Trawler 36 Generator - Page 4

jleonard · 02-04-2023, 07:54 AM

My next door marina neighbor repowered a Sea Ray from gtwin gas to twin diesels.
He kept is perfectly running gas generator that was located in the rear lazarette. He installed a 12 gallon fuel tank for it and it was a great set-up.

It CAN be done and be done safely.

SIBERNUT · 02-04-2023, 08:18 AM

There is another way- a knowledgeable skilled owner anally following the installation manual.

Comodave · 02-04-2023, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jleonard

My next door marina neighbor repowered a Sea Ray from gtwin gas to twin diesels.
He kept is perfectly running gas generator that was located in the rear lazarette. He installed a 12 gallon fuel tank for it and it was a great set-up.

It CAN be done and be done safely.

It would be easier to repower to gas to diesel since the boat was setup for gas so all of the equipment should have been ignition protected. Going the other way probably none of the equipment is ignition protected.

SIBERNUT · 02-04-2023, 03:10 PM

Ok , let me restate my intent. Gas generator in lazarette, openings except limber hole sealed. Outboard style gas tank with clip connection to gen, also in lazarette but easy to take & fill. Bilge blower wired to run constant when generator starts, open lazarette to vent before starting. Blower vents to inboard side panel above deck. 531 battery powered co detectors within 2 ft of each other inside salon. How's that? And im still not even close to the price of a diesel gen set.

Gdavid · 02-04-2023, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIBERNUT

Ok , let me restate my intent. Gas generator in lazarette, openings except limber hole sealed. Outboard style gas tank with clip connection to gen, also in lazarette but easy to take & fill. Bilge blower wired to run constant when generator starts, open lazarette to vent before starting. Blower vents to inboard side panel above deck. 531 battery powered co detectors within 2 ft of each other inside salon. How's that? And im still not even close to the price of a diesel gen set.

Honestly, it doesn't matter what our opinion is. I would speak to a surveyor and insurance broker first. If you' create a situation that is difficult to insure, it is a headache. I could be wrong, it happens frequently (I am a married man).

I can say with certainty that an outboard style gas tank is not approved for below deck use, and for good reason, they don't seal worth a darn, especially the new vapor "free" ones that leak like bandits.

motion30 · 02-04-2023, 03:53 PM

I installed a used 8k westerbeake in my 34 marine trader. Cost about 3grand including the cost of the generator. Installed it myself

diver dave · 02-04-2023, 04:07 PM

A limber will allow liquid gas to pass, correct? I have had various “outboard style” gas connectors leak; i would be thinking of a truly sealed space with ignition rated spark producers ( brushed motors), etc.
You need cooling air as well as fume reduction forced vents too.

CharlieO. · 02-04-2023, 04:52 PM

Still think the limber holes should be sealed up. Add a bilge pump and fume detector to the laz.

SIBERNUT · 02-05-2023, 09:03 AM

Couple things- as a canvas man, I am called many times when a new owner wants canvas. (Integrity is a gift a man gives HIMSELF) I tell them to run it for a few weeks first, 'cause you're gonna' look stupid with new canvas & a blown (whatever) at the dock.
"I did have a skinny younger guy to drill the exhaust fitting and connect exhaust. hose. "
Contemplating my gen install, is there a safe prudent way to plumb the exhaust to the existing engine piping near the transom? I see many boats this way, gen thru engine exhaust pipe. Input/comments pls.

SeaMoose · 02-05-2023, 02:08 PM

Interesting thread.

For the record I installed my own NextGen 3.5 KW. My middle name is overbuilt and I did just that. 3/4" Marine ply base, epoxied sitting on 4 double thick 3/4" Marine Ply supports laminated together, tabbed to the hull with cloth, 4 coats Interlux Bilge paint on everything, SS hardware, all wiring 8 gauge marine grade to Blue Seas transfer switches rated at 65 A with a 30A breaker on the genset itself.

For a small gennie like mine a standard bronze through hull makes a fine exhaust I've got a 4 foot exhaust run after the lift muffler and the water that comes out is well below boiling. Right at the waterline keeps the noise down. I would not plumb it in line with the engine for fear of backflow into the genset.

I'm very happy with the NexGen although you do have to change the oil frequently and it does run hot and hard with the 16,000 BTU Webasto A/C.

The idea that small used diesel gensets area easy to find must be from another planet it took me three years to find a small used generator that wasn't a piece of junk paid $4k for gen/sound shield/lift muffler/strainer. When I got it the exhaust was made from sanitation hose that was melted, and the water hose between the strainer and the genny came off an aquarium but that's another story...

A properly installed gas generator in the lazarette is certainly doable with enough precautions but when it came time to resell the buyer's surveyor is going to rip it to shreds, and the buyer will be told to run away.

Alan & Darina aboard Sea Moose
You Tube: The Adventures of Yorksie and Me
Home Port on Lake Erie
Currently on the hard in Orange Beach Alabama having the transmission rebuilt
Back on the loop in Late March

**slowgoesit** · 02-05-2023, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIBERNUT

Ok , let me restate my intent. Gas generator in lazarette, openings except limber hole sealed. Outboard style gas tank with clip connection to gen, also in lazarette but easy to take & fill. Bilge blower wired to run constant when generator starts, open lazarette to vent before starting. Blower vents to inboard side panel above deck. 531 battery powered co detectors within 2 ft of each other inside salon. How's that? And im still not even close to the price of a diesel gen set.

Sibernut: Starting over here:

Your question (paraphrased) is whether or not it's a good idea to install a gasoline generator, below deck level, into a boat that has a diesel engine, and has never been set up for gasoline (ignition proof motors, starters, alternators, switching, etc).
Presumably you asked the question on this forum because you have at least some confidence in the knowledge of the people on the forum.
The responses have been overwhelmingly against doing such, from documented safety concerns.
You keeping asking the same question.

Short story: A guy walks into a room with 50 people in it. Over the next 30 minutes or so 49 of those 50 people tell him his shoe laces are untied. Before he seeks out and asks the 50th person whether his shoe lace is untied, it might behoove him to look down and see for himself . . .

Not meaning to be harsh, but your proposed course of action is, IMHO, ill advised to say the least.

Comodave · 02-05-2023, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowgoesit

Sibernut: Starting over here:

Your question (paraphrased) is whether or not it's a good idea to install a gasoline generator, below deck level, into a boat that has a diesel engine, and has never been set up for gasoline (ignition proof motors, starters, alternators, switching, etc).
Presumably you asked the question on this forum because you have at least some confidence in the knowledge of the people on the forum.
The responses have been overwhelmingly against doing such, from documented safety concerns.
You keeping asking the same question.

Short story: A guy walks into a room with 50 people in it. Over the next 30 minutes or so 49 of those 50 people tell him his shoe laces are untied. Before he seeks out and asks the 50th person whether his shoe lace is untied, it might behoove him to look down and see for himself . . .

Not meaning to be harsh, but your proposed course of action is, IMHO, ill advised to say the least.

Yup!

Jack2427 · 02-05-2023, 06:30 PM

I have a Parker 2550 that is O/B powered and has a diesel genset. However the diesel tank was done by the factory and meets all applicable specs. It has been mis-fueled only once by an over eager dock hand. Fortunately it was an easy clean out.
As for a jury rigged system? I can count the potential problems into double digits easily. Stay safe, Admiral Murphy is alive and well, and he lives on your boat!

SIBERNUT · 02-07-2023, 11:34 AM

After a lot of discussion and wallet searching, I am now considering a diesel gen instead. Tks for all of the patience and advice posted here, and I know you guys are right for many reasons. So I have this little Westerbeke gas genny with low hours (& looks it) that I think I can sell in a couple months at a profit. Looking for a diesel now around 4Kw ~ .
A Westerbeke is avail locally with a rebuilt gen end but advertised as "troublesome starting" . Power end looks rough, but if it doesn't smoke I may jump on it. OK, let the fun begin! You guys were right, so now tell me what can be wrong w/it besides injectors, etc. ?
BTW, the saga of the SS Phelps continues, needed a trans but will try to start the engine (!!)this week.

Gdavid · 02-07-2023, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIBERNUT

A Westerbeke is avail locally with a rebuilt gen end but advertised as "troublesome starting" . Power end looks rough, but if it doesn't smoke I may jump on it. OK, let the fun begin! You guys were right, so now tell me what can be wrong w/it besides injectors, etc. ?

Troublesome starting could be anything from the fuel system to low compression. Many generators suffer abuse in the form of under loading where they are fired up and run just to keep the 12V system charged and in case they want to run AC but may run all day with virtually no load on them, this can cause the cylinder glazing, the compression rings now struggle to perform, and the generator is troublesome to start. It is labor intensive to disassemble, hone the cylinders and reassemble but not terrible if the generator is already out of the boat and you don't mind rolling up your sleaves.

That said, start with the simple stuff first, verify the fuel system is clean, bled and the glow plugs work.

C lectric · 02-07-2023, 07:42 PM

And the fuel is air free and does not run back to the tank once the engine is shutdown.

jleonard · 02-08-2023, 08:05 AM

it could also be as simple as bad glow plugs, or a poorly adjusted or sticky fuel solenoid.

ronobrien · 02-08-2023, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gdavid

Troublesome starting could be anything from the fuel system to low compression. Many generators suffer abuse in the form of under loading where they are fired up and run just to keep the 12V system charged and in case they want to run AC but may run all day with virtually no load on them, this can cause the cylinder glazing, the compression rings now struggle to perform, and the generator is troublesome to start. It is labor intensive to disassemble, hone the cylinders and reassemble but not terrible if the generator is already out of the boat and you don't mind rolling up your sleaves.

That said, start with the simple stuff first, verify the fuel system is clean, bled and the glow plugs work.

As the gen is out of the boat it wouldn't very hard to do a compression test. It would give you quick valuable information. Paying a tech to do it might be money well invested.

SIBERNUT · 02-08-2023, 01:30 PM

Here's the site for it. Looks a little long in the tooth. No reply from seller yet
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...ssenger_banner

SIBERNUT · 02-09-2023, 07:43 AM

OK, how about Entek generators? 4.2 for sale nearby