Twin-engine Albin 36 cutlass bearings

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cdsailor

cdsailor

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I tried posting this in the Albin-specific forum and got nothing. Opening it up to the wider forum since I suspect that this arrangement is not unique to Albin.

Boat is on the hard for winter. Props are off. Contemplating replacing the stuffing box hoses and, well, one job leads to another, so I'm trying to gather as much information as possible.

Any twin-engine Albin 36 (or 40) owners (or other twin-engine owners) out there who have some knowledge of changing cutless bearings? Visibly, I can identify two per shaft - at the strut and a mid-shaft support. Is there another bearing in the stuffing box hose just aft of the stuffing box?

What's the typical process for removing these from this setup? Are there set screws? Simply friction fit? A quick visual inspection suggests that the cutless bearings must be pressed forward out of the struts; it appears there's a collar on the aft end of each strut that prevents them from moving aft out of the strut.

Thanks in advance,
David
 
Your stuffing box has no bearing, you don't mention removing the shafts but it's a good idea though there are tools made to remove the bearing without. If indeed you need new bearings there is probably set screws which you need to remove and then either press the old bearing out or carefully cut it out. A press can be made with a proper size bolt, nut and washers and either short pieces of pipe or sometimes sockets will work. I cut them out with a hacksaw blade by carefully cutting longitudinally through the rubber and almost all the way through the shell, be it brass or fiber. Then you take a pointed tool, I use an old marlinspike, and curl the cut edges inward. Soon it will loosen and you can pull the old one out. Clean the bore well, lubricate with liquid soap and gently tap the new bearing in, dimple for and replace the set screws, done. Your description sounds a bit like "French style bearings" which may require a different approach, another Albin owner can probably answer that.
 
You may or may not have a cutlass bearing as part of your stuffing box, I know mine does. My cutlass bearing carriers have set screws that are safety wired in place. I replaced both the intermediate and aft strut cutlass bearings on my port shaft a few years ago using the cut and twist out methods described above. Wasn't too difficult. Nothing special required. I made an installation tool out of a long piece of threaded rod and a 2 chunks of aluminum. Easy going back in.

Cleaning the bore well and freezing the new bearings before install is very helpful.

Ken
 
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His stuffing boxes have hoses, not much point if there's a bearing.
 
I guess I’ll just have to get in there and find out for myself. For what it’s worth, the stuffing box and shaft log look much like this:
IMG_5800.jpg

Thanks for the input.

David
 
Fish53 said:
His stuffing boxes have hoses, not much point if there's a bearing.
Click to expand...

I thought the hoses were to provide water for the bearing?
 
If mine are the same as the pics, I doubt there’s a third bearing.
 
cdsailor said:
If mine are the same as the pics, I doubt there’s a third bearing.
Click to expand...

Cutlass bearings require water to be lubricated and as such would need to be visible from some point on the water side of the shaft. I very much doubt that your stuffing box has a bearing. If you do pull your shafts it might be a good time to inspect the stuffing box for misalignment wear and a dry, cracking hose. By the way I always use bolt type exhaust clamps on the stuffing box hose, wider and have no slots to cut the hose and can be tightened better. Also with the shafts out you can check for wear and if they're straight.
 
Fish53 said:
Cutlass bearings require water to be lubricated and as such would need to be visible from some point on the water side of the shaft. I very much doubt that your stuffing box has a bearing. If you do pull your shafts it might be a good time to inspect the stuffing box for misalignment wear and a dry, cracking hose. By the way I always use bolt type exhaust clamps on the stuffing box hose, wider and have no slots to cut the hose and can be tightened better. Also with the shafts out you can check for wear and if they're straight.
Click to expand...



Excellent point. I forgot to include that both shaft logs have water injection. So that might mean there’s a bearing in there. Right? Anyway, it’s becoming increasingly clear that there’s only one way to answer this question.

Thanks for the input!

David
 
cdsailor said:
Excellent point. I forgot to include that both shaft logs have water injection. So that might mean there’s a bearing in there. Right? Anyway, it’s becoming increasingly clear that there’s only one way to answer this question.

Thanks for the input!

David
Click to expand...

Does it look like this? If so it's just water cooled, no bearing. It may however be a PYI shaft seal which is a different puppy but still no bearing.packing box.jpg ........note the clamp type.
 
Fish53 said:
Does it look like this? If so it's just water cooled, no bearing. It may however be a PYI shaft seal which is a different puppy but still no bearing.View attachment 83999 ........note the clamp type.
Click to expand...



It does not. The cooling attachment is actually at the shaft log. I’ll try to get a picture of our setup.
 
cdsailor said:
That’s more like it. Bearing?
Click to expand...

As it's a twin you don't have a keel and the shaft just exits the hull at an angle there would be at least one strut as you mention and I assume the intermediate bearing you refer to is simply a shorter strut between the other strut and the point where the shaft enters the hull? If this is true I doubt there's another bearing but I'll try to pull up some pictures of twin engine Albins for a better idea.
 
Albin 40.jpgThis was the best picture I could find, this is a 2008 40' Albin. If it's like this there most likely is only bearings in the struts.
 
Albin 36 twin engine - photo

Here's a pic of Molly's bottom and shaft set up. I can grab a photo of her stuffing box/shaft log tomorrow afternoon, I think. My situation is this: I have a fairly extensive winter worklist as it is - replacing anchor locker bulkhead and Samson post, recoring foredeck, and several smaller tasks. I'm reluctant to get into yet another job, but I would like the peace of mind that we'd get knowing that both shaft log hoses are new. Perhaps I should leave well enough alone. Both hoses are tight - no leakage - and neither shows signs of wear. But...since I already have both props off for replacement...you know how it goes.

Albin36Props.jpg
 
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cdsailor said:
Here's a pic of Molly's bottom and shaft set up. I can grab a photo of her stuffing box/shaft log tomorrow afternoon, I think. My situation is this: I have a fairly extensive winter worklist as it is - replacing anchor locker bulkhead and Samson post, recoring foredeck, and several smaller tasks. I'm reluctant to get into yet another job, but I would like the peace of mind that we'd get knowing that both shaft log hoses are new. Perhaps I should leave well enough alone. Both hoses are tight - no leakage - and neither shows signs of wear. But...since I already have both props off for replacement...you know how it goes.

View attachment 84006
Click to expand...

The biggest question with your drivelines is the condition of the bearings and ultimately the alignment. This will be evident in the bearings, are they worn to the point that the shaft is sloppy like a 1/16" gap in which you can feel the shaft move up and down or side to side? Can you see obvious wear on the shaft were it runs against the bearing, shining is fine but any excessive grooving isn't good and is the shaft obviously off center to the bearing. From the picture I don't believe there's another bearing but where you're changing props it makes sense to pull the shafts for a through inspection and if needed change the bearings, where I live they run about $130 for an inch and a half bearing. After it's all back together it would be good to check the alignment which is covered quite well in other threads. You should also replace the packing which is a cheap and easy job and I assume also covered elsewhere. I've always been fastidious about drivelines, a properly balanced and aligned driveline runs much smoother and requires less maintenance.
 
Pretty sure mine has a bearing at the head of my shaft log.... its a single though and I thought it odd at first. but it needs it looking at the shaft length.

When removing and replacing the shaft., it hits something a few inches back from the stuffing box hose and needs very tiny movements to thread it through....so what else would it be....

It would be around 4 feet to the coupling and 8 or more feet to the cutless at the keel exit end.....

Albin probably thought my shaft was too long witout support, yours might be too. What's the shaft diameter? Distance from the whip strut to the engine?
 
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I pulled the starboard shaft on our Albin 36 and determined the answer to my question. I share it here for anyone else who may one day wonder.

Yes, there is a third bearing located inside the shaft log.

IMG_5825.jpg

Now that I've confirmed that, my next task is to figure out how to remove it. I'll see what I can come up with. If anyone here has wisdom, please feel free to share.

For the sake of other owners out there, the rudder interfered with shaft removal, so I ended up removing the rudder packing gland and worked the rudder up into the boat as high as the blade would allow, which was just enough to allow the shaft to slide aft under it. Then, I got lucky because I was able to pull the shaft free before it angled into the floor. I'd verified this prior using a laser, but that assessment included a little guessing about the overall shaft length. At any rate, it's out and ready to head to the shop.

IMG_5813.jpg
IMG_5815.jpg
IMG_5817.jpg
 
If there's no shoulder for it to index on inside you might get it with a slide hammer. I looked on the Buck Algonquin website and they list an Albin shaft log but no hose.
 
The hose is 3" ID. I think I'll go with the BA heavy-duty stuffing box hose in a 12" length.
 
Just FYI, installing the new bearing will go easier if you throw it in the freezer for a few hours.

I have 6, the two closest to each prop can be done without pulling the shafts, the 4 inboard bearings need the shafts removed.
 
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