49 GB vs 47 GB

Hi, I will just get to it here: I have been boating for 45 years in various sport fishing boats, but now at 66 my wife and I would like to make the journey about the trip itself and not so much the destination. With that said we are considering a 1985 49' GB," FIVE STAR" and a 2007 47' GB, "CHANGES". we live in Destin,Fl. so our trips will start with the first 250 NM with pretty much a beam sea. My wife has had lower abdominal surgery so the ride is important, although she is in good health now. I have no info on the ride of the 47 as I am aware it has a redesigned hull. so 17 knots cruise is available when needed whereas the 49 is 9 to 11 knots. I am hoping to get some good information from owners instead of brokers. I would greatly appreciate any advise and suggestions. Thanks

Without stabilizers, a beam sea of any consequence (3-4'+) will be no fun. I had the (dis)pleasure of transporting a 49' Defever through about 24 hrs of this a couple of yrs ago. It had been a livaboard for 8 straight yrs and the owner hadn't really readied the salon for the trip! I caught 3 steep close 4'ers full on the beam when rounding a point, things got "rearranged" to say the least, and the ride in the pilothouse even made my wife's eyes get big. I wouldn't have wanted to be on the flybridge. This boat had no stabilizers of any sort though. I was really surprised at how violently it responded to such waves for such a heavy boat. However, the intracoastal is pretty nice up in your neck of the woods. The only really open water you'd have to take into acct is from Carrabelle to Clearwater.

If you can afford the fuel though the 47 at planing speed would certainly ride better as it would have more inertia with which to resist the waves' forces.

excellent point that I had not considered. Your one response has given me, in my opinion, the best most concise info that will play a major part in my choice. I have an extreme amount of knowledge flying 747-800 and go fast fishing vessels but nothing at all about trawlers. Again thank you for your help.

747-800? I didn't know we made one of those. 747-8, yes, but there are only a handful of them in service so far. Do we have a secret factory building a secret plane somewhere that I don't know about?

Marin,
Go on Google and search 747-800 and plenty of images come up.
One with Lufthansa that I saw.
I just looked as i saw this plane mentioned in a mag just recently.

Tidahapah said:

Marin,
Go on Google and search 747-800 and plenty of images come up.
One with Lufthansa that I saw.
I just looked as i saw this plane mentioned in a mag just recently.

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There is no such thing as a 747-800. The actual name of the passenger version of the plane is the 747-8 Intercontinental. The freighter's name is simply 747-8F.

There have only been six versions of the 747-- 747-100, 747-200, 747SP, 747-300, 747-400, and the current model, 747-8. It's called the -8 because Asia is seen as a major market for the plane and the number 8 has very positive connotations in Asian cultures. Same reason our first 787 model is also a -8 .

Members of the public and even the more ignorant in the media are calling the 747-8 the "800" because they are used to Boeing planes having a "hundred" number to denote the variant. That's why you got all the Google hits. But they are wrong.

747 800

Merin google is not the bible. FYI I flew the 800 model as it was know in our test flight program. After I retired from the airline industry I joined the 800 program to accelerate their program as more high time pilots were needed to continue their testing program in order to start delivery's of same. 747-8I and 747-8F as you are aware are now flying the sky's. ALSO for your info I flew with the crew from Frankfurt to Washington on June 1st as a training pilot for the crew of the first passenger flight made. I did not know that at 67 years old and over 50 years of flying I would be taken to task this way by the smart tone used in your first response. I think I will stay within my peers of well trained and disciplined aviators. And they are known as 800's by all in the aviation community. I accept I am a newby in your world as you are in mine.

LOL. I go through some of the same stuff on some of the Cummins forums I am a member of. Common terms used by people who use and develop products are called "wrong" when that is what should be correct as its what the people who use and know it best call it!

afc said:

Merin google is not the bible. FYI I flew the 800 model as it was know in our test flight program.

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I have worked for Boeing for over 30 years. I help market our planes to our customers as well as support all the company's operations. My organization has supported the 747-8 program since its inception, from design work through flight testing and delivery. We work with the pilots, including the first chief 747-8 pilot, Mark Feuerstein. I have never heard the 747-8 referred to as an "800" by anyone here at Boeing. Ever.

Lufthansa may call the plane the "800" but that's their own term, it's not what we call it. At Boeing, the plane is called the "Dash-8."

So when I saw your post I figured you mistyped and that what you really fly is a 737-800, which is an accurate name for one of our models.

About 20 years ago I ran a Grand Banks 49 from Florida to Maine and back. No stabilzers, we just picked our times to be offshore. I have sold numerous 49s since then and a few had stabilzers, they make a gret difference in the comfort of the boat which is a hard chine design. The hard chine makes the roll fast and short as opposed to a soft chine which will normally be slower and longer. If you can find a 49 with stabilzers it will be more comfortable and worth the extra expense to care for.
The 47 was designed to be a faster boat and often the faster a boat is the less you need stabilizers.

I have not flown the 737-800 and I certainly appreciate your interest in my knowledge as you were or are their for such a period of time, however their were several of us that did refer to her as simply the 800 as I was only there to observe for an airline that hired me to do so, that being said I have over 23,000 hours flying Boeing's of which at least half of that was in 747's, started in the Douglas 8 super 60's a very noisy and smoking plane but handled very well, just had to watch the flare and not hit the tail. I and am not here to debate you but with all due respect my intent was merely to try cracking the ice as it were, it seems foolish to challenge such a minor point among two professionals, and with that I say a due. AS a side note and the reason I became involved on this site I would like to thank those points of info that all have given it has helped. If indeed we enjoy our 49' adventure I am positive we will look at the Fleming 55 as our choice IF we can slow to the speed of a trawler for which the 49'GB is a great place to start. thanks all.

Hope you'll reconsider, afc. I'm pretty new here myself, but this forum has a lot of great folks willing to share priceless information. Like any forum, some people feel compelled to lecture and pontificate, or they forget that the internet is the world's worst place for irony. (I'm guilty myself, sometimes.)

Stick around. I don't think you'll regret it.

Angus99 I appreciate your message and thank you for your remarks. I made myself a promise that I would not get involved with any negative issue's from now until my day comes to make that last sail to the sky. Had too much of that within the airline industry, ( I hope I said that right ) lol anyway I will stay. I have had several good tips from those that are truly here to share their knowledge and friendship and for that I am grateful.

afc--- The reason I was interested in your use of the term "800" to describe the 747-8 is that your post aroused my curiosity so I called the BCA marketing brand manager for the 747-8 and asked him if he'd ever heard of the plane being called this. He answered that not only had he never heard this term used for the plane but that he was extremely pissed off that someone was doing so on a public forum and wanted to know who, what airline, etc. because that is not a designation of the plane the company wants used. By anyone, apparently, even the airlines who have purchased the plane.

Hence my interest in your use of the term.

The Fleming 55 is our favorite boat, too, and may be in our not-too-distant future. Good luck with your decision and search.

Cheers,

Marin I did not at any time work for Boeing nor honestly do I care if they do or do not care about what anyone calls their airplane's ( how arrogant ) this is America. By the way where would they be if pilots did not fly the planes.... That being said, and I am sure you have heard this among pilots before...."if it ain't Boeing I ain't going" a phrase that has come out to respond to the degeneration of the pilots command of the airplane as in Air France flight 447.All that being said I understand your defense of the company that you spent so much of your life at, ir=f I were you I would have felt somewhat the way you did. So let's put this in the deep 6 and move beyond it. I have had a great conversation with Jon Bullock at Burr Yacht Sales in Maryland and I would highly recommend him as a starting point. although I see you are on the west coast. We are trying to decide on GB49' "FIVE STAR" to try out slow cruising or to go straight to the 55' Fleming. May the winds aloft always be on your tail and on your nose when low....have a good week Marin

AFC one other "suggestion". If you are considering just owning the 49 for a short time as a learner, you may want to look into doing some charters a couple of weeks long each. yes they are a little expensive but you won't be stuck with a boat you no longer want and you won't have to worry about what the "market" is doing affecting your resale. Plus you can try out different boats and really narrow down what you and the missus both like and dislike.

Great idea Twisted. I am planning to donate it too a church youth group to get them into what cruising is all about not to mention life lessons an responsibility. That way I will really confuse the big guy in the sky lol

I can pretty much assure you that if you donate a boat of that size to any charity they are going to sell it not use it. Too much liability and responsibility. They'd be better off getting a handful of Lasers or Hobies. Your sentiment is in the right place but......
There is however, a BoyScout camp in the Lower Keys that does what you have in mind but with smaller boats, something for you to look into if you are feeling altruistic, and want to spread your passion for boating.

twiisted71 said:

I can pretty much assure you that if you donate a boat of that size to any charity they are going to sell it not use it. Too much liability and responsibility. They'd be better off getting a handful of Lasers or Hobies. Your sentiment is in the right place but......
There is however, a BoyScout camp in the Lower Keys that does what you have in mind but with smaller boats, something for you to look into if you are feeling altruistic, and want to spread your passion for boating.

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The group I have in mind is headed up by a seasoned captain that is in need of a more reliable boat. He would keep it as would the church but tks for the heads up and I will ck now to get reassured that all u brought up would be handled. I am not going to let insurance companies and attorneys stop me from trying. I will let u know what I find out. Tks again for the heads up

There is no need to debate your professional abilities on this forum and I am disappointed to see it going on- totally unnecessary and 100% off topic.

AFC, welcome to the forums and you are looking at 2 very nice boats. I agree stabilized would be best but with the increased speed of the 47 that need goes away. It boils down to how you want to cruise.

Based on what I know about both models I would not even bother with the GB and would go straight to the Fleming. You don't need the GB49 as a "learner." A GB32 or 36 maybe, but if you're willing to start out at 49' another 6 feet isn't going to make any difference. We know a few couples who have Flemings and they have no problems running the boat by themselves. The GB is a very nice boat, but it's a Honda Accord compared to the far superior Fleming.

Marin the reason that I even considered the GB first is not the handling as I have had larger sport fishing boats over the 30 years I have boated but because of my wife and her acceptance of that life style and her abdominal surgeries, but thanks for the input.

afc said:

.....but because of my wife and her acceptance of that life style and her abdominal surgeries, but thanks for the input.

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The idea being that if she doesn't take to it you're into the GB for much less than the Fleming? If so that seems a sensible approach.

you got it Marin. It is a lot of $$$$ for any 55' Fleming. A 2009 model is about the best I can do and that is only because they improve each one they build so the 2001 model vs the 2009 model is about 100 plus changes which some are not ones you could transfer to the 2001 model, but, there is about a 650 price diff. It is like buying an airplane, if you could find one that serves 80% of your needs get it. So with that much on the line I want to make absolutely sure that Wanda is going to like it, you know that's a lot cheaper than a divorce. lol

afc--- There was an earlier suggestion to pehaps charter a GB for a week or two to see if your wife liked the whole cruising thing. While I know you are on the other side of the country, if you have jump seat or discount priviledges on any transcontinental airlines (if they still do that sort of thing) or if you are simply willing to buy a couple of tickets, there is a GB charter outfit in Bellingham that has a full fleet from GB36s on up through GB52s. I think--- but am not positive--- that the fleet currently contains a GB49. I believe they also have a GB47 in the charter fleet.

If you are not already familiar with them the company is Northwest Explorations and their website is NW Explorations | Yacht Sales, Charters & Services in the Pacific NW I have no direct connection with them but their lead broker, Scott Blake, was the broker (same company, different name) who found our boat for us back in 1998. We charted a GB36 from them before buying our own.

Their charter boats are immaculate and professionally maintained. In addition to charters in the local and lower BC waters they also have what they call "Mother Goose" charters. Several of their boats make a round trip in the summer to SE Alaksa, and people can charter for one, two, or all three of the legs. First leg is taking the boat up, second leg is cruising in SE Alaska, third leg is bringing the boat back.

Thanks Marin I would like to run something past you. I have been contacted by an old broker friend about a 64' Aleutian 2002 model "BIGG BLUE" priced the same as the 2009 55' fleming. Any thoughts?

As much as I'd like to come across all knowledgable and stuff, I know virtually nothing about the Aleutian models other than they're big and expensive. I believe there is a fellow in Europe on the IAGBO GB owners forum who has one. I think his username is Vikendios or something like that. if you've joined that forum you might want to try to contact him--- there is a private message function on that forum similar to the one here.

I'm kind of a believer in buying the smallest boat I can afford, a philosophy that's been discussed here before on the "I'm new to this" threads. The smaller the boat, the better condition or newer (or both) it will be. You don't want a boat too small for what you want to do, of course.

So our preference is still for the Fleming 55. I knew what you were talking about when you described the improvements Tony Fleming makes to hiis boats on a continuing basis even within the same model line which makes a newer one "better" than an older one. But the older ones are pretty darn nice, at least from where I sit.

But for us, unless we really needed a big boat like a 64' Aleutian, I think we would go for the five year younger Fleming 55. Not that five years makes a major difference in a boat's condition, but 55' is going to be less costly to moor, insure, perhaps feed, and so on.

I have no idea how the boats compare in terms of getting around on and in them. But depending on one's health and physical condition, the differences might be a consideration.

afc-- I just checked the GB owners forum and the member in Europe with an Aleutian does, in fact, have the user name Vikendios. He has an Aleutian 53 RP. Don't know the year.

Marin, first let me be the first to say I might have come across rather sharp when you were merely making a joke as to the correct Boeing ID of the new 747-8I or F. Then i guess I became protective of my description of same. I am sure you know how tiered the pilot world is. Now I have sense your last post had a rather closer look at the 2002 Aleutian 64' and even though the price of "BIGG BLUE" is the same as a used 2009 Fleming 55' it does seem to large for my wife's comfort level as well as our budget is more in the 9 to 1.2 range. I do realize that I am at the diaper stage of understanding all the benefits of cruising instead of fishing Boats. A little past history: 1 - 30' Chris-craft in 1976, a Bertram 33' in 1979, a Bertram 37 in 1981, a Hatteras 42' in 1984, then a change in direction as I traded in 1970's wood hull 32' GB and used her for 3 months before I sold her and even made $$ trade in value 50k sold for 72k myself and loved that little boat but the kids were getting in their teenage years, so I tinkered with the idea then to get a 42' GB as my life as a pilot gave me several days off at a time, but alas I went back into a 54' viking and used it for cruising when we had the time. sold her in 1993. Now boat-less til now, kids 38 and 40. My wife and I are just glad at this point that we are able to even afford to do this, I guess I have to thank Steve Jobs for that as I put all my investments in apple stock at 51 and some change in 06 and sold in April for 601 a share. This one thing I did is going to allow us to have a secure retirement with a nice yacht to boot, so I really did get lucky, finally. I saw a tombstone over the net and it said; I LEAVE THIS WORLD WITH 4 PIECES OF ADVICE FOR A HAPPY LIFE, 1. GET A WOMEN THAT CAN COOK, 2. GET A WOMEN THAT CAN CLEAN, 3. GET A WOMEN TO KEEP YOU WARM AND SATISFY YOUR NEEDS, AND 4. DO NOT LET THEM ALL MEET OR YOU WILL END UP LIKE ME.

I have no vested interest in what boat you choose, but thought I'd throw one more outcome at your equation. When we were looking at larger boats for a livaboard we looked at GBs, Defevers, Atlantic, old Vikings, Bertrams, etc. (admittedly we didn't ever go see a Fleming). But we kept coming back to or comparing to Kadey Krogens. Neither of us could pinpoint why but in the back of our minds my wife and I both had determined that had the best overall package for us (though she did REALLY like the 44' Defever???go figure). Anyway there are several here in FL very well equipped and well within your stated range. Here is just one example.

Kadey-Krogen Yachts (Stuart, FL)