Trip line or tie wrap?

[Seevee]

All,

Considering a trip line for those difficult, or impossible anchor raisings.


Another thought is perhaps using a tie wrap, where the chain is secured to the trip line hole on the anchor and the tie wrap holds the chain to the normal anchor hole. If really stuck, just tighten up the line and tie off to the Sampson post, and pull hard enough to break the tie wrap and use the chain to pull up from the trip line hole.



Thoughts?


Choice of line for the trip line?


And what size tie wrap for a ~70# anchor? Don't want to big or small.



+++
Been pretty lucky so far, but have had a few tight calls and just hate to loose a nice anchor.

 

[jgwinks]

Saw an add for a commercial version of this and thought at the time a zip tie would do the same thing. I'd worry that a wind or tide shift would pull the anchor sideways and break the tie. If course these things only happen at 0300 when you're fast asleep. I do have some ties that are 1/4" wide and maybe 1/16" thick, really strong. And wrap it two or three times through the holes? You could test it by securing the anchor on a dock or something and see how hard it is to break the tie. I think you'd want the windlass not to be able break it, have to use engine power to do it. Same as breaking a stuck anchor free. You've got me thinking about trying it too, I've lost a couple of anchors over the years getting them stuck on bottom debris.

 

[jgwinks]

And use the black ones, they last a lot longer in the sun. They're only kind I buy.

 

[boomerang]

I would never sleep well knowing a zip tie was holding us in place. I can't imagine they would withstand a current change. We have a trip line and float that we are going to use when anchoring on questionable bottom terrain when heading South this year. In the past, I really didn't worry about a snag because we had a Delta anchor that need galvanizing and chain that was due to be replaced. Now that we have a new Vulcan anchor, 65' of new 3/8 chain & 200' of new rode, I'm taking precautions!

 

[O C Diver]

I use a trip line in areas where I think I might have a problem. I have a fender float with a pulley attached. On one end of the line is a 2 pound diver's weight. The other end ties to the anchor. The float marks my anchor and the weight takes the slack out of the line. I have 3 lines to cover the range of depths of the water I anchor in.



Ted

 

[Comodave]

Just curious, Ted, how many times have you had to use the trip line to get the anchor up?

 

[O C Diver]

Just curious, Ted, how many times have you had to use the trip line to get the anchor up?

(Knock on wood) I've never needed to use it. I avoid areas with pipe lines, submerged cables, stumps, garbage, and rocky areas. That said, sometimes anchorage A or B doesn't work out and it's time to anchor near bad bottom.

The other nice feature if you're going to be in a crowded anchorage, the float marks your anchor location so that you can point it out to a late arrival. Takes the guess work out of claiming where you think your anchor is.

Kind of amusing when the current reverses, the chain hangs on something, and the float is next to the boat.

Ted

 

[Todd R]

I use a trip line in areas where I think I might have a problem. I have a fender float with a pulley attached. On one end of the line is a 2 pound diver's weight. The other end ties to the anchor. The float marks my anchor and the weight takes the slack out of the line. I have 3 lines to cover the range of depths of the water I anchor in.

View attachment 122752

Ted

Love it. Thank you for sharing. I hadn’t thought about the weight & pulley to allow for different depths.

Todd

 

[AlanT]

Just curious, Ted, how many times have you had to use the trip line to get the anchor up?

My thoughts also.

I have had to dive on my anchor twice in 20 years. Once in the harbor in Paxos where the Spade was wedged under a large concrete block, water depth 35'

The second was an undeveloped harbor on Crete in Rhodes which was known for foul bottom which I discovered later. This time water was less than 20'.

In other words in 20k+ Nautical miles the only two times I would have benefited from a trip line was in situations where I would never have deployed one - in a harbor.

~A

 

[FF]

We use a similar setup to O C Diver , but use a lead sounding weight as it can be used as a sounding weight and have found with a red ball the pulley is not required as the hole in the ball is large enough , and kind to 3/8 line.


Remember the anchor might need a good pull to get it out from under ,and 3/8 should be strong enough .

 

[psneeld]

I have had to cut many anchor lines on boat that called for assistance towing. Don't assume the slip some retrieval device down the rode to backwards extract the anchor will always work.

Me personally?

I vave fouled mabe a half dozen times but always could raise the object enough to free it. Diving on the anchor wasn't always a wise choice and cutting off an anchor seems to be a waste of good money.

So while never needing one, when you could use one, it might be the ticket.

I would use one whenever anchoring in creeks I never have used before, especially in wooded areas like cypress swamps.

It's also is nice there is a float already attached in case you have to slip anchor in an emergency.

 

[Datenight]

I use a trip line in areas where I think I might have a problem. I have a fender float with a pulley attached. On one end of the line is a 2 pound diver's weight. The other end ties to the anchor. The float marks my anchor and the weight takes the slack out of the line. I have 3 lines to cover the range of depths of the water I anchor in.

View attachment 122752

Ted

What a great idea.

Rob

 

[SteveK]

I use a trip line in areas where I think I might have a problem. I have a fender float with a pulley attached. On one end of the line is a 2 pound diver's weight. The other end ties to the anchor. The float marks my anchor and the weight takes the slack out of the line. I have 3 lines to cover the range of depths of the water I anchor in.

View attachment 122752

Ted

Besides local knowledge what presents to make you think to use a trip line?
What conditions are present if local knowledge suggests the use of trip line?

 

[ksanders]

Like others I would never use a tie wrap to secure my anchor.

I have been clocked around enough times in a wind to know that it would never hold except in benign conditions.

Also have never used a trip line, but have driven in circles a couple of times to dislodge a stuck anchor.

That is in decades of setting the anchor, sometimes several times a day fishing.

 

[O C Diver]

Besides local knowledge what presents to make you think to use a trip line?
What conditions are present if local knowledge suggests the use of trip line?

I cruise in a wide range of areas with different anchoring conditions.

If I have to be near the shore and it's heavily wooded, roots, trees, or limbs could be in the water.

An otherwise smooth bottom has contour features where I need to anchor.

In cities where there has been commercial traffic, construction, or decades of manufacturing, you never know what's lurking below the surface of the mud. I anchor behind the Statue of Liberty in New York harbor. Hard to imagine all the stuff lost or dumped overboard through the centuries.

Ted

 

[High Wire]

Ted, on what do you base your trip line length? 2X bottom depth? We tried the trip line on our east coast trip in 2019 and twice woke up with the float caught around the rudder. Once in Oriental NC the float disappeared when backing to check the set and it eventually popped up after pulling it a long long way. That's where we stopped using it. I would like to get back to using it reliably for our upcoming loop.

 

[AusCan]

I certainly wouldn't rely on a zip tie to secure my anchor; although my main anchor doesn't have a trip mode.

Luckily, it is very rare to have an anchor stuck on bottom around here.
Last week I thought it may be hung up, but the the anchor had just dug itself in very deep due to the 30-40 knot winds during the night.

I just shortened up the chain until it was vertical, and let the swell slowly lift the anchor from the depths.

 

[rgano]

Let me tell a story. Anchored in Little Shark river, way up in there on a very windy day with the trees funneling SE wind along the course of the river. For some reason a moderate current UP river kept the boat aligned with bow down river until the tide change when it slacked off a little at which point the wind from astern could push the boat forward on the all chain rode, but the bow remained pointed down river. I had a buoyed trip line on the single anchor and a snubber to the chain with a big loop of chain inboard of the snubber's chain hook. That loop of chain hanging in to the water off the bow scooped up the trip line buoy during one of those wind pushes from astern, and AWAY we went with a now tripped anchor! If I feel the need of a trip line nowadays, I zip tie enough line to the chain to reach the deck as I deploy the anchor. I have never anchored in more than 20 feet of water since moving to NW Florida in 1990, which makes the trip line length a no brained here. I suppose a longer line could be coiled and zip tied at the deck level point. To trip the anchor, just retrieve the chain to get to the trip line and slack the rode before taking a strain on the trip to pull all the zip ties loose from it.

 

[fgarriso]

We were anchored just south of Malborne Florida on the ICW for about thirty days. We have 175 Lb Claw Anchor on 400' of 1/2" chain. It took over an hour to get the anchor broke loose. We should of had a trip line set that time.

 

[SteveK]

We were anchored just south of Malborne Florida on the ICW for about thirty days. We have 175 Lb Claw Anchor on 400' of 1/2" chain. It took over an hour to get the anchor broke loose. We should of had a trip line set that time.

Circling the anchor and pulling in different direction did not free it, Why would a small trip line? Just not convinced.

 

[O C Diver]

Circling the anchor and pulling in different direction did not free it, Why would a small trip line? Just not convinced.

Imo, the trip line comes into play when you hang the point under something and can't move the anchor backwards. I see the trip line being the answer when you have to lift the back of the anchor up, first.

To me, going around in circles (pulling in different directions) is like catching a line on your propeller. Maybe reversing will throw the line off, but probably 95% of the time it only makes it worse.

Ted

 

[SteveK]

Ted. Not trying to talk you out of it. Being the devil's advocate.
I have only read and seen the theory, never had a moment of I wish I tied a trip line. Or the other method of tie strap on the chain where it normally attaches to anchor to snap that free, No to that.

It is the size of rope strength compared to chain which is much stronger and no stretch.

If I were to get hooked in this way I would back away from chain and anchor and in the circle let the boat momentum tug at it every 45* on the circle.

 

[psneeld]

Buried deep in the bottom of dense substrate is different than caught under something...a trip line helps with the second, not necessarily the first.....

Circling does nothing if caught under an object like old cable, heavy chain, etc.....

 

[fgarriso]

No circling did not do it. I should have used a LARGE trip line.

 

[O C Diver]

Let me tell a story. Anchored in Little Shark river, way up in there on a very windy day with the trees funneling SE wind along the course of the river. For some reason a moderate current UP river kept the boat aligned with bow down river until the tide change when it slacked off a little at which point the wind from astern could push the boat forward on the all chain rode, but the bow remained pointed down river. I had a buoyed trip line on the single anchor and a snubber to the chain with a big loop of chain inboard of the snubber's chain hook. That loop of chain hanging in to the water off the bow scooped up the trip line buoy during one of those wind pushes from astern, and AWAY we went with a now tripped anchor!

It's probably just as likely that the chain gets wrapped around the shank of the anchor, pulls it out and tows it backwards.

Last weekend I sat for 2.5 days during the storm. The out flow tidal currents were over 2 knots from the rain. Left the chart plotter on the whole time.



The arc at the bottom is the out flow current combined with NE, N, and NW winds gusting over 30 knots. The ball shape is the inbound current against the wind. The anchor was near the center of the ball. Anchor was buried completely below the surface of the mud. The chain passing over it had no effect. No reason to use a float in this situation as I was probably 400'+ from shore.

As mentioned previously, I generally don't use the float with significant reversing tidal currents.

Ted

 

[O C Diver]

Ted, on what do you base your trip line length? 2X bottom depth? We tried the trip line on our east coast trip in 2019 and twice woke up with the float caught around the rudder. Once in Oriental NC the float disappeared when backing to check the set and it eventually popped up after pulling it a long long way. That's where we stopped using it. I would like to get back to using it reliably for our upcoming loop.

I have a 20' line that gets used from shallow to almost 20'. The second line is 35'. Almost never anchor over 25'.

I would like the weight at half the water depth, but not resting on the bottom. I don't want excess line at the anchor or trailing off the dive weight. In a perfect world, I want the boat drifting backwards where the weight, then float, and finally anchor hit the water.

I almost always put 100' of chain in the water. The bigger you make the radius, the less likely the boat is to come near the float.

My system isn't perfect. I've had the weight hang up in the bottom and the float disappear. I've had the line twist and not unfoul itself. It's never gotten caught in the running gear. It's never tripped the anchor.

Ted

 

[SteveK]

hypothetically, one way may work better than the other.

 

[rwidman]

If you want to have a reasonable expectation of waking up in the same place you went to sleep, you will not use any sort of zip tie or variation. A separate trip line is the only viable alternative.

 

[ABfish]

We use zip ties (3 or 4 ties rated at 75 lbs) on a breakaway rigging for bottom fishing in a 26 ft. boat. I haven't bent an anchor since I started using that system. It works great and rarely breaks unintentionally.

But I couldn't sleep with zip ties on the anchor.

 

[ghost]

Like others I’ve thought about it, but never actually needed it. Closest I’ve come was having to juke around for 45 minutes before I found the magic angle. I figured if I needed to pull from the shank I’d try putting a short circle of chain around the main anchor chain and try pulling it down, but if the anchor is truly caught , it likely might not make it down to the shank.

Twice we have rescued stuck anchors as divers, in both instances it was actually the chain that had gotten fouled, once between a couple rocks, once between some steel poles and we had to cut it out.

I have a spare anchor, just figured I’d cut the main free, mark the location and then decide whether paying a diver to go get it would be cost effective.

I’ve thought about an anchor float many times, more so others would see where my anchor was located and avoid it. I just decided those that fall into the cohort I’m worried about would just as likely see my float and decide to moor to it and I’d wind up tethered to an idiot while drifting.