Marine Specific versus Regular Appliances

Hi,
Im starting to think about redoing my galley stove, adding a dishwasher and replacing the laundry machine. As I've been looking at the options it seems most new larger boats are going with home units not marine specific although not at a cost savings often so curious if there is another reason.

Specifically I think I'm locked on a Bosch or Miele dishwasher and there aren't marine versions that I know of.

For Range why use a princess or force 10 when I could put in a 24" blue star LPG range? Lots more power, better oven, etc but I might be missing something?

Lastly on the washer dryer it seams like Splendide makes the marine one but LG also makes one which does things like steam, etc for a few hundred bucks more. The only disadvantage I see is I don't think the LG one is vented..

Would love thoughts from those who have looked at this while doing upgrades.

Thanks
Arthur

There are specific features that some marine appliances have that make them suitable for boats. For example (and I think you confused the venting above). The Splendide has a much different drying scheme that condenses the vented gasses so they can be discharged to the living area.

Some appliances have stainless steel housings whereas their non marine equivalent doesn't. Others like refrigerators use very efficient compressors compared to even Energy Star non marine appliances.
You have to look at each one individually and decided what you need.


David

Got it, I think Splendide makes both as I have a Splendide vented right now but its old, the LG uses the condensing drying model as you mention above. Both have stainless drums, etc.
On the fridges I totally agree plus DC power is important so using marine grade ones. Dishwasher the Bosch has a stainless tub and hardware so not sure what else to look for.

On the range im most curious, Blue Star is a very high end manufacturer and full stainless in the parts that matter, slightly nervous however of the BTU ability and limited hood options in a boat (21K burner versus 10K on most high end marine stoves).

AC
Have you considered an induction cooktop? If I had the space I'd go with an induction cook top, electric oven and convection microwave. BTW, we have a conventional Bosch washer and vented to outside dryer. If you've the room, separate units are a nice feature vs the combo units.

The higher BTU stove would be fine, provided you can power it. The lower BTU output on the marine electric stoves would mean less power draw, so more suitable for boats that don't have huge generators, etc.

Isn't the LPG power output just a factor of propane usage and might need line upgrades but shouldn't impact 120v power usage?
Id like to stay away from electric as I don't want to run the genset that often but I do like induction, however you just can't beat a gas stove

Huge agreement on separate washer/dryer units, but I just don't have space without significant relocation, would be a different story if I lived aboard.

If it's a propane stove, yeah, the electric power concern is a non-issue.

AC
Dependent upon how you wire your induction cooktop, they can run off an inverter quite easily. When cruising our induction cooktop and convection microwave work fine without genset. Save the big oven for when on shore power or genset running.

We have regular appliances on ours and have grown to like it very much. I did have a marine electrician on board yesterday chasing down the cause for tripping updated dock power. The culprit was a neutral-to-ground jumper on the dryer, he cut it out and now we don't trip updated dock power. Just a thought.

As a thing on electric stoves and needing to run the generator, I've never found my galley being all electric to be a downside. If I'm away from shore power I'm going to need to run the generator for a bit once or twice a day to make hot water for showers, etc. anyway.

So needing to run the generator to make food isn't a problem, as the water heating and other tasks just happen during cooking time. I do tend to plan for cold lunches when away from shore power though, as that keeps it down to 2 generator runs per day (no inverter on my boat and no engine hot water loop either).

Putting in a boiler and hydraunic heat this winter so will have little need to run the gen hence sticking with gas I think.

My current boat came with home appliances, most 20 years old. Electric stove, dishwasher, dd refer, water heater, washer/dryer. I replaced the stove with diesel, but use induction hot plates in warm weather. The only marine issue I could see was the tendency to rust where the paint was scratched. The refer is still going near 30 years old and I'll replace with a ss version. I had to replace the heating elements in the water heater, but the diesel stove keeps it hot when running.

I have an inverter and bigger battery bank. I only run a generator about a hour a day at anchor and have an alternator that keeps up the inverter bank when running the mains.

I don’t see any issues with using a household dishwasher but check to see if the neutral is connected to ground inside the appliance.

I think that there may be an issue using the household gas stove. I would check with your insurance company and see if they have a problem since it isn’t a marine unit. Not sure if the ABYC recommendations allow for that or not.

Just keep in mind that some appliances require 220/240 volts AC. Some of the combo household laundry units require 220/240v. Some induction cook tops require 220/240v. All of the standard household electric stove tops I have seen require 220/240v. Anyway, my point is to check the voltage and watts/amperage to be sure your boat's electrical system can power them without straining to much.

I think the only reason to get a “marine” appliance is if you have to have it. Either because you need it to be 12V, or you have a sail boat and need a gimbaled stove, or you have space constraints. I think anything below about 50’ probably has space constraints of some sort, but maybe not.

I put a home dishwasher into my last boat: A Frigidaire FFBD1821MS.

I cant say I know how well it lasted. I did it only 4 months before deciding to sell the boat and the new owner's Craig's Listed it. They were sailboaters graduating to a trawler and seemed offended a boat had a dishwasher. They left the hole in the cabinetry and pushed things into it.

I didnt have the heart to tell them I mostly used it as a cabinet -- that had slide out drawers that would keep the wine glasses, silverware, &c secure and accessible underway. Only used it to wash things rarely, after big gatherings.

twistedtree said:

I think the only reason to get a “marine” appliance is if you have to have it. Either because you need it to be 12V, or you have a sail boat and need a gimbaled stove, or you have space constraints. I think anything below about 50’ probably has space constraints of some sort, but maybe not.

Click to expand...

Thats my thought as well.

“marine” used to be 12 volts for things like fridges. Now days a well found boat probably has a high reliability, high capacity sine wave inverter, so 12 volt capability is not as important as it once was.

Then there is size. A lot of boats are size contrained, and have cabinets built to fit marine/rv referigerators. If size is not an issue there is little reason not to use home appliances.

On a gas range a marine burner will be different from the house range.

It should require a Push to turn on the burner so a passing rear end wont turn the burner on.

Also the burner should have adjustable Low setting , to be sure a puff down a hatch wont blow out the flame.

You cant spray them with sea water , but some modern RV units make great boat stoves , and have pizio click lighters.

I replaced my boat /RV refrigerator with an apartment unit. Results exceeded expectations. Doubt you will find a stock (as opposed to custom built) marine refrigerator that is as efficient, feature rich and as reasonably priced as the home units. As for electrical power, it's hard to imagine a modern boat without an inverter of combination unit with charger and load tranfer relay. For the few that don't have one, a quality pure sine wave inverter to run a domestic refrigerator starts at only $600. Here's the thread on my conversation.

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s31/my-new-apartment-refrigerator-41392.html

Ted

When I upgrade my galley I am planning to replace my three burner Force 10 with a consumer 24" four burner range and convection oven. I'm interested to see if anyone thinks this is a bad idea. The washer/dryer that I have in my boat looks to be an original apartment model from 1988 and is still running.


Richard

We have Viking appliances on Seafarer. Convection-Microwave, Cooktop and Warming Oven. Our refrigeration system is a built in marine system.

ksanders said:

Thats my thought as well.

“marine” used to be 12 volts for things like fridges. Now days a well found boat probably has a high reliability, high capacity sine wave inverter, so 12 volt capability is not as important as it once was.

Then there is size. A lot of boats are size contrained, and have cabinets built to fit marine/rv referigerators. If size is not an issue there is little reason not to use home appliances.

Click to expand...

And mine.
I'll only add that as for the washer dryer, I wouldn't have anything that was not truly vented to the outside.
And yes, I'd stick with gas also for the stove. Almost all gas ranges will have optional nozzles for use with propane instead of LPG. (Propane has a somewhat lower heat content).

Using a domestic propane cooktops should be fine, as most modern ones will have a flame-out cutout.

But propane ovens can be a PITA. They usually have a pilot light, which obviously goes out when you turn on the solenoid cutout that is, or should be, installed at the cylinder. Then, when you turn on the solenoid for using the cooktop you need to re-light the oven pilot light or else within a few minutes there will be sufficient propane leaking out of the oven for the safety alarm to sound.

Greetings,
Mr. Wx. You may have meant to say "...for use with propane instead of LNG. (Propane has a somewhat lower heat content). " If so, propane delivers more BTU's per gallon/cubic foot than LNG. If not, I apologize.


You are correct, the nozzles ARE different.

I have an all electric boat (gas scares me - it's a fire and explosion thing).

All appliances including trash compacter, dishwasher, washer and dryer, refrigerator, oven, microwave, grill and stove top (induction) are non marine units all highly rated by Consumer Reports.

Looked into Miele and Bosch and they were double the price of a number of highly rated units by Consumer Reports.

All in all very happy with reliability and serviceability of highly rated appliances available at Sears, Best Buy, etc.

Induction the way to go

Just this week I replaced the 24" drop-in electric resistance cooktop with an induction unit the same size. It's amazing! Our old cooktop used 240v and so does the the induction, which I ordered from Amazon. The difference in speed is quite dramatic, the old unit would take about 5 minutes to boil a kettle for tea, whereas the induction has it done in less than 1.

My wife wanted an oven so I swapped out the conventional microwave for a combination microwave/convection oven at the same time.

We also have a conventional chest freezer (Sears) and under cabinet refrigerators

Regular Appliances, etc.

I, long ago, replaced my Princess 3 burner & oven with smooth top 3 burner, did away with the oven and replaced it with drawers. Use convection microwave for oven stuff. Additionally, I replaced cold plate fridge boxes with counter depth fridge/freezer. Finally, the washer dryers are Whirlpool and have been on the boat originally (still work great)….'89. Not like the stuff 'built' today. I've been very pleased...more importantly, my wife is.

If you decide to go with propane remember that it is heavier than air and will fill wherever the tank is stored if it leaks. There is also a requirement for a master shutoff valve IIRC to be able to pass insurance survey. Finally marinas that have exchange tanks are few and far between so you will need to drive somewhere to get more. We have a propane BBQ in our cockpit, but there is sufficient ventilation as well as large scuppers to allow leaking gas to readily go overboard. We also have a composite tank to keep from rust staining the deck from salt corrosion. Finally burning propane releases a lot of water into air and fighting humidity and mold is a constant battle on a boat, why add to your troubles?

Do not waste your money on a non-vented dryer, I would also try to avoid the combination units if you have the space for separates. We have a Kenmore stacked apartment sized set with a vented dryer and it works great. We also have a Bosch induction cooktop and home type refrigerator with drawer freezer.

Generator use is not a big issue since it needs to get run a few hours a day to recharge the inverter batteries, might as well do that when cooking and do your laundry at the same time. If you have air conditioning you will be running the generator for that for weeks on end anyway.

Count us in on the home stuff and electric. Woodland Hills makes a good point about generator use.



Not that we are adverse to a little propane here and there...