Mainship 400 Replacement for Vacu Flush head

[Dougcole]

Still having to baby our Vacuflush head, hoping it holds out another two weeks until we get home from the Bahamas. If it's a repair that costs more than $100, I've decided to replace the entire vacuflush system with a traditional head.


I know lots of people are high on the Marine Elegance head, and I've added it to the list of considerations, but what other options are out there? Anyone with a 400 made this switch? I'd like to avoid as many mods as I possibly can.


Our head compartment is small and neither my wife nor I are big people so I don't really care about having a larger sized head. We also don't care about noise.



We had a Seaera on our old boat and really liked it, it's smaller and a couple hundred bucks cheaper. Looks like the ME hoses come in and out at the bottom though, like the Vacuflush, so install may be easier.


Looking for opinions.


Thanks,
Doug

 

[Shrew]

I've bought and am in the process of installing the Raritan Sea Era. I doubt you'll be able to fit the Marine Elegance in your space. We couldn't in the 350/390 and from what I can tell, the head in the 400 is laid out the same.

The Sea Era is the Marine Elagance Jr, from what I can tell. One thing to note, the Sea Era is a freshwater flush. I bought the dual Freshwater/Seawater model which has two pumps, and the Seawater pump is EXTERNAL. It is a 'remote' pump, however if I want to install the seawater option, I need to find a location to install the seawater pump. For now, I am installing the freshwater only option. This requires that I remove the inlet T on the head to route freshwater only.

 

[rslifkin]

The Sea Era comes in a few versions. There's a freshwater version, a remote seawater pump version, a combo fresh / raw water version, and an integrated seawater pump version.

I installed the integrated pump version (raw water) last year in my forward head. The integrated pump is LOUD and I kinda wish I'd gone for the remote seawater pump. But other than the noise, it works great. Pretty much, if it comes out of a human and any even remotely reasonable amount of toilet paper is added to it, it'll flush with no complaints from the head.

 

[bayview]

I am really surprised. Those systems are not all that complicated and in my experience work very well. I would never go back the the old style heads. One reason is that vacuflush use less water to pump outs aren't as frequent.

 

[Comodave]

You can get a kit from Raritan to make the Marine Elegance a rear discharge instead of bottom discharge. I bought one and it is terribly expensive for what you get. It is a short section about 2” of hose a nd a 90 degree elbow and 4 hose clamps. Make your own. We love the ME. That is absolutely what I would use if it will fit.

 

[caltexflanc]

I am really surprised. Those systems are not all that complicated and in my experience work very well. I would never go back the the old style heads. One reason is that vacuflush use less water to pump outs aren't as frequent.

Add me to the list of the surprised. As I was futzing around yet again with one of our traditional toilets here on land, I was reflection on how dependable our VF toilets were when we lived and cruised aboard for several years; much more so than any toilet of any kind we have ever had in a about a dozen different houses.

Environmental Marine in FLL is a great source for parts and very detailed technical help. Give them a call. They were very helpful to me when I had to remediate a very incorrect installation by a PO on one of our systems. https://environmentalmarine.com/

A big mistake people make with these heads is not operating them correctly and running enough water through them. The tendency is to pretend they work like an airliner toilet.

 

[rslifkin]

Macerating electric heads are also simple as dirt, so I don't think vacuflush wins anything there. The macerating heads might as well be a water pump and a blender attached to a toilet bowl.

 

[Dougcole]

Add me to the list of the surprised. As I was futzing around yet again with one of our traditional toilets here on land, I was reflection on how dependable our VF toilets were when we lived and cruised aboard for several years; much more so than any toilet of any kind we have ever had in a about a dozen different houses.

Environmental Marine in FLL is a great source for parts and very detailed technical help. Give them a call. They were very helpful to me when I had to remediate a very incorrect installation by a PO on one of our systems. https://environmentalmarine.com/

A big mistake people make with these heads is not operating them correctly and running enough water through them. The tendency is to pretend they work like an airliner toilet.

Yes, I have worked with environmental marine on this current problem and the vacuflush issues I have had in the past. They are a first class operation, and have done all they can to help me. They replaced my vacuum genertaor tank and pump 18 months ago, moved the switch and bellows over from my old tank. Pretty much a full rebuild. As I said in another post, in the last 5 years I've dumped close to $1,500 into parts to keep this vacuflush system going. I do my own labor, God only knows what it would have cost if I had someone do it for me. Three to four grand is my guess. It's always vacuum leaks. Hard to trace and troublesome to fix. That's the problem with Vacuflush IMO, too many points of possible failure. I'm glad yours works for you, but I've just had enough.



And no, it's not user error. We flush with plenty of water. It's not a duckbill issue or a clogging issue.



From the trouble shooting I've done, I think the current issue is in the toilet base. I've got a spare base with me, but not the PVC elbow and tailpiece I need to fix it. It holds pressure for about 30 seconds, so we turn the breaker on right before use, flush then turn it off.

 

[Dwk]

" The macerating heads might as well be a water pump and a blender attached to a toilet bowl".

That's a great description of the Marine Elegance we installed! The Smart Control "flush only" option works well to help save water.
A friend dropped a bolt in the bowl and was easily retrieved due to the access to the built-in macerator. Another vote for the Elegance.

 

[Comodave]

I agree that Vacuflush is too may areas of possible failure. The ME on the other hand is simple. Hope you get it figured out to your satisfaction.

 

[catalinajack]

Vacuflush problems posted here frequently. Yes, some folks rarely have a problem but here is a question. Why is it that in years and years of following this forum I have never seen a problem with a Marine Elegance. And never mind that space-hogging, failure-prone vacuum pump.

I am really surprised. Those systems are not all that complicated and in my experience work very well. I would never go back the the old style heads. One reason is that vacuflush use less water to pump outs aren't as frequent.

 

[Gmarr]

Peggie will chime in soon- the Head Mistress!

 

[Bacchus]

I agree that Vacuflush is too may areas of possible failure. The ME on the other hand is simple. Hope you get it figured out to your satisfaction.

[emoji106]
Too many slip fittings that require a perfect vacuum seal is a problem waiting to happen.

 

[ranger58sb]

Macerating electric heads are also simple as dirt, so I don't think vacuflush wins anything there. The macerating heads might as well be a water pump and a blender attached to a toilet bowl.

" The macerating heads might as well be a water pump and a blender attached to a toilet bowl".
That's a great description of the Marine Elegance we installed! The Smart Control "flush only" option works well to help save water.
A friend dropped a bolt in the bowl and was easily retrieved due to the access to the built-in macerator. Another vote for the Elegance.

We've had both VF freshwater and electric freshwater... latter suited us better. Quieter, chopped carrots, etc.

-Chris

 

[HeadMistress]

Peggie will chime in soon- the Head Mistress!

I'm following the thread and will chime in when I see the need to do so. But for now, y'all are doing fine without any more input or correction from me.


--Peggie

 

[Seas The Day 1]

So, Dougcole, what decision or action brought your VF problem to an end? I am having similar issues with mine and have had enough... Did you indeed install an electric freshwater system? Do you like it and is it working the way you expected/hoped?

 

[Dougcole]

So, Dougcole, what decision or action brought your VF problem to an end? I am having similar issues with mine and have had enough... Did you indeed install an electric freshwater system? Do you like it and is it working the way you expected/hoped?

Hi,


Sorry for the delayed response, I have not been on the forum in the last few days.


After 8 years of working on it, and about double the cost of a new system, I managed to get our vacu-flush working perfectly. It currently holds pressure, as far as I can tell, indefinitely. I replaced every part, some twice, on the entire system, including hose clamps and the vacuum tank itself. It would work better for a while, then back to no holding pressure. Eventually, after tons of trouble shooting led by the great guys at environmental marine in Fort Lauderdale we decided to try one last Hail Mary and replace the funnel. It worked.


As per their request, I brought the old funnel into them to inspect. There were no visible flaws, even using a magnifying glass and a bright light, but somewhere, it leaked just enough to prevent a full vacuum to be achieved. Likely the glue used to attach the PVC elbow to the bottom of the funnel was the culprit.



So now I never say anything negative about my VF in its presence or look it straight in the eye as I would not want to risk offending it which may upset the delicate balance that it requires.



I know this will upset the VF fans on the forum, some of whom have accused me of shoddy PM practices, but I will keep it as long as it continues to function, then I'll switch to something else. Most likely a Sea Era.


By the way, some good news; I was able to move the hose that runs from the head to the vacuum tank about 12" when I changed out the funnel. This leads me to believe that when it comes time to change the hose I will be able to use the old one to pull a new hose through without too much effort.


Doug

 

[Seas The Day 1]

Thanks for the update. CONGRATULATIONS and good luck with a multitude of successful future flushes.?

 

[Dougcole]

One thing that helped me narrow down where the leaks were coming from was to jam a wet wooden plug into the funnel. If you are still getting vacuum leaks after less than 2 or 3 minutes your leak is downstream of the plug. Probably. Well, somewhat likely anyway.



You can also jam the plug into the inlet in the vacuum tank. Same idea.

 

[Seas The Day 1]

Good idea. Thanks.

 

[Comodave]

After the years of less than enthusiastic desire for a Vacuflush head, it looks like I will have another one. The boat we are going to sea trial and survey Monday has a Vacuflush head in it. How long it will remain is yet to be determined. I may pull the Vacuflush out and put a Marine Elegance in it’s place. Time will tell. I have 2 engines, all the canvas and all the upholstery to replace over next winter so the head may have to wait. But Dougs experience with a Vacuflush doesn’t make me optimistic.

 

[Conrad]

I've posted before, but will again. We installed two complete Vacuflush systems on Blue Sky in 2013. Since then we've had one fitting go - a minor expense - and the plunger just recently. Other than that, no problems whatsoever. Occasionally they clog, but are easily cleared. I'm very happy with them.