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Old 04-11-2017, 08:32 AM   #141
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Art

I grew up on gauges too and new where the placement of the needle should be. This boat is all digital and a royal pain to remember of write down what the numeric signature should be. It's also upsetting to see one engine running a few degrees hotter than the other, with gauges you would never be able to tell. Progress????
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:14 AM   #142
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Art

I grew up on gauges too and new where the placement of the needle should be. This boat is all digital and a royal pain to remember of write down what the numeric signature should be. It's also upsetting to see one engine running a few degrees hotter than the other, with gauges you would never be able to tell. Progress????

Progress can at times equivalate into Paranoia.

One thing is for sure about human created progress, it's unstoppable; be its outcome "equivalating" into good or bad!
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:29 AM   #143
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Art

I grew up on gauges too and new where the placement of the needle should be. This boat is all digital and a royal pain to remember of write down what the numeric signature should be. It's also upsetting to see one engine running a few degrees hotter than the other, with gauges you would never be able to tell. Progress????
Bigfish,
I agree.
When I flew UL aircraft I did find the didgital presentation was far better for cylinder head temp. 400 degrees was fine on some engines but the rate of accent or decent was very important and that was easy to see w the didgital readout. With a analogue readout you could see 400 degrees fine but had no idea how stable it was and how stable was very important. Climbing fast was way different than climbing slow.
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:29 AM   #144
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If you're singlehanded, who drives the boat and officially stands watch while you're below inspecting your engine room?
I single hand 90% of the time. I do occasionally go all the way down in to the ER for a check - in areas where there is no traffic for a long way. More often I pop one of the hatches and take a quick look and a sniff.

What I have been doing is doing an ER check after I arrive, with the engine still running, before shutdown. While it's not at operating revs I can still get a good idea if there's something leaking before it dries up. Having had a leak from a hose on the raw water pump in the past I run my had over that area to make sure it's dry.

I do full underway ER checks when I have crew.

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Old 04-11-2017, 09:41 AM   #145
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Our vessel is capable of safely doing overnights from either upper or lower helm. But, we don't do overnight travels anymore. And in the PNW the cozy lower helm close to the coffee is very inviting when cruising after dark or before sunrise.

Oddly enough, one of the few times I have piloted the boat from the FB was during a rainy morning before sunrise as I was trying to extricate myself from a very tight transient dock. The FB gave me better 360 degree visibility that was particularly important in this situation.

Once I was out of the tiny marina and clear of the mooring balls, I retreated to the warm, dry PH with a cup of coffee.
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:54 AM   #146
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Oddly enough, one of the few times I have piloted the boat from the FB was during a rainy morning before sunrise as I was trying to extricate myself from a very tight transient dock. The FB gave me better 360 degree visibility that was particularly important in this situation.

Once I was out of the tiny marina and clear of the mooring balls, I retreated to the warm, dry PH with a cup of coffee.
"The FB gave me better 360 degree visibility that was particularly important in this situation."

One of, but not the only, important attribute of FB. Although, I must admit, if I boated in often damp, cool locations I too would most likely be piloting from down below much of the time. But, when the sun is out and weather dry/warm - it's the Bridge for Linda and me!
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:02 AM   #147
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my previous boat was a fly bridge yacht, the top often time there and I spent time at the end I would only use it 2 times last season.when I was looking for a new boat, I did not want any more flying bridge. each with their own values ​​and aspirations, a good thing that there are a variety of boat. or is there I have a rubber boat on the roof and a small command center, if necessary,
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:10 AM   #148
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Re ER checks. We do them but not usually on a strict schedule, and only an average of about every 4 hours. I have never discovered anything of any consequence and don't really expect to. I do it for peace of mind and because I really enjoy it. Mine is an easily entered, stand-up engine room, with great access to even the outboard sides of the engines. The bilges are clean and dry, and most everything is white, giving the appearance of being surgically clean. As compared to the engine rooms of my prior boats, which were dark and dirty, required a crouch and didn't permit even viewing access to most of the engines/gears, my current engine room is a joy to behold.
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:25 AM   #149
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Greetings,
Mr. MY. I think you've hit upon one of the reasons for regular ER visits. Ease of access. It's one thing to be able to simply lift a small hatch or even walk into an ER and entirely another to lift large bulky hatches potentially covered by carpets or furniture to have a look-see.

As in your case, our ER is walk in so it's quite easy to do regular inspections, it provides an ongoing benchmark of temperatures and engine/equipment integrity that precludes guessing as to "when did that start leaking?" for example. The big plus IMO is that it gives the Admiral something to do.

I have been following the remote camera thread fairly closely because I'm always a bit nervous when she goes below. Maybe a fall or slip out of my sight?
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:34 AM   #150
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I'm guessing that all the folks with walk in engine rooms and check them while underway have sufficient guards to keep them safely away from moving parts.
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:47 AM   #151
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Greetings,
Mr. WK. One would hope so.

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Old 04-11-2017, 10:55 AM   #152
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It is interesting reading about the different comfort levels some have with regard to engine room checks. That is probably how it should be as I don't think there is an one size fits all answer. There are just too many different types of vessels and levels of experience and types of cruising to put everybody in the same bag.

For me, now over age 70, I have been boating most of my life and also I have over 20 years of military flying in both single and twin engine fixed wing aircraft and single engine helicopters. I always made a good pre-flight and post flight checks, but once airborne I had only instruments to rely on and it served me well. On a plane the failure of an engine or other major system it was a major event with what I consider to be far worse consequences than a similar failure on a boat. So I boat in similar fashion to how I flew. Good checks before and after a day's cruise and then relying on my instruments.

I must admit that twice I have had engine water pump impeller failures and my wife's sense of smell proved to be a much better indicator of an impending problem than the engine temperature gage. I also am admiting that now with the low cost remote cameras it makes sense to have one in the engine room so maybe I am "a changing with the times".
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Old 04-11-2017, 11:02 AM   #153
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I agree. I do like my cameras as I don't go in the hot noisy bilge when running unless something happens. I can sit at the helm and see four different views of the engines by only pushing a button. The one or other Garmin displays the scene for as long as I want. I must admit the cameras make me lazy. 😁
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Old 04-11-2017, 11:19 AM   #154
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One of the reasons we don't have carpets is acess to the engine, fuel selectors ect. Plus if I hear or otherwise sense something wrong I want to see below NOW.
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Old 04-11-2017, 04:06 PM   #155
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One of the reasons we don't have carpets is acess to the engine, fuel selectors ect. Plus if I hear or otherwise sense something wrong I want to see below NOW.


Good point. We do have carpet on the saloon floor. I have 6 access hatches to the ER. 1 is direction over the genset so isn't that useful. One is on the forward end of the engine and is easy to get to and open. However, the others are covered by a rug that I think is a pain to move. This has been a point of contention between my wife and I.

It is quick and easy for me to check the filters and change the tanks, easy to see the front of the engine, where the oil filter, fuel filter, water pump, and sea-strainer are located. The exhaust, air filter, and dripless shaft seal, not so much.
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Old 04-11-2017, 07:22 PM   #156
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Good point. We do have carpet on the saloon floor. I have 6 access hatches to the ER. 1 is direction over the genset so isn't that useful. One is on the forward end of the engine and is easy to get to and open. However, the others are covered by a rug that I think is a pain to move. This has been a point of contention between my wife and I.

It is quick and easy for me to check the filters and change the tanks, easy to see the front of the engine, where the oil filter, fuel filter, water pump, and sea-strainer are located. The exhaust, air filter, and dripless shaft seal, not so much.
I'm lucky in that the two huge, gas-spring assisted easy lift hatch sides [whose leading edges meet together in center of salon sole] are each piano hinged on their outer edges. Although I've not tape measured the opening by length and width... my guestimate is the opening provided by both hatches [with no center beam] amounts to around 6' x 5'. Berber carpet lays uncut over recessed piano hinges and under trim that borders hatch edges. When closed the hinges are non apparent and the hatches other three edges are bordered with carpet trim.

When both are pulled open [and then standing upright] they provide grand expanse over the engines as well as fairly ez access to most other equipment; e.g. batt bank toward aft, two 100 gal tanks to either side and gen set toward bow.

Slotted teak wood walk-way between engines with stand-up room galore.

It is a bit of a stretch to get directly over top of the tranys and can also be same for topping off the rear most wet cells on batts.

There is also room in multiple areas of the engine compartment for relatively ez access to items such as pressure water pump, water heater, trim tab hydraulic pump and its reservoir, batt charger. etc

I've had a few marine professionals get into out Tolly's engine compartment for various reasons. Each mentioned the expansive room and great layout.

MOF... when Linda and I were first aboard this boat [and in a short time of looking we realized this was/is the boat for us] I was standing on the engine compartment's teak walk-way when we winked at one another.

The big, stand-up engine compartment is one of many reasons we own this 1977, 34' Tollycraft tri cabin.
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Old 04-11-2017, 07:48 PM   #157
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And maybe, just maybe, if he'd stayed at the helm, keeping a close eye on his oil pressure and temp gauges, instead of being bum up down below in the ER so much, and lulled into a false sense of security by all the engine checks, he might have picked the leak up soon enough to save the engine from seizing..?
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Would you be of the same opinion if you were the owner of a Nordhavn 50 or 60 cruising from Brisbane to the Seychelles?
Absolutely..! Because it's the gauges which warn of impending disaster that really matters, not a few minor oil drips under the engine, or a bit of water in the bilge.

They tell what, if anything, is really happening to the engine that could hurt, as opposed to something that might. Checking for things that might be important is still good to do, but not every few minutes or even hours. Different when on an across ocean voyage, of course, but even then ER checks need only really be say 6-12 hourly in my book. However, I don't cross oceans...
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Old 04-11-2017, 07:55 PM   #158
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That to me shows inexperience with major engine issues.

The typical gauges usually tell of impending failure moments before, not far in advance that visual signasl could tell.

That is so far from my professional on the water experience I cannot even believe someone believes that gauges are the early warning devices.

And I am not talking drips that have been monitored....heck my engine loses about an ounce or two a day. Not what I am talking about....the sources are known and are not potential larger issues.
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Old 04-11-2017, 08:24 PM   #159
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That smacks of total inexperience with major engine issues. .............
There's not much you can do about "major engine issues" by just looking.

And as somebody mentioned earlier in this thread, you could look everything over and have a hose blow the minute you closed the hatch or door.

Obviously, everyone has their own comfort levels but I believe routine maintenance means that your engine is likely to make it from one anchorage or marina to the next.

We have gauges, we have warning lights and we have our hearing and feel for the boat. For me, that's enough. For someone else, that's their choice. It seems some folks would operate from the engine room if they could.
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Old 04-11-2017, 08:58 PM   #160
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Greetings,
Mr. WK. "There's not much you can do about "major engine issues" by just looking." I'm sorry, I beg to differ. I had a fan belt go at a most inopportune moment early in our ownership. There was a telltale black rubber dust stain on the side of the washing machine which the Admiral had notice but did not know the significance of. IF I had been informed, I could have serviced the belt thus avoiding a butt clenching emergency maneuver on one engine in extremely tight quarters that could have very easily ended up being more serious or fatal.

My BIL purchased a new to him boat a number of years back and had an ER fire while 25 miles off shore. A leaking oil line to the turbo was noted during the survey and was supposed to have been repaired. It wasn't. A quick visual would have spotted that and eliminated his $40K insurance claim. It was his good fortune that he is still alive. As a "new boat" gift, his son had given him 3 fire extinguishers with which he was able to douse the fire.

Anecdotal to be sure but true none the less.
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