Simple (for you) filter change help

[firstbase]

Can someone give me the basics on changing these filters? I know it is a bit messy. Have replacements with new O rings/gaskets.

1) Does the center bolt on top go all the way through to the white knob at the bottom?
2) Is white knob used to open up the filter to drain before changing?
3) The other bolt that is offset on top is to bleed after change is complete, using the lever on the fuel pump. Got that but do I open and bleed them at the same time or one at a time and does it matter which order they are changed?
4) Is there anything unexpected i.e. spring, ball valve, etc. that is going to fall into the bilge when I open this up?


Thanks in advance for any help....first time CAV changer...

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. fb. I thought I covered that quite extensively in this thread (Post #9)...
http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s6/fl-sp135-fuel-filter-question-32172.html
To answer your immediate questions:
1) No
2) Yes. Loosen the associated bleed screw on top to facilitate drainage.
3) One at a time. I usually start on the one closest to the fuel lift pump.
4) Not as far as I'm aware.

Write the date and the engine hours right on the new filter as well as in your maintenance log.

 

[firstbase]

RTF:
Yes, yes you did. Now that I am looking at my picture your instructions make sense. Something confused me yesterday, not sure what. Newb Brain Fart Syndrome (NBFS) I think? Thanks again and thanks for not blowing me off the site due to a case of the Duhs (COTD).

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. fb. Not a problem. The CAV filter change does seem daunting with the potential for numerous contributions to the "cuss jar" but properly prepared it's really pretty straight forward. I should comment, the cleanliness of your engine is outstanding.
Just make sure you have a goodly supply of absorbent pads and paper towels close at hand AND a trash pail/container to dispose of them immediately. Sort of defeats the purpose of sopping up any spillage and then having no place to put the soaked towel short of on deck of your ER.
I anxiously await the report on a successful completion...

 

[firstbase]

One more question on the Lucas 296's. Mine have a green stripe. The ones I see listed online are red. Can't find a green stripe anywhere. I would think that would indicate micron filtering level of each. However, I don't see anything saying which is which?

 

[firstbase]

I should comment, the cleanliness of your engine is outstanding.

Here is the bigger picture...so proud! Please ignore the fact that someone else took care of keeping it clean for the first 29 years of its life. Me the last two months.

 

[Comodave]

Nice looking ER. Wish mine was so clean and spacious.

 

[Lou_tribal]

In case you don't have it yet:
View attachment Diesel Fuel Filter Operators Book (CAV).pdf

L.

 

[firstbase]

Nice looking ER. Wish mine was so clean and spacious.

It is nice and clean and well lit. PO put up LED's around the outside rim of the ER and it is great lighting. I think the spacious you are seeing is a function of the camera lens and not reality. It has some room but still need to be some what of a very bent over monkey to get around and do things.

 

[Comodave]

I love our boat, but access around the engines leaves a lot to be desired. I have lots of wiring to clean up. I would like to clean and paint the bilge, but it is really tight and as I get older, I don't fit as easily as I used to...

 

[koliver]

I know you are 2 months into ownership of this boat, so you may not yet have the answers:
1 do you know when the filters were last changed?
2 Is there also a Racor primary filter on the supply, before the pair on the engine?
3 do you fuel at a clean source?
4 How frequently do you intend to change out your filters?

1 If your PO kept the ER so clean, chances are he also changed the filters on a strict, frequent schedule and recorded those changes in the log.
2 If you have a Racor ahead of the Lucas filters, then you have a 3 stage filtration system. 30, 10, 2 would be my guess.
3 If your home port fuel supply is a high volume supplier, from one of the big guys, chances are god that you are getting very clean fuel
4 All of 1, 2 and 3 will influence the frequency of renewing the filters.

Over the 30 years since your engines were new, the EPA rules have mandated the supply of highway fuel become cleaner burning, going from 5000 ppm to 500 ppm in 1994, then to 15 ppm. Marine fuels became mandated to 500 ppm in 2007 and to the present level of 15 ppm in 2012. This has also resulted in far cleaner fuel, with respect to other contaminants, so your filtering needs have diminished by about the same proportions over that period. So if, in 1987, when your engines were new, fuel contained 5000 ppm sulphur and now contains 15 ppm sulphur, your filters should last proportionately (333 times) longer.

In real terms, in 1994, when my boat was new to me I had to change the Racors so often that I kept a supply of 4 spares on board. I changed the secondaries annually. Since the fuel supply got cleaned up.... I had to change my on engine secondary filters a couple of years ago, as I was experiencing starving of one engine at higher rpm. I checked my log and noted that the last time that filter was changed was 12 years before. The Primary Racors, now go as much as 4 years between changes, but those are glass bowl 500s, so I can see how when they are getting ready for a change. Thank you EPA.

 

[FF]

Interesting theory , but sulphur was removed to "clean" the air , has nothing to do with dirt in the fuel.

Your use of fewer filters over years sounds like more boat use that slowly caught and removed tank gunk.

 

[firstbase]

Thanks koliver. Here is what I know and am trying to address.

1. I have two Racor 500's primaries, switchable not in series, for each engine. They have 30 micron elements and changed every year or as needed.

2. Two on-board filters per engine. They are the Lucas HDF 296's with a green stripe. According to one link I found the red stripe 296's are 5-7 microns. I don't know if the green stripe ones I have are the same. I can find no online reference or picture of green stripe units at all. Owner mentioned changing them and there are two spares on the boat but I don't know how often.

3. PO bought what he thinks was bad fuel in KY while bringing the boat down from Wisconsin last fall. Marina dropped the end-of-the-season-get-rid-of-the-fuel price so much he couldn't resist even though his brain said not to buy. After a blow on Mobile Bay stirred things up he had to change the Racor on the starboard tank. I had the boat filled up, reputable fuel source, when I purchased it. The port tank took more fuel than the starboard. I assume that the PO ran on that tank only when the starboard one showed bad? Now I find the port side Racor filthy. Changed it but it makes me suspect of what got through to the secondary filters on the engine. This is what led me to these questions.

4. With the FL 135's being 30 years old I plan on babying them and would think that annual change of all filters would be good. I can see the Racor 500's so that is easy to monitor. Until I am sure that I have good/clean fuel I will be checking and changing more frequently. Plan on having the fuel and tanks cleaned as soon as I can get the fuel levels below the inspection plate. Never had tanks cleaned/fuel polished but think this is necessary unless I take it to a marina where they can pump out enough diesel to open it up? Not sure.

5. Filtering by 30/10/2 would seem to be a good way to go given what I read. However, it appears I have 30/5-7/5-7 microns. I believe I had read that 2 mics on the old Lehmans is overkill but..how can that hurt? I didn't realize that the two on-board units were in series. Thought they filtered at the same time. That's good to know obviously.

6. If I want to set up the on-board CAV's for 10 and 2 microns....how? I can't find the micron spec on the Delphi/Lucas 296's being sold online. Do they make a 2 micron element to fit? I know there is more to a filter than simple microns but it is beyond my knowledge to decide on a better element at higher mics.

7. Right now the plan is to change all 4 of the secondaries but I only have 2 spares. Need more which again brought me here to discuss where to get them.

8. I also see Delphi 296's listed as HDF296 and 7111 296. Don't know the difference though. Same?

Thanks for the comments and help!

 

[Comodave]

I don't think that you can get the secondaries in 2 micron. I would go with 10 micron primaries. I woild rather change the racors than the on engine filters.

 

[Dan Cahn]

CAV filters

I have replaced mine with spin-on filters, but as I remember the original filter gaskets have a top and bottom. Top of gasket was marked with blue. If you get it wrong, it will leak.

Dan

 

[Comodave]

I have SP225s. Brian said the spin on filters don't fit maybe because of the intercooler.

 

[lowcountry]

Where's the best place to get these 296 filters? Amazon?

 

[Lou_tribal]

I bought my replacements from rockauto, they have the acdelco and wix replacement, not sure for other brands. These can be bought in any parts shop/truck shop and do seem to be common.

L.

 

[RT Firefly]

NAPA has them as well...

 

[lowcountry]

I bought my replacements from rockauto, they have the acdelco and wix replacement, not sure for other brands. These can be bought in any parts shop/truck shop and do seem to be common.

L.

Ordered. Thanks.
They had the wix for about $6 each with shipping. Seems like most other places were $9-11 for the equivalent filter.

I have SP225s. Brian said the spin on filters don't fit maybe because of the intercooler.

Yep. The stock ones on my 225s are hard enough to get on/off with the heat exchanger...Especially on the starboard side.

 

[Dan Cahn]

wix fuel filters

When I still had the old style filters, I complained to Bob Smith at American Diesel about leaking from my filters. He said they have had trouble with Wix fuel filters for the FL. He said he brought it up to Wix to no avail. They are a major manufacturer of filters, supplying many store brands like NAPA. In any case remember to check the direction of the gaskets.

Dan

 

[lowcountry]

When I still had the old style filters, I complained to Bob Smith at American Diesel about leaking from my filters. He said they have had trouble with Wix fuel filters for the FL. He said he brought it up to Wix to no avail. They are a major manufacturer of filters, supplying many store brands like NAPA. In any case remember to check the direction of the gaskets.

Dan

Dammit

 

[firstbase]

I spoke with Brian at American Diesel today. He has the Delphi 296's so I ordered some. He answered some of my questions. The original company Lucas corporate colors were green and white. Delphi's colors are red and white. that is the only reason for the color change/difference. Go figure. Nothing to do with microns or anything else. He did tell me that these filters are deep in paper material and to stay away from the auto shop knock offs such as Wix. They don't have the amount of filter material that the Delphi's have. I have never heard good things about Wix filters for automobiles either.

He also told me that the engine was designed for 30 mic primary and the 5-7 mic secondaries. I have no reason to doubt him but can't think of a bad consequence due to changing the 30 mic primaries to 10 or 20. But...what do I know?!?! I asked what happens to the less than 5-7 micron that get past the filters and he said something about how the fuel pump being oil and not diesel lubed prevented them getting by? Have no idea or understanding of that one...maybe I misunderstood him.

 

[lowcountry]

I spoke with Brian at American Diesel today. He has the Delphi 296's so I ordered some. He answered some of my questions. The original company Lucas corporate colors were green and white. Delphi's colors are red and white. that is the only reason for the color change/difference. Go figure. Nothing to do with microns or anything else. He did tell me that these filters are deep in paper material and to stay away form the auto shop knock offs such as Wix. They don't have the amount of filter material that the Delphi's have. I have never heard good things about Wix filters for automobiles either.

He also told me that the engine was designed for 30 mic primary and the 5-7 mic secondaries. I have no reason to doubt him but can't think of a bad consequence due to changing the 30 mic primaries to 10 or 20. But...what do I know?!?! I asked what happens to the less than 5-7 micron that get past the filters and he said something about how the fuel pump being oil and not diesel lubed prevented them getting by? Have no idea or understanding of that one...

So weird. Until now, I've always heard good things about Wix filters, especially for automotive oil filters...
I know they make NAPA filters, too.

 

[firstbase]

I feel a little bad posting that because it comes from zero experience. Just repeating comments made by others and by Brian. I do know that my engines got this far on the Lucas/Delphi's so I am sticking with them simply because of that. The price was $6.00 or so per filter so that isn't an issue given how often they are changed.

I would like to know if there is any consequence to changing the primaries to 10 mics. Seems to be a common flip for people and one person even said he went to 2 mics on the primaries. Seems like that would solve every worry about things getting through but at the expense of having to change them more often..As stated elsewhere would rather change those more frequently and stay away from the secondary changes. Which I haven't done yet.

 

[firstbase]

I have replaced mine with spin-on filters, but as I remember the original filter gaskets have a top and bottom. Top of gasket was marked with blue. If you get it wrong, it will leak.

Dan

Which is the "top" of a gasket that is up under the unit attached to the engine? I assume "top" means the side laying against the filter which in this case, the gasket up under the top would be down?

 

[what_barnacles]

on a side note/question...

The stbd engine pic looks like it doesnt have a raw water filter on it?

 

[Capt.Bill11]

IMO, **** can the Racor 500s and get 900s.

And personally I'd run 10 or 2 micron elements in them.

As to the CAVs, there is s way to make them self bleeding if you are interested.

 

[Dan Cahn]

CAV filter gasket

blue on top toward the sky....

Dan

 

[firstbase]

on a side note/question...

The stbd engine pic looks like it doesnt have a raw water filter on it?

Huh? Raw water filter on the engine? Here is another pic of the starboard engine. I don't know of any raw water filter on a FL SP135. Strainer yes of course.