DSC, do you use it

Matt, I understand the cell phone thing and I too would use ti IF I had coverage.

I am sure there are many boaters on this Forum that are in the same situation I am.

Boat US does not have service in Alaska. Even in the pan handle where most of you lower 48'ers come up to visit.

To me it is just plain silly not to have every option at your disposal when it comes to being on the ocean.

People die at sea all the time albeit more commercial than pleasure.

If you are out on the water it is always SAFTY FIRST.

DSC another tool Just like a life vest.
You don't need it till you need it.

SD

alormaria said:

I work in a warehouse run by the Chinese. You really don't want to use anything put together by them......

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Like a Boeing or Airbus airplane?

mattkab said:

I'm not arguing against your point, nor the red button, SD.


In an "emergency" (Pan pan) I personally would probably dial 911 first, or a combination of the RED BUTTON and the cell phone.

In a "problem" (Securite) situation, I would resort directly to the cell phone.

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911? And get what, the local police/fire/ambulance dispatchers? What the hell good is that going to do if you're broke down and the current is carrying you toward the rocks?

In the time it takes to get the 911 operator to even figure out what you're talking about and determine that, no, you don't need a policeman, no, you don't need a fire truck, and no, you don't need an ambulance, and what's the nature of you're emergency again? and you're where? and you're in what? and then explain why they can't get a policemen or fire truck or ambulance to you you'll probably be on the rocks. If you're lucky they'll eventually transfer you to the Coast Guard's main switchboard or something.

Calling 911 for a marine emergency is about as pointless an exercise as I can think of.

911 is a land based service. The call is routed to 911 by your area code. How does that help you if you are out on the water? So you call 911 and then what? They have to transfer your call to the CG. The CG rescue service is set up to use the VHF, not the phone.

I think that the reason many VHF DSC radios are not set up is that the connection from VHF to GPS is not standard. The wiring color codes are not standard, and there is no connector provided. The industry needs to get it together and provide a dedicated connector on both the VHF and the GPS to enable the DSC functions. Then its a plug and play system. For VHF and GPS that are not side by side, an extension cable should be available. Having the interconnection become a do it yourself project is nuts.

alormaria said:

We no longer have the space shuttle program. The older satellites are well past their 'sell by' dates. We can't go up and fix them anymore and must rely on other countries (China??) to put new ones up.

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That's silly. GPS satellites weren't sent up by the Space Shuttle and the Space Shuttle people didn't fix them when they broke. We simply send up another one. They are a "disposable" item. I work for one of the companies that does this (Boeing) and we have sent up plenty of new GPS satellites over the years. The Space Shuttle had nothing to do with the GPS system satellites whatsoever.

Larry H said:

I think that the reason many VHF DSC radios are not set up is that the connection from VHF to GPS is not standard. The wiring color codes are not standard, and there is no connector provided. The industry needs to get it together and provide a dedicated connector on both the VHF and the GPS to enable the DSC functions. Then its a plug and play system.

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I think Larry has summed up the situation perfectly. The DSC concept is fine. But the hardware needs to be made more user-friendly. Not the red button--- that's about as user friendly as you can get. I can teach my dog to push the red button.

But connecting a VHS and a GPS/Plotter/etc can be a bit of a pain. When we hooked ours up we simply had the electronics dealer we buy all our stuff from make us up a cable. Furuno plug on one end but I still had to solder the red and yellow wires or whatever together because that's all that came out of the back of the radio. But if, as Larry suggests, they adapt a standard plug for radios and GPS units or plotters--- something basic along the lines of a USB connector---- and you simply buy the length of cable you need and plug the two units together, the whole thing becomes a snap.

Installing a GPS receiver in the radio itself like in a smart phone or iPad is a good idea but whether or not it can be used will depend on where the radio is mounted. So even if the industry goes toward putting a GPS chip in VHF radios I think there still needs to be a provision for connecting a remote antenna either directly or via a plotter or other navigation device.

Marin said:

Calling 911 for a marine emergency is about as pointless an exercise as I can think of.

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I wouldn't say 911 is pointless.

My six year old knows how to use the cell phone, as does my guest that has never been on a boat in his life.

If I call 911 on my cell phone, they have my name, street address, and GPS location, without me speaking a word. If the boat sinks and the DSC on VHF shorts out.... someone can still coordinate a rescue.

Again on the disclaimer: I'm not arguing against DSC -- hit the RED BUTTON and the same information is available to a person to coordinate the rescue.

I'm with you there larry.
Could be that there are to many GPS manufacturers. They all have propriatry systems.
But really it is just a couple of wires.


So everyone is going to hook up the RED BUTTON RIGHT?

SD

Save the local USCG station's number in your cell phone and call them directly should the need arise.

I'd use the red button as well! we have our MMSI number, GPS is hooked up... ready to go.

I saw this system in action at the USCG station under the Golden Gate bridge in SF a few years ago. Pretty neat! Sounds an alarm and prints out a chartlet with your position shown as well as the lat/lon, boat name, and all the information you have in your MMSI registration. Takes seconds.

20 plus years in USCG SAR...use the VHF first...then the cel if you can't get a radio response. Anything else is irresponsible if something bad happens trying to get help via the phone...as a secondary...no sweat.

In fact the USCG will switch you over if appropriate or you request to.

It would be interesting to know how many of the 23,000 rescue calls to the CG were true life or death emergencies where there was no time to use a cell phone because you were going under, versus calling because the battery was low and wouldn't start the engine as it was getting dark.

There are 2,880 members on this forum. Has anyone ever pushed the red button? Has anyone chose to use the VHF or cell who had an operational DSC? Why?

Great Laker said:

It would be interesting to know how many of the 23,000 rescue calls to the CG were true life or death emergencies where there was no time to use a cell phone because you were going under, versus calling because the battery was low and wouldn't start the engine as it was getting dark.

There are 2,880 members on this forum. Has anyone ever pushed the red button? Has anyone chose to use the VHF or cell who had an operational DSC? Why?

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When I was operations officer for the NJ Coastal region (1993-1996)...we "logged" about 3500 cases a year...out of those if 100 were life and death I would be suprised...now some may have developed into a bad situation but most were resolved because a simple radio call had good samaritans swarming all over the distress.

I think places like Alaska and more remote areas the percentage is much higher for serious distress...tourist places packed full of boats like the Eastern Seaboard from Boston to Mexico during the summer are chock-a-block full of inexperienced boaters that think if the stereo fails it's a MAYDAY.

To build on what psneeld said, almost all the "distress" calls we hear on the radio in the northern Puget Sound/southern BC waters are resolved by other boats responding to the call. (Sometimes the "other boat" is a commercial tow service.)

Most of the calls are out of fuel, engine loss of power for some reason, or aground. The fact the intial distress call and subsequent dialogue between the boater and the USCG or the Canadian Coast Guard are on open VHF channels means a whole lot of people know what's going on and a number of them are in a position to offer help and they do. These incidents almost always end with a final coast guard broadcast saying that the distressed boat is being assisted by another boat or boats and no further action is needed.

Very often the boats coming to assist--- and there are often several--- are communicatiing directly on the VHF with the distressed boat and the coast guard, and all involved parties can hear and respond to what is being said. Trying to do all this by phone would be a nightmare, I think.

I can only recall hearing and following two life-threatening emergencies in the past few years. One, a sailboat slammed into a rock and the wife was projected down the companionway into the main cabin and was severely injured in a time-critical way. The second was a boat fire that put the people on board into the water. Both instances were reported and dealt with on the VHF. In the first instance a BC ferry diverted from its run immediately to head for the sailboat and in both instances numerous other boats headed immediately to the distressed boats.

I believe the only reason the response from a BC ferry down to small open sportfish boats was so prompt was that everyone in the area heard what was happening and reacted the moment the distressed boat went on the air.

I was working on my boat one day in early March a year or two ago. We are on Lake Union. I watched a sailboat sink out on the lake. I could see people in the water on the opposite side of the lake. I did not even think of using my cell phone. I radioed the Coast Guard. Both the Seattle Police boat and a floatplane responded. The floatplane was the first to arrive with the police boat immediately after. Both were assisting the people in the water within three minutes of my radio call. I suspect a cell phone call to 911 would not have produced such immediate assistance.

Pineapple Girl said:

Save the local USCG station's number in your cell phone and call them directly should the need arise.

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Bingo!

or *CG

Nothing is stopping you from using your VHF for Mayday. You can post the instructions next to it. There is even a sticker. All the nearby boaters will hear it. Unless they're on their cell phones.