MS 400 Holding Tank Sender Repair

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Dougcole

Guru
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
2,167
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Morgan
Vessel Make
'05 Mainship 40T
Hi All,


When I mentioned in a recent post that I was going to try to repair the holding tank sender/sensor on my Mainship 400 a few people asked me to let them know how to do it and to post pics if possible.


I finished this job tonight, so here goes.


Start by pumping and flushing your holding tank.



1. Locate the sender, which is on top of the holding tank, just forward of where the floor ends under the companionway steps. I carefully measured and marked the center of the sender on the floor with a sharpie so I would know where to cut.


2. This is the hardest part. Use a 4" hols saw to cut through the floor right above the sender. I reccomend investing in a hole saw if you don't have one, don't try to do it with a jigsaw as there is not enough clearance for the blade. Also, hole saws just make a cleaner hole. If you own a MS 400 you will likely use it again (like, in order to access the fuel tanks sender on the stb side) so don't cheap out.



No one likes cutting a big hole in their boat, even if it is in an interior deck, but there is no way around it. You can't get the sender out without cutting a hole.


There are two layers of 1/2" plywood you will have to cut through. It takes a while and makes some dust.


3. Clip the two wires, orange and yellow, leading to the sender.


4. Unscrew the sender from the tank. Mine was a little tough to get out as it had some sealant on the threads. I was careful and used a pipe wrench. The threaded plastic fitting screws out, not the metal part.


5. Pull the sender out through the hole you cut. Put a rag or something in the tank opening to reduce odor.



6. OK, here is the nasty part. My sender was covered in about 1/2 inch of a hard black scale. In the spirit of politeness and decorum I did not take a pic of it. Trust me, it was gross.


I dropped the entire assembly in 1/2 gallon of barnacle buster and let it bubble for 1/2 hour then scraped it with a flat head screwdriver and hosed it off every few minutes. When I had the outside clean I soaked it again, then hosed some more. Eventually I was able to remove the retaining clip at the bottom of the tube and then slide the tube off. It wasn't easy to get the tube off, it had scale/sludge inside it, which is what was keeping the float from moving.


After I got the tube off I scraped the inside and the float, then hosed some more. Eventually, it came clean and I reassembled it.


7. Screw the sender back into the tank and reconnect the wires. I used quick connectors rather than butt connectors to make it easier next time.



8. Install a pie plate fitting in the hole in the floor. I didn't bother to caulk it as it is in a dry spot. When the steps are closed the pie plate is hidden.



I put about ten gallons of water into my holding tank to check the gauge. It is working perfectly.


It's an unpleasant job but not a difficult one. Hope this helps. Pics below.
 

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On behalf of MS400 owners everywhere, thank you Doug. That couldn't have been fun...

Now you have inspired me!
 
No problem, hope it helps. I won't let it go that long again, that's for sure.
 
Before I'd go through that even once, I'd replace the tank level indicator with one that uses sensors that go on the outside of the tank. This is the one I recommend. Scad Tank Monitors

--Peggie
 
Before I'd go through that even once, I'd replace the tank level indicator with one that uses sensors that go on the outside of the tank. This is the one I recommend. Scad Tank Monitors

--Peggie


I seriously considered that option. Trouble is that the wiring run from the holding tank up to the gauge in the head is a bit problematic, it's doable, but not slam dunk easy. In less time than it would have taken me to retrofit the external sender I fixed the old one. It wasn't a difficult job.



Also, though I'm not opposed to spending money on my boat (just ask my wife) it's a couple hundred dollars for that system. I spent about $10 on the pie plate, plus used a little barnacle buster I had laying around to repair the old one.



Lastly, where possible and feasible I like to stick with the original systems on my boat unless there is something much better to replace it with. I hate putting new stuff in on top of the old just to save a little time. To each their own though, I'm sure the external sender would work as well.
 
I would have left that cylindrical housing off the sensor because stuff clogging the inside of it prevented the float from following the tube as levels rose. This is the sensor in my waste tank, and that's what it looked like coming out of the tank which is rinsed after every outing. It was being replaced because it failed internally.
 

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I would have left that cylindrical housing off the sensor because stuff clogging the inside of it prevented the float from following the tube as levels rose. This is the sensor in my waste tank, and that's what it looked like coming out of the tank which is rinsed after every outing. It was being replaced because it failed internally.


I thought about that after I had it back together (of course). I may leave it off after the next cleaning.
 
I thought about that after I had it back together (of course). I may leave it off after the next cleaning.

I am guessing you will be keeping the tank a bit more rinsed out and hopefully will not be doing that anymore.
 
Holding Tank Sender Replacement

I followed the steps described, filled with excitement to actually be able to see my holding tank level again without lifting the steps, laying on the deck, shining a light through the top of the tank, and pretty much guessing at it. My deck is carpeted, with the carpet running under the steps, attached to the underside of the edge of the deck. Apparently whoever secured the carpet was very conscientious of his work. It took about an hour of stubby, arthritic fingers, improvised hand tools, with associated grunts, groans, and salty language to pull back the carpet in a space with no room to maneuver or get something under the carpet.
When I got the carpet rolled back, I measured the end of the deck to the middle of the sending unit, then drilled a small pilot hole to see where the drill bit showed up in relation to the center of the sending unit. Holy Mackerel! I nailed it. I almost called it quits for the day at that point so as not to crush my tender ego with ensuing failures.
However, I carried on. Snipped the wires, got the sender out. Or at least the top part of the sender. I had to fish the rest out with very long needle nosed pliers. Apparently what looked like a facecloth got into my holding tank, wrapped around the bottom of the sending unit and snapped the thing to pieces when pumping out.
Of course, being circa 2004 hardware, and the replacement is a stainless steel unit. I have attached pics of the old unit and the replacement unit.
So here are my questions: Does anybody know where an exact replacement for the old unit my be found? Has anybody swapped out the old unit for the new unit? Did the threads on the new unit match the threads for the old unit or did you have to drill new holes for the securing ring? If you have an SHS/SHST sender, does it work with the old gauge? Is there an overflow vent on the new unit as there was with the old unit?
 

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Urine will eat through the steel unit... My advice: plug the hole in the top of the tank and install a SCAD tank monitor that uses sensors that attach to the outside of the tank. Top rated, inexpensive. Scad Tank Monitors


--Peggie
 
I bet the new style will thread right in, it looks pretty standard. If you look at the pic of my sender it is a combo of stainless and plastic. The new one looks exactly the same as mine (and Rich's) except that it is all stainless. I think I'd upgrade to the new style rather than trying to find the old one.
 
I bet the new style will thread right in, it looks pretty standard. If you look at the pic of my sender it is a combo of stainless and plastic. The new one looks exactly the same as mine (and Rich's) except that it is all stainless. I think I'd upgrade to the new style rather than trying to find the old one.

I just recently replaced my sender following Doug’s instructions. The new sender did fit exactly but it threads into the plastic plug so don’t toss that item out. Unfortunately it didn’t fix the issue so I also replaced the gauge. Now it reads “Empty “ whereas before it always read “Full”. I have not yet added much liquid to the tank so I can’t tell if it works as yet but in a couple weeks I’ll expect to know for sure.
 
Wow, I could sure argue for Peggies solutiong.


I did a similar external gauge. Cost about $125, good looking, super easy install and works. Small operation. The Scan one is very appealing, too. I'd use external sensors for most any tank quantity.... just simple.



(435) 656-0042
dennis@ferriellosales.com


However, fun hearing Dougs solution... Cleaver.
 

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