Picked up a Fortress Guardian 37 y-day

manyboats said:

I've been looking at Fortress anchors locally and notice that the flukes are very sharp compared to all other Danforths I've seen. In my situation I should probably have one as it would be easier to handle being lighter and would hold in most all conditions. If it didn't set or if I felt it dragging over rocks or if it was going to blow I'd just use another anchor but most of the time anchoring would become a walk in the park. Not night and day but a really big load off my back. Something to consider as well as chain and the appropriate winch. Options Options Options .... Perhaps that's why anchoring is so full of way different opinions, philosophies and practices. Hardly ever is ther'e a post about dragging so everybody seems to be anchoring secure. And my short scope anchoring even worked in a 50+ knot gale. That night I definitely would have been at 7-1 if it hadn't been for the other two boats in the small anchorage. My rode is over 400' long. One nice thing about your ground tackle and methods Marin is that your'e always set for a worst case scenario. Of course I have the option to do the same too ... But I don't or haven't yet.

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Hardly ever might be accurate...but enough people post or have posted about dragging. That's what creates the passion of so many that think their anchoring method/system/tackle is the right one...those that have drug and those who haven't are two very passionate camps...I doubt either is absolutely correct.

Eric-- We've never used our Fortress FX-23 as our main anchor yet although it's sized-- actually a bit oversized by the chart-- to be the boat's main anchor. As a stern anchor it's great because its light weight encourages you to use it.

But on one occasion we were using the Fortress off the stern and the wind switched so we were hanging on the Fortress rather than the mooring buoy. I'd set the Fortress by hand after rowing it out in the dinghy but it never budged even with a pretty good breeze coming from dead astern for a night and part of the next day.

So while we would not switch our Rocna for a Fortress, the Fortress is a great stern anchor/main anchor backup if you size it appropriately.

Marin said:

Eric-- We've never used our Fortress FX-23 as our main anchor yet although it's sized-- actually a bit oversized by the chart.

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this is what most people don't get. Those charts are MINIMUM recommendations. If you are going to just be a day boater and will be awake at all times when anchored or only anchor in protected coves these would be fine, most of the time. I always go atleast 1 size over and really like two steps up if I have the room. and the lightness of the Fortress lines allow this even though this boat doesn't have a windlass.

And Manyboats, yes the "biting" points on the Fortress anchors (FX and Guardian alike) are very sharp. With the mudpalms installed they dig in and bite like no other anchor I've ever used. But they are very unforgiving if you allow those teeth to even gently bump gelcoat or varnish!!

Twisted,
Those numbers are'nt even "minimum". Ther'e just numbers some manufacturer pulled out of his head as far as I know. The numbers may be of help for people that know absolutely nothing about anchoring boats. Many do make an attempt to qualify their numbers by more hypothetical numbers about displacement and wind speed. One would think if an anchor had double the performance of another anchor they could/should/would recommend a size half as large as the "other" anchor but I've seen no evidence of that. I anchored in a 50 knot gale once w a 13lb high performance anchor where a 30 to 40 lb anchor would usually be recommended. I've been trying/doing anchoring w high performance anchors so I could keep anchoring by hand and avoid the cost and weight penalty of winches and big anchors. I've earned a lot but am still not sure what is really necessary. I see here in LaConner lots and lots of boats w pitifully small anchors and I'm quite sure they only have them because somebody told them anchors were a safety item or ... "it came w the boat". A lot of boaters use anchors about as much as their fire extinguishers ... and have them in the same category.
As far as my own anchoring I may have been marginal in Alaska but here in Washington I feel quite well equiped.
The sharp edges on the Fortress are noth'in compared to the saw teeth on the sides of the flukes on an XYZ. See a pic on post #64 on the thread "Bye Bye XYZ". In a survival situation I could use my anchor for a saw.

how much sawing action does an anchor do?

Perhaps...but fortress gives guidelines. below is from their site. Once again, I'd consider this minimum recommendations. Either way manufacturers have to give consumers a guide, and its not in their best interest (if a quality manufacturer) to give bad figures and garner a bad rep as poor quality or function. And my comment about sharpness was about the forward biting points, they are like chisels.

"Boat size recommendations are for boats of average windage and proportions in 30 knots of wind, average bottom conditions, and moderate protection from open seas. Remember that the loads in 42 knots of wind are twice as much as in 30 knots."

how much sawing action does an anchor do?

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Well, if you hung up on a submerged log pehaps you could power your boat all around so the anchor would saw through it and free itself.

I don't carry that much fuel!

Marin said:

Well, if you hung up on a submerged log pehaps you could power your boat all around so the anchor would saw through it and free itself.

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The only log sawing I wanna do at anchor is in my bunk knowing whatever anchor I used...I hope I did it right!

twiisted71 said:

Perhaps...but fortress gives guidelines. below is from their site. Once again, I'd consider this minimum recommendations. Either way manufacturers have to give consumers a guide, and its not in their best interest (if a quality manufacturer) to give bad figures and garner a bad rep as poor quality or function. And my comment about sharpness was about the forward biting points, they are like chisels.

"Boat size recommendations are for boats of average windage and proportions in 30 knots of wind, average bottom conditions, and moderate protection from open seas. Remember that the loads in 42 knots of wind are twice as much as in 30 knots."

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The "recommended" anchor is what the anchor manufacturer recommends for an all around anchor. More than for day tripping and less than would possibly use for crusin". Even then 99 percent of the time I anchor out there's winds less than 30 knots anyway....if more...either I marina up or if I had to anchor...mabe break out a bigger anchor or double anchor or look for a better spot to anchor. So an all around anchor size is certainly a reasonable suggestion and neither requires a minimum or maximum label (unless you attach a bottom type and wind/swell table to it...well then you might as well throw in all the other variables too! )

Nothing wrong with that as no one can really recommend a storm anchor anyhow...too many variables and to do so would be foolish.

I can confirm with twiisted. The fortress or danforth style anchor does not work well with a grassy or weed bottom. We regularly drag and anchor here on Buzzards Bay Mass. Many anchorages with grassy / sea weed bottoms. The fortress is a pain to set. Many are using a plow style anchor.

Obelikx said:

@JAT
after so many years of continouus use (20 that felt even longer ), I wonder whether you ever adjusted the fluke angel of your Fortress
For me, the higher finish compared with the Guardian would not justify the price difference, but higher holding power in mud or very fine sand probably would (actually, this is why I opted for Fortress as a second anchor). I just wonder if you (or someone else) have any real live experiences where changing the fluke angel had an effect.

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I've always had it set to the deepest angle, and always had the mud palms installed. We have a tendency to anchor where there are soft bottoms... So we have it set up for maximum holding.

JAT,
That's interesting. I contemplated that some time ago. How many times have you done that? I wonder what Fortress would think.

They'd probably think JAT was pretty smart for using a feature they'd designed into the anchor that most people are probably too lazy to take advantage of.

manyboats said:

JAT,
That's interesting. I contemplated that some time ago. How many times have you done that? I wonder what Fortress would think.

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Quite a lot of times.... And it works well.

Marin, they would think JAT was a rebel like me for not using the anchor as it was designed to be used. I have seen other Danforth anchors that that have a wider throat angle w no options but they are heavier anchors. I think JAT would be slightly better off using the Fortress as it is intended but as I said who am I to say. JAT is a favorite here for me and I'd rather not be as critical as usual either.

manyboats said:

I think JAT would be slightly better off using the Fortress as it is intended but as I said who am I to say. JAT is a favorite here for me and I'd rather not be as critical as usual either.

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As intended? Fortress designed the anchor so the flukes can be set in two different positions. They wouldn't have done that if they hadn't intended the buyer to use it both ways if they wanted to. So it seems to me JAT is using his Fortress exactly as the manufacturer intended.

The guys using their Bruce's to grapple for landscape rocks are not using their anchors as intended.

Marin,
Fortress does say to use the larger throat angle for very soft bottoms. I read that more realistically to mean to use the smaller throat angle for all other bottoms. How can it otherwise be taken?

And yes JAT if you can set it hard it will hold better than any other anchor of it's weight on earth. I think that's safe to say even w Marin lurking about in the shadows.

From all the anchor tests I've looked at--- and yes, I know anchor tests can be skewed but if you look at enough of them they do indicate some basic trends--- the Danforth/Fortress anchors are almost always at the top in terms of holding power in the bottoms they are suited for, which are mainly sand and mud.

So Eric will get no argument from me with regards to the holding power potential of the Fortress. That and its low weight are the two reasons we chose an FX23 to be the stern anchor/backup main anchor for our boat.

I've anchored for years with a Fortress FX-23 on various boats, including my current Krogen 42 in soft mud on the Gulf coast. I've always used the standard fluke angle, not the more open one and never had a problem. I've had 6 boats rafted up to me in Offatt's bayou in Galveston on this anchor in a sustained 15 knot wind with no movement. All chain rode, 4:1 scope. Can't say enough good about it! I've never had a need for the extended angle.

4-1 kept us in place in a 50+ knot gale w only a short length of chain. Never had a Fortress but have anchored w a steel Danforths many times at 3-1 including once w 35 knot winds. All the Danforths that are good seem to hold well at short scope. Keith, how does the Fortress do wind or current reversal?

Never had a problem. I have sharpened the tips, but then we hardly ever see grass or seaweed on the bottoms around here.

"The fortress or danforth style anchor does not work well with a grassy or weed bottom."
" Many are using a plow style anchor."

The use of the proper anchor for each location is vastly easier if there are 2 different styles ready on the bow rollers .

Easy to spot the dock side condos from the cruisers , with a glance at the anchor handling setup.

FF said:

"The fortress or danforth style anchor does not work well with a grassy or weed bottom."
" Many are using a plow style anchor."
The use of the proper anchor for each location is vastly easier if there are 2 different styles ready on the bow rollers .
Easy to spot the dock side condos from the cruisers , with a glance at the anchor handling setup.

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Or, as Marin said, you could use a multi-substrate capable type like the Rocna or Sarca, which work well on virtually any bottom, obviating the need for multi-roller set-ups...

"you could use a multi-substrate capable type like the Rocna or Sarca, which work well on virtually any bottom, obviating the need for multi-roller set-ups..."

If you believe their advertising ,

In playing "YOU BET YOUR BOAT",

I prefer tried and true to advert HYPE.

But then I use 2 anchors most nights too.

I/we don't have to believe their advertising FF, Marin and I actually use these things, so we know. Much different from just believing advertising. Speaking for myself, I have never had to put out two anchors - not on any night no matter how nasty.

If one reads the user reviews from the people who use these anchors all the time under pretty challenging conditions it becomes very obvious how good these anchors are. A DC-3 was a great plane in its day, too, but if I actually want to go somewhere I'll take a 777.

Marin if your listening to user reviews just listen to Peter about the SARCA and go buy one. He gives it high marks. Like you give Rocna. In the stratosphere!0

Anybody know anything about the Quick Line Anchor?

FF prolly uses 2 Ankers the way they should be used.

I'm decommissioning Willy and hauling her out till March or so. No time w all this move stuff going on.

Marin don't knock the DC-3. They are better looking than any boing ever built. That smokes.

Eric-- If you already have a Rolls Royce it makes no sense to buy a Cadillac.

Marin don't knock the DC-3. They are better looking than any boing ever built. That smokes.

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Ever seen a Boeing 247? First all-metal commercial transport in the US and the design that inspired the Douglas DC-1.

Two friends with sailing yachts have Super Sarcas, both report consistently fast sets and good holding, well exceeding the CQRs replaced. I just bought one at the Sydney BoatShow,a No.6,22kg.My CQR, which performs quite well,will become back up. As with many things, there have been significant advances in design in the last 30 years. BruceK