house bank, and I suffered the exact thing that you reported. When running the windlass the voltage would drop to the nav system causing it to reboot.

To solve this I simply start the generator when running the windlass. The battery charger keeps things up enough to not bother the electronics.

[FF]

With caution the group of 31 can be fine, BUT the problem is they can never be asked to suffer deep discharges.
Or they will need rapid & frequent replacement.

Thats fine if a Sams club is the source , they check nothing , just hand you a new set 2x (the computer knows).

So the question then becomes what service use is the crane ?

5 -10 min of dink hoisting should not be a problem, an hour surely would be.

Discharge rate 50A? or 200A ?

Again a SOC meter would be a big help in understanding how hard you are hammering the set.

The spiral wound or AGM batts might be a better choice for long hard accessory use , and the charge back up quicker IF you spend the bucks to rapid recharge.

[neworleansrich]

If you are not paying around $400 for an 8D, it's not a deep cycle. A $150 8D is a starting battery with thinner plates.