Engine room lites? LED?

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Duvie said:
As mentioned previously heat is the killer of LEDs .
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The real killer of LEDs is too much current and too much current is caused by too much voltage, even for a split second.

The cheap way to control current through an LED is with a series resistor, but there are problems with that approach. For one thing, it is inefficient because power is dissipated in the resistor.

The real problem is, that on a boat, wired to the boat's 12 volt (nominal) electrical system, there can be variations in the actual voltage from under 12 volts to possibly 14 volts or more and short duration spikes of much more than that. If a dropping resistor is calculated for 14 volts, the light output will be less at 12 volts. If it is calculated for 12 volts, the LEDs will have a much shorter life.

A better way is with a voltage regulating circuit, but the best way is with a constant current "driver" circuit. This assures the optimum current flowing through the LEDs regardless of variations in the incoming voltage.

When you see in the specifications that a particular product is suitable 9 -30 volts or similar, you are buying a product with a constant current driver. These are the ones you want.

One more "tidbit" - These driver circuits will sometimes produce RF interferance that may or may not be a problem. I installed two LED replacement lamps in my berth area and was watching TV. I turned one of the lamps on and the TV signal froze. Turned the lamp off and the signal came back. Only on channel seven.

I had to install RF filters in the lamps to get my channel 7 TV back. It didn't bother the other channels.
 
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Great thread! I've learned more about the downside of LED's here than ever before. For a layman like me with little practical knowledge of electrical, LED's where supposed to be as good an innovation as sliced bread.

Seems a bit more complex once you look beyond the power usage ratings on the packaging. Thanks for the free education.
 
CPseudonym said:
Great thread! I've learned more about the downside of LED's here than ever before. For a layman like me with little practical knowledge of electrical, LED's where supposed to be as good an innovation as sliced bread.

Seems a bit more complex once you look beyond the power usage ratings on the packaging. Thanks for the free education.
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They are as good as sliced bread and you will be seeing more and more of them as the US Government continues to tell its citizens what they may and may not purchase with their hard earned money. :nonono:

What's important is, LEDs are LEDs. When we buy a lighting fixture containing LEDs for our boats, it's important to buy one that is designed correctly for boat lighting and not "cheap out" on something manufactured to a low price.
 
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FP; The issue I have when doing my underway ER checks thru the companionway door is that the light throws a shadow as you pass under it; now you can't see squat. My solution was to place some of the large 9v handheld lights in the recess by the seastrainer(s). Other option that works well is to come in from the lazarette end; better light, more air, less hot parts to tangle with. Aft light reveals a bit more w/o shadow. Fwd light then shows well at front of engine. 34LRC ER is not well set up for fixed lighting while underway.
 
2 seasons ago I installed 2 G-4 "warm" LED conversion units in the dome light above our dinette, which had a "1 on, off, both on" configuration. The two together were fine for dinner and reading afterwards, and I liked the .2A draw instead of 3.5A.
I just received some conversion units from Dr. LED but have yet to put them in the fixtures, I'll comment on them after I do.
 
rwidman said:
When you see in the specifications that a particular product is suitable 9 -30 volts or similar, you are buying a product with a constant current driver. These are the ones you want.
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And I'm guessing that's why most (all?) of the lights I see on superbrightleds.com have the disclaimer "NOT SUITABLE FOR AUTOMOBILE APPLICATIONS".
 
rwidman said:
...LED Lamps...The driver is in the base.
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Yes, but - in this thread - folks seem to be using the "light bars" (which do have the disclaimer) rather than the auto / marine / RV "lamps".
 
refugio said:
Yes, but - in this thread - folks seem to be using the "light bars" (which do have the disclaimer) rather than the auto / marine / RV "lamps".
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Some maybe...but I use the LED light strings that are fully encapsulated and not at all a risk for fire, and have a range of DCV to work with. I have had my LED's on and set my charger to equalize....and have yet to have an LED failure, period. Don't overcomplicate the issue....OK?:banghead:
 
JAT said:
Some maybe...but I use the LED light strings that are fully encapsulated and not at all a risk for fire, and have a range of DCV to work with. I have had my LED's on and set my charger to equalize....and have yet to have an LED failure, period. Don't overcomplicate the issue....OK?:banghead:
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Do you use the whole string in each application or have you cut them as appropriate?
 
psneeld said:
Do you use the whole string in each application or have you cut them as appropriate?
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Frankly, because of the areas I install them, and the way I use them...the entire string of LED's is used. I haven't yet tried to cut one down.

I used about 4 or 5 of the 39" strings to light the countertops and stove in our galley.... The Admiral loves it. I have also used about 5 of them in my engine room...and they are great, and I expect to install another 5 or 6 down there. I also put three of them in my battery/generator compartment. They eliminate the need for flashlights to check the acid levels in the batteries.
 
JAT said:
Frankly, because of the areas I install them, and the way I use them...the entire string of LED's is used. I haven't yet tried to cut one down.

I used about 4 or 5 of the 39" strings to light the countertops and stove in our galley.... The Admiral loves it. I have also used about 5 of them in my engine room...and they are great, and I expect to install another 5 or 6 down there. I also put three of them in my battery/generator compartment. They eliminate the need for flashlights to check the acid levels in the batteries.
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Thank you!
 
One of my POs installed 240V AC fluorescent lights X 4 in the ER space to supplement/replace the poor 12V dome light incandescent globes X 2. They are so good but the Genset has to be rumbling away whilst they are on. Too inconvenient and too loud. Recently I had 12V LED strip lights installed because I didnt want to run the genset every time I entered the ER. They are just as bright and so convenient. The danger is I forget to turn them off. Whilst I have warm white LEDs in the salon cool whites are brighter for the same voltage and are just great for an ER environment. I thoroughly recommend the change to LED lights.
 
We have a set of 12 VDC incandescent lights in the engine compartment and a set of 120 volt lights in safety fixtures. The 120 V lights are run through the inverter. Flip that switch on and it really provides a great deal of light.

As for entering your engine compartment while underway. Have you considered installing a small remote camera. We purchased a surveillance camera set that I intend to install at least one of the four cameras it came with in the engine room. That way I can take a look any time I wish. The set up came with four camera, a DVR recorder and all the wiring. The cameras have motion sensors so they are great for keeping an eye on the exterior of your boat and they are good for night vision as well.
My ultimate plan is to place one or two in the engine compartment, one will be placed to see the stern and the other to monitor the cockpit for entry protection. At least that is what I plan at this time.
The whole thing cost me $99 on Woot. It did not come with the harddrive for recording but got a 1T DVD harddrive from Ebay for $109 (including shipping). Which installs in the DVR case so no extra things to find a place for.
 
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Light failures

fryedaze said:
The 24" bars are enclosed , LF-WW48SMD-DI: High Power LED Light Fixture with Switch. They can be wired right into your 12 vdc system. I used the old lite supply leads. You cannot remove the switch. It is some how part of the power conditioning.

The rigid LED strips I put into the fluorescent housing were these RLBN-NW30X3SMDNatural WhiteRLBN-NW30X3SMDNatural White5600K20.1 lm342 lm/ft603 lm52019.95RLBN-x30SMD. They can be cut in three inch sections to fit the housings. These wire right into the 12 vdc without any power supplies. Dont forget to by the connectors you need for these.

Dave
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UPDATE
I installed five 24" LED light bars in Oct 2011. Three have failed. I have sent message to SuperbrightLED to find out what's up. They have a 2 year warranty. The model is discontinued. More to come. :facepalm:
 
My cheap lights from Ikea have been working well for about 3+ years. Four of them are in the engine compartment and bright enough for the most finicky work. That they swivel a bit is a bonus.
 
Here are the facts:

The only way to determine how much light you will get is to look at lumens. If you want more light than you have now, you need more lumens.

If you want efficiency, you want to look at lumens per watt. LED's typically will offer low wattage, your task is to weed out the junk and find the higher lumens per watt.

Cool White, Warm White, all refer to color temperature. Typically an incandescent lamp is in the range of 2700K. This is considered warm. LED's can range from 2300K to 5000+K. On the 5000K end, the light is very white almost blue (no red in the spectrum) this can give the appearance of giving more light but remember it is all in the lumens.

The LED emitters, generally will have a lifespan of 50-100,000 hours. Compare that to an incandescent of 650 or so hours and you will see the economics. The failure point is in the drivers, some are junk and you don't know what their life is.

Third party evaluations (Energy Star) for replacement lamps, and (DLC) for LED Fixtures, tend to keep the manufacturers honest in their reported life claims backed up by strict testing.

The problem we have in the marine industry, is that the products that have the most flexibility in mounting and design, are not necessarily backed up by any third party testing results so it is buyer beware....

John
 
fryedaze said:
UPDATE
I installed five 24" LED light bars in Oct 2011. Three have failed. I have sent message to SuperbrightLED to find out what's up. They have a 2 year warranty. The model is discontinued. More to come. :facepalm:
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The units had a two year warranty and Superbright replace them free of charge.
 
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